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 Pirates Kill Four Aboard Yact 
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Post Pirates Kill Four Aboard Yact
I'm surprised this wasn't already posted:

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Four Americans aboard a yacht hijacked by Somali pirates have been killed, Fox News has confirmed.

U.S. forces responded to gunfire aboard the yacht Quest at approximately 1 a.m. Tuesday, but discovered all four hostages had been shot by their captors. Despite attempts to save their lives, all four hostages died of their wounds.

“We express our deepest condolences for the innocent lives callously lost aboard the Quest,” said Gen. James N. Mattis, U.S. Central Command Commander in a news release.

Two pirates died during the confrontation and U.S. forces found the remains of two other pirates already dead aboard the vessel. Thirteen pirates were captured and detained, along with two already in custody. A total of 19 pirates were involved in the hijacking.

The yacht Quest was hijacked on Friday off the coast of Oman and U.S. forces had been closely monitoring the vessel.




When I first heard this story I initially thought that these people were nuts for boating in this area. After reading the story that they were hundreds of miles off shore, I no longer think that they were in the wrong, and I think that we as a nation should do something about protecting our civilians, our civilians property, our cargo, and cargo with U.S. interests. These people weren't in "water off the coast of Somalia," they were in damn OPEN WATER hundreds of miles from shore. To think these people are in the wrong is to think that no one has any business in boating anywhere off of the East coast of Africa, for fear of a few lunatics with AK47's, which is ridiculous!

Where can you sign up for employment to protect ships sailing in Somalia? I'd love to do it. For $100k I'd shoot anyone and everyone that tried to rob, steal, kill or otherwise maim anyone on board of the vessel I was protecting, and I'd feel damn good about it. If the U.S. wants to do something about it, they should offer the service for free through their military. Allow a military sniper with rifle and close combat weapon to board the yacht or ship and protect the damn thing. Drop him off at the next port, and fly him back to the navy vessel.


February 23rd, 2011, 11:33 pm
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Post Re: Pirates Kill Four Aboard Yact
wjb21ndtown wrote:
Where can you sign up for employment to protect ships sailing in Somalia? I'd love to do it. For $100k I'd shoot anyone and everyone that tried to rob, steal, kill or otherwise maim anyone on board of the vessel I was protecting, and I'd feel damn good about it. If the U.S. wants to do something about it, they should offer the service for free through their military. Allow a military sniper with rifle and close combat weapon to board the yacht or ship and protect the damn thing. Drop him off at the next port, and fly him back to the navy vessel.

Sounds like an entrepreneurial opportunity! Let us know where we can sign up! 8)

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February 24th, 2011, 9:11 am
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Post Re: Pirates Kill Four Aboard Yact
You might still think they were nuts, they were missionaries...

They were not on Somolian waters at all.

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February 24th, 2011, 10:18 am
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Post Re: Pirates Kill Four Aboard Yact
Here is the problem that we are seeing by many world nations.

France, and the Netherlands have all captured "pirates," and either thrown their weapons overboard and let the men go, or did nothing because they had throw their weapons over board.

The U.S. has even done this.

Here's my U.N. resolution: Any boat operating in waters off of this country that can not SUBSTANTIALLY prove that it is conducting peaceful transit of said waters, either for fishing or normal maritime travel, will be considered a TARGET and authorized COMPLETE AND FULL USE of lethal aggression.

subtext a: fishing vessels: will be required to show ALL GEAR used for fishing in this area. Examples: (catch of the day, nets, buoys, fishing gear). Cargo, show Cargo Manifest with Shipping Orders, departing here, going to there. Cargo must match documentation.

Subtext b: All vessels captured by "pirates" will be boarded by Special Forces at an appropriate time and all "pirates" will be dispatched and buried at sea.


The current procedure of paying ransoms is fueling this crisis. If countries would deal ruthlessly with the Pirates instead of trying to wetnurse them, we'd have the problem solved. The difficulty is, that there is such a lack of LEADERSHIP in this world, especially within our own country. Speak softly and carry a big stick!

Israel proved this method works in the 70's, when they stormed a passenger plane in Idi Amin's back yard and killed all the hijackers. They haven't been hijacked since! They also were smart and increased their airport security too, but that's a precaution.

till we do that, we'll continue to pay. Outside of this incident with the yacht, the U.S. hadn't had too many troubles because of the dead pirates from last time. I say we re-assign Blackwater, they wouldn't mind, I'm sure!!!

