View unanswered posts | View active topics It is currently July 29th, 2014, 12:52 pm



Reply to topic  [ 81 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next
 Possibilities of trading the 1st round pick 
Author Message
Commissioner of the NFL – Roger Goodell
User avatar

Joined: August 7th, 2004, 4:47 am
Posts: 10943
Location: Sterling Heights, MI
Post 
wjb21ndtown wrote:
I'm not that worried about being stuck at #4. At 4 I think we'd be able to trade back a few spots for someone that is looking for Berry/Spiller/Bradford, and take Mays/Morgan 6-10ish. IMO it is easier to trade out of #4 than it is #1/2, especially in this market (no top 1-2 players like the Bush/Mario Williams draft).

I just took that quote from the McCoy thread because I wanted to respond, but didn't want to get that thread derailed in the process.

I completely agree that teams don't want to trade up to the top three picks because of the contract and the compensation that they would have to give the other team. But, fourth overall is entirely possible. Just last year, the Jets traded up to #5 with the Browns to get a QB, and it's realistic to think that something like it could happen again.

Looking at the current draft order, Cleveland @1, St. Louis @2, Washington @5, Oakland @6, Buffalo @9, Denver @10, and San Francisco @11 could all be in the market for a QB. Let's suppose that Clausen, Bradford, and Locker are considered the "elite" QBs of the draft by most teams. I know that's debateable, but bear with me here. If the Browns and Rams opt for QBs with the first two picks, a team drafting behind the Redskins may panic and attempt to get ahead of them to secure their QB. I'd make that deal with any of the teams I mentioned for just their 1st and 2nd round picks.

_________________
Image


December 4th, 2009, 4:31 pm
Profile
Veteran General Manager
User avatar

Joined: May 7th, 2005, 3:25 pm
Posts: 7249
Location: Earth/Sagittarius Dwarf Galaxy
Post 
slybri19 wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
I'm not that worried about being stuck at #4. At 4 I think we'd be able to trade back a few spots for someone that is looking for Berry/Spiller/Bradford, and take Mays/Morgan 6-10ish. IMO it is easier to trade out of #4 than it is #1/2, especially in this market (no top 1-2 players like the Bush/Mario Williams draft).

I just took that quote from the McCoy thread because I wanted to respond, but didn't want to get that thread derailed in the process.

I completely agree that teams don't want to trade up to the top three picks because of the contract and the compensation that they would have to give the other team. But, fourth overall is entirely possible. Just last year, the Jets traded up to #5 with the Browns to get a QB, and it's realistic to think that something like it could happen again.

Looking at the current draft order, Cleveland @1, St. Louis @2, Washington @5, Oakland @6, Buffalo @9, Denver @10, and San Francisco @11 could all be in the market for a QB. Let's suppose that Clausen, Bradford, and Locker are considered the "elite" QBs of the draft by most teams. I know that's debateable, but bear with me here. If the Browns and Rams opt for QBs with the first two picks, a team drafting behind the Redskins may panic and attempt to get ahead of them to secure their QB. I'd make that deal with any of the teams I mentioned for just their 1st and 2nd round picks.


Something else to consider. The closer we get to Free Agency without a new CBA, the more likely next year will be uncapped. I suspect, the NFL will have to set a deadline for a CBA near the end of the regular season so teams will know how to budget for Free Agency and the draft. In other words, I think next year will be uncapped.

Therefore, I think teams, especially those looking for a QB, will be more willing than ever to trade up and get their guy so they can front load the contract.


December 5th, 2009, 7:10 pm
Profile
Commissioner of the NFL – Roger Goodell
User avatar

Joined: August 7th, 2004, 4:47 am
Posts: 10943
Location: Sterling Heights, MI
Post 
BillySims, the deadline for a new CBA to prevent an uncapped year is the start of the New League Year, which is around March 1st. If one isn't agreed upon before then, they can always push back the date like they did a couple of times in 2006. In the end, I believe a new agreement will be reached and 2010 will have a salary cap.

Also, Goodell said several months ago that the NFL will likely keep the rookie pool in place for 2010 if there isn't a new CBA. This means that teams won't be able to frontload rookie contracts. Stafford was limited to $3.1M this year and the next #1 overall will probably get $3.2M in his first season. There will be no financial incentive to trade up this year.

_________________
Image


December 6th, 2009, 1:52 am
Profile
Veteran General Manager
User avatar

Joined: May 7th, 2005, 3:25 pm
Posts: 7249
Location: Earth/Sagittarius Dwarf Galaxy
Post 
slybri19 wrote:
BillySims, the deadline for a new CBA to prevent an uncapped year is the start of the New League Year, which is around March 1st. If one isn't agreed upon before then, they can always push back the date like they did a couple of times in 2006. In the end, I believe a new agreement will be reached and 2010 will have a salary cap.

Also, Goodell said several months ago that the NFL will likely keep the rookie pool in place for 2010 if there isn't a new CBA. This means that teams won't be able to frontload rookie contracts. Stafford was limited to $3.1M this year and the next #1 overall will probably get $3.2M in his first season. There will be no financial incentive to trade up this year.


There is more to compensation than just Salary. You know that Sly.
Sure, they may only be able to give them a $3.2 million salary.

But, rather than signing bonus, they can give them about $30Million as a report on time bonus. Or an attend every workout and be in camp on time bonus. That would be a one time bonus that is paid lump sum and wouldn't be pro-rated out over the contract.

That is what I mean by front loading the contract. And that CANbe done.


December 6th, 2009, 5:55 am
Profile
5th Round Pick - Traded
User avatar

Joined: January 11th, 2005, 11:35 pm
Posts: 1079
Post 
Honestly I think the Lions are in the perfect position to draft the player they need. Either Suh or McCoy should be there for the taking. I don't see how the Lions can afford to pass on a defensive linemen.

Last year the Lions had extra draft picks and came away with Bradon Pettigrew and Derrick Williams. Honestly a couple picks that are hardly worth passing on a DT who could bring to the table what Kevin Williams or Albert Haynesworth brings.

_________________
The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.


December 6th, 2009, 10:13 am
Profile
Commissioner of the NFL – Roger Goodell
User avatar

Joined: August 7th, 2004, 4:47 am
Posts: 10943
Location: Sterling Heights, MI
Post 
BillySims, you obviously don't understand how the rookie pool works. That $3.2M figure represents that player's total cap charge in his first season and there really isn't any way to get around it. Well, there is, but it's unlikely to ever happen.

There are generally three different ways to structure the contract in the first year. The $3.2M could be given as a base salary. This is what the Lions did with Stafford. The most common way is to give the player the minimum salary ($320K next year) and the remaining $2.88M in the form of a roster bonus which completely counts against that season's cap. The third way, which isn't used as often as it once was, is to give the player the minimum base salary ($320K) and a signing bonus which is prorated at $2.88M per year. In this case, the bonus would be $14.4M for a 5 year contract or $17.28M on a 6 year deal.

_________________
Image


December 6th, 2009, 12:23 pm
Profile
Team MVP
User avatar

Joined: February 20th, 2007, 10:51 pm
Posts: 3307
Location: Saginaw, MI
Post 
njroar wrote:
I think its a good year to trade down. Depending on where we end up (could be anywhere from 9-20 depending on how we do after the bye). Question is, do they stockpile picks and hope they can be geniuses again in the draft, or do they take players along with lesser picks to fill needs.

Carolina immediately jumps to mind, because they franchised Peppers and can again, they've got both good RB's, and they have Steve Smith. If Fox is fired, do they try to rebuild? Imagine Smith paired with CJ? Imagine a Deangelo Williams or Jonathon Stewart paired with Kevin Smith. We'd have to get something in return since they don't have a first. And I wouldn't want to give up any picks in return.

It might be a good chance to slide down, pick up a later pick and fill a need at LT or CB with a young veteran talent.

I'll tell you one thing... I'm anxious to see what happens before tuesday as far as trades, and I'll definitely be waiting after the season to see how the draft plays out. We have to see if this year was just a fluke, or if we really have a smart scouting system that was just ignored for years by Millen.


I can now look back on this post and comment because i couldnt at the time (too early in season).

But now..

I would absolutely LOVE to have Steve Smith as part of our recieving core. We all thought the pairing Roy Williams w/ CJ would be unstoppable too, but that obviously didnt work. But thats because Roy Williams is, well, Roy Williams. Steve Smith is much superior to Williams. Plus, we really need another reciever. I just would hope Smith wouldnt bring some sort of "cancer" to the team.

As for Williams/Stewart paired with Smith. Im not very high on Smith, so id say, YES to DeAngelo Williams, but I dont think pairing him with Smith would be any better.

If we can move down a few spots and land Okung,Berry,Mays, or Morgan, AND land a 2nd or next years first, id DEFINETLY take it.

_________________
April 22nd, 2010 @ 7:44p.m. "The Detroit Lions select...Ndamukong Suh". Those are some beautiful words.


Lionbacker2 Fantasy Champion 2011


December 9th, 2009, 8:23 pm
Profile
Varsity Benchwarmer

Joined: July 23rd, 2009, 3:30 pm
Posts: 237
Post 
if we move down i like haden morgen mays and berry


December 9th, 2009, 11:14 pm
Profile
NFL Team Captain

Joined: January 27th, 2005, 9:12 pm
Posts: 1610
Location: Midland, MI
Post 
Anybody know a 40 time for Mays?


December 10th, 2009, 7:40 am
Profile
Team MVP
User avatar

Joined: February 20th, 2007, 10:51 pm
Posts: 3307
Location: Saginaw, MI
Post 
jomo269 wrote:
Anybody know a 40 time for Mays?


I was wondering the same because I've heard even as high as in the 4.2 range, and also around the 4.4's. Both are fast, but im somewhat doubting the 4.2. We'll see at the combine if hes there.

_________________
April 22nd, 2010 @ 7:44p.m. "The Detroit Lions select...Ndamukong Suh". Those are some beautiful words.