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February 24th, 2011, 10:41 am
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Post Re: Pirates Kill Four Aboard Yact
I say that we just tell all American vessels to carry weapons. If the ports they are headed to don't like it, tough clams. The weapons will stay on board the ship, and will only be taken from the lockers if the members of the boat feel threatened. Most sailors have had some military experience, and even if they haven't, they can spend some time shooting in the open waters at whatever, just for target practice.

Most of the time the pirates use a fast running raft, typically made of Kevlar, to get to the vessel in question, then throw a grappling hook over the rails to climb up. Couple of guns, a few shots on their approach....BOOM, done. If the grappling hook goes over the edge, simply slip the gun over the side rail and start firing away. Better yet, have some grenades on board and pop a couple of those into the raft.

The fact that the companies and our government allow other countries to say "you can have weapons on board your boats when you dock" is ludicrous. I understand we're in their territory, but come on, we're there to trade, not to hold up a bank. If they don't like it, start charging as much for a bushel of wheat as some of these place want for a barrel of oil. That ought to shut them up.

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February 24th, 2011, 5:11 pm
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Post Re: Pirates Kill Four Aboard Yact
Unfortunately, there are many problems involved with arming merchant vessels. These include the costs of training the sailors properly, the increase in insurance premiums for doing so, the fact that many countries won't allow non-military armed ships into their ports, the increased danger to the sailors for becoming involved in an armed conflict with pirates, the threat of gunfire causing an explosion on vessels transporting oil or other hazardous material, etc. The UN Law of the Sea only allowing small arms and restricting their use doesn't help much either.

With that said, something needs to be done about the Somali pirates. The US and several other countries routinely patrol the region, but it's a big sea and the pirates keep operating further and further offshore. It's simply impossible to protect every merchant vessel in the area.

Personally, I like what the Russians did to 10 captured pirates in May of last year. Instead of bringing them to Russia or some other country for trial, which would cost a considerable amount of money, they let them go. Unfortunately for the pirates, they let them go in an inflatable raft without food, fresh water, or navigational equipment about 300 miles from shore. Needless to say, those 10 pirates were never heard from again.

If wjb wants to start the Lionbacker Merchant Marine Protection Force, I'm all in, as long as I get to man the .50 cal. :D

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February 24th, 2011, 9:40 pm
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Post Re: Pirates Kill Four Aboard Yact
With the pirates routinely firing RPGs at the ships, regardless of cargo, I don't think we would have to be too concerned about small arms fire setting off an explosion due to the vessel carrying light crude oil. Crude oil doesn't create the vapors like gasoline does. Still, I agree it can be a dangerous situation. As for the sailors needing to be trained, that wouldn't take all that much time. I'm sorry, but we are talking about some moron pirates here, not a bunch of rocket scientists. I think that if they encounter a ship that is firing on them, they tuck tail and run rather than try to fight it out with them. Firing from a low vantage point up at the sailors, they'd be at an extreme disadvantage and get picked off quite easily. The entire basis of their success thus far has been that they are attacking what they KNOW are unarmed vessels. Criminals are cowards, and will almost always back down when the pickings aren't as easy as they want.

You go ahead and man the .50 cal......I want to capture them and beat them to death over the course of several days....and send a live feed to their buddies on shore to watch. Hehehehehehe.

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February 24th, 2011, 10:56 pm
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Post Re: Pirates Kill Four Aboard Yact
M2K, I agree with the points that you made, but I was just echoing the main arguments against arming civilian ships. The key component though is the increased insurance costs of doing so because of all those other reasons. Some people have even come out and said that it's cheaper to pay the ransom than to pay the costs associated with arming the ships. That's probably true once you consider that less than 1% of vessels navigating those waters get attacked.

But, I'd be more than happy to see the navies of the world adopt a zero tolerance policy against piracy. if you see them, blow them out of the water and make them shark food. Sooner or later, you're gonna run out of pirates or those remaining will decide that it's simply not worth it.

And if you're going to send out a live feed of yourself karate kicking pirates into a bloody pulp, could you atleast turn the camera my way on occasion when I make their heads explode like a watermelon with a hit from the .50 cal? That would be much appreciated. :idea:

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February 25th, 2011, 12:48 am
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Post Re: Pirates Kill Four Aboard Yact
Which is cheaper? Ransoms or training?

I fully think that we need to be manning these ships with the appropriately trained people.