Lionbacker2 Fantasy Champion 2011


December 10th, 2009, 11:26 am
Profile
Varsity Benchwarmer

Joined: July 23rd, 2009, 3:30 pm
Posts: 237
Post 
i think im one of the few people here that would love to see mays a ss on our team with that said he has the highest bust potential in this draft if u ask me


December 10th, 2009, 12:36 pm
Profile
Team MVP
User avatar

Joined: February 20th, 2007, 10:51 pm
Posts: 3307
Location: Saginaw, MI
Post 
dmudd wrote:
i think im one of the few people here that would love to see mays a ss on our team with that said he has the highest bust potential in this draft if u ask me


I agree with you as far as potential for bust. Id love to have him as our SS too but from all im hearing about how hes horrible in coverage and isnt a playmaker, i just dont know if i wanna take a chance. They say hes a clone to safety Roy Williams.

Id much prefer Berry.

I know this is a "Trade Down" thread, but if we stay at 4 and end up not trading down, and CANT get Suh, Id take Berry at 4. I dont see anyone other than Suh and Berry thats worth a top 5 pick. I just have a bad feeling also that if we do trade down to, lets say 7, I dont think we can get Berry.

_________________
April 22nd, 2010 @ 7:44p.m. "The Detroit Lions select...Ndamukong Suh". Those are some beautiful words.


Lionbacker2 Fantasy Champion 2011


December 10th, 2009, 12:51 pm
Profile
NFL Team Captain

Joined: January 27th, 2005, 9:12 pm
Posts: 1610
Location: Midland, MI
Post 
dmudd, your not alone. As big as Mays is and even with 4.4 speed he would a demon in our D backfield.

Mays and Delmas would lockup our safety positions for years and scare the crap out of most of the NFL recievers that are asked to go over the middle 8)


December 10th, 2009, 1:59 pm
Profile
Color Commentator - John Madden
User avatar

Joined: January 19th, 2007, 3:21 am
Posts: 1919
Location: A2
Post 
I don't know about taking a safety that high. If he becomes Ed Reed then sure, but we'd be doing ourselves a disservice by not addressing our most glaring needs by taking a safety which has become kind of a "sexy" pick in the last few years.

There are too many holes to draft a safety when we've already got one good safety in Delmas. It has been a revolving door at the other safety position opposite Delmas this year because of injury so it's hard gauge what we really have there. Ko Simpson was playing ok, Bullocks will be back, hell, even Marquand Manuel played some good football (ok, decent).

Trading down is most definitely my first choice for the Lions this year. Assuming their position stays the same there really isn't a player at a position of need in this draft that would provide the type of value and be worth the investment. Here is a list of the players drafted from 4-10 this year and the amount of their salaries:

4. Seattle - LB, Aaron Curry, Wake Forest - Signed (6-years, $60M; $34M guaranteed)
5. NY Jets (fr. CLE) - QB, Mark Sanchez, USC - Signed (5-years; $50.5M real/$60M max; $28M guaranteed)
6. Cincinnati - OT, Andre Smith, Alabama - Signed (4-years, $26M; $21M guaranteed)
7. Oakland - WR, Darrius Heyward-Bey, Maryland - Signed (5-years, $38.25M real/$54M max; $23.5M guaranteed)
8. Jacksonville - OT, Eugene Monroe, Virginia - Signed (5-years, $35.4M; $19.2M guaranteed)
9. Green Bay - DT, B.J. Raji, Boston College - Signed (5-years, $28.5M; $17.7M guaranteed)
10. San Francisco - WR, Michael Crabtree, Texas Tech - Signed (6-years, $32M; $17M guaranteed)

If we don't trade down we're looking at about $35 million guaranteed. If we do we can maybe get that under $20 which is much more manageable. The offensive and defensive lines need to be addressed much more desperately then the second safety spot.

Suh won't be there at 4. If he is, you run your draft card up the second after the team at #3 announces their selection. Gerald McCoy is the only other option. Okung is viewed as the top tackle before the combine but I'm not totally sold on taking him at 4. Those are the options that I see in front of the Lions. They need one of those 3 guys but I can't see Suh dropping to them but I don't want to overpay for McCoy. Okung, the jury is still out on.

_________________
Forward down the field!


December 10th, 2009, 3:25 pm
Profile
Team MVP
User avatar

Joined: February 20th, 2007, 10:51 pm
Posts: 3307
Location: Saginaw, MI
Post 
Wayne Fontes -

I definetly see your point about our offensive and defensive lines being the most glaring needs.

But like you also said, other than Suh, is there anyone worth taking that high?

IF we stay at 4, in my opinion, Berry is the only player other than Suh worth taking that high. The kind of player Berry is, I just cant help but think of him/Delmas in our secondary. If defensive players run deep in this draft class like they say they are going to, especially D-lineman, we can always find a player in the second round.

Im 99% all for taking d-lineman, but if Suh is gone and we're still at #4, I wouldnt pass on Berry.

He's very fast, can tackle very well, is good against the run and pass, is a turnover machine...etc. Im in.

_________________
April 22nd, 2010 @ 7:44p.m. "The Detroit Lions select...Ndamukong Suh". Those are some beautiful words.


Lionbacker2 Fantasy Champion 2011


December 10th, 2009, 4:07 pm
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic   [ 81 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.
Designed by STSoftware.