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February 25th, 2011, 10:29 am
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Post Re: Pirates Kill Four Aboard Yact
I higly doubt 4 missionaries are going to take body guards and carry ozzies with them.

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February 25th, 2011, 10:59 am
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Post Re: Pirates Kill Four Aboard Yact
slybri19 wrote:
If wjb wants to start the Lionbacker Merchant Marine Protection Force, I'm all in, as long as I get to man the .50 cal. :D



Sly gets the "Ma Deuce"!


It's one thing to allow American boats to carry guns (they technically can in the open seas, I think... a vessel traveling in the open seas operates under the rule of law of the flag the vessel flies. If you can have a gun on a boat in America, you should be able to have a gun on a boat anywhere in the open seas. Going into port is another problem.

What I propose is this:
Instead of allowing an untrained person to carry a gun and force that untrained person into the uncomfortable position of protecting themselves (remember, these are largely rich, old people), we should provide a military or quasi military person to board the vessel (at their request) free to the boat (paid for by the U.S. Govt.), and have that person have the only gun and weapon aboard, and have that trained person protect the boat.

It would seem to me that this problem would go away in a hurry. I wanted to sign up to protect freighters when they were getting hi-jacked for their cargo (oil mainly). I don't know why the govt. doesn't do this. For a relatively inexpensive cost (around $100,000,000) the problem would be eradicated, along with the pirates.


February 25th, 2011, 11:57 am
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Post Re: Pirates Kill Four Aboard Yact
Wjb,

Why have the government pay for it when, as you said, these are generally wealthy people. If they are trying to passage a notorious stretch of water, allow them access to a "trip charge" security team. Take a group of former Navy Seals or Special Ops contractors who would be willing to work for a "trip charge.

This allows Mr. and Mrs. Moneybags to bring in the security detail who will work as "crew" aboard the vessel for the length of the voyage through troubled waters. Then once safe passage has been secured and piracy threats are no longer imminent, the security detail, departs and all is well.

Or if we were to do as you said, any U.S. flagged boats could request a "Security Detail" from the local U.S. Embassy, who would then dispatch Marines or Spec. Ops to the vessel for the trip through troubled waters.

With either scenario, you have both bases covered. Government paid, or privately paid, both viable options, neither of them permenant.

Another form of "JOB STIMULUS" is for companies that are currently making Non-lethal protection to open up a private sector market. For instance, boarding lights, as the pirates approach a boat, a proximity sensor could set off onboard security lights which would produce a very blinding beacon of light to envolpe the "yacht." Thus blinding the "pirates" and not giving them people to shoot at. The government currently has microwave beams, and sound decible beams that are in use, the Japanese are using them around Antarctica, on their shipping vessels. The sound beams anyway.

I'm not a big fan of catch and release, except like the Russian version, but I'd rather be a little more merciful and put one to the head and two to the chest. Or bring back walking the plank! A pirate's fate for a pirates work!

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February 25th, 2011, 12:35 pm
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Post Re: Pirates Kill Four Aboard Yact
Why have the govt. pay for it?

1) There is a govt. interest in it (National Security)
2) People are short sighted and some won't use it
3) We need everyone using it for it to truly be effective
4) The govt. has to coordinate it/run the program. Because of that it will likely be wildly expensive. They over-inflate everything to the point of exhaustion.
5) Because it is relatively inexpensive, or even "cheap"

My proposed program would cost LESS than what we're currently spending, and it allows the govt. to use the citizen's boat. The govt. would effectively be using the citizen's boat to patrol the water. The program would SAVE the govt. money, not cost them money. For that I say it should be provided as a "free" service.


February 25th, 2011, 2:16 pm
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Post Re: Pirates Kill Four Aboard Yact
steensn wrote:
I higly doubt 4 missionaries are going to take body guards and carry ozzies with them.


I'd be scared of Ozzie too!

Now an Uzi on the other hand...meh, they won't hit you from 100 yards.

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February 25th, 2011, 2:47 pm
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Post Re: Pirates Kill Four Aboard Yact
I got to say, I'm with Sly on this one!!! I want a MA Deuce mounted on the mast, and lots of ammo. If I can't have that let me have a stern mounted minigun. I'd take a handheld version if you'd like. For close in support, I want the Colt 1911a .45 caliber though. Reliable, and it will put a hole the size of a fist in you. One hit your down, no matter what!

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February 25th, 2011, 3:03 pm
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