View unanswered posts | View active topics It is currently December 16th, 2018, 7:59 pm



Reply to topic  [ 14 posts ] 
 R.I.P. Detroit Lions. 
Author Message
Martha Firestone Ford
User avatar

Joined: May 7th, 2005, 3:25 pm
Posts: 9090
Location: Earth/Sagittarius Dwarf Galaxy
Post R.I.P. Detroit Lions.
We ain’t winning another game this year.


November 11th, 2018, 4:36 pm
Profile
Martha Firestone Ford
User avatar

Joined: May 7th, 2005, 3:25 pm
Posts: 9090
Location: Earth/Sagittarius Dwarf Galaxy
Post Re: R.I.P. Detroit Lions.
Have we successfully converted an onside kick since Hanso retired?


November 11th, 2018, 4:50 pm
Profile
Martha Firestone Ford
User avatar

Joined: May 7th, 2005, 3:25 pm
Posts: 9090
Location: Earth/Sagittarius Dwarf Galaxy
Post Re: R.I.P. Detroit Lions.
I really hope that Quinn told Patricia to just use this year to evaluate every player on the roster so, they will know who has to be replaced, and who can fit into a Patriots style system on both offense and defense.


November 11th, 2018, 5:49 pm
Profile
#1 Overall Pick

Joined: October 19th, 2005, 1:24 pm
Posts: 1494
Location: Nottingham, England
Post Re: R.I.P. Detroit Lions.
Quinn evaluated every player on the roster himself. And he decided it was a playoff calibre roster. That’s why he sacked Caldwell for going 9-7. Good to see he has really improved this team.


November 11th, 2018, 7:38 pm
Profile
Veteran NFL Head Coach

Joined: February 11th, 2005, 3:01 pm
Posts: 5097
Location: WSU
Post Re: R.I.P. Detroit Lions.
The roster doesnt look good but it also looks like its receiving very little help from the coaching staff. In most contests they appear both outmanned and unprepared. Bob Quinn and Matt Patricia both on board for another 4 seasons. 2019, 2020, 2021, 2022. How far will they actually get?


November 12th, 2018, 5:37 am
Profile
Junior Varsity

Joined: October 30th, 2011, 8:16 pm
Posts: 184
Post Re: R.I.P. Detroit Lions.
If they don't win another game and get blown out in a weekly basis, will they both get fired? Wishful thinking I know. But quin should be gone. This is the perfect storm of everything hed done going wrong. Alot of his players have regressed or suck, his coaching hire has been rocky from the get go. Also his personnel decisions have put this roster in a depth less hell hole. He should be fired for the Ebron move along with the failures of the offense with how much hes neglected the defense to invest into the Offense while now dismantling it


November 14th, 2018, 1:47 pm
Profile
#1 Overall Pick

Joined: October 19th, 2005, 1:24 pm
Posts: 1494
Location: Nottingham, England
Post Re: R.I.P. Detroit Lions.
TJ Lang on IR and quite possibly played his last game as a Lion.

Larry Warford would have been half the price, and better.


November 14th, 2018, 5:58 pm
Profile
RIP Killer
User avatar

Joined: August 6th, 2004, 9:21 am
Posts: 10069
Location: Dallas
Post Re: R.I.P. Detroit Lions.
And Eric Ebron already has 9 TDs with the Colts this year with a bunch of games to go, he scored 11 in his entire Lions career...

_________________
Image
LB Tweet


November 15th, 2018, 10:26 am
Profile WWW
3rd Round Selection

Joined: October 24th, 2005, 6:23 am
Posts: 1136
Post Re: R.I.P. Detroit Lions.
What Ebron does in Indy has no bearing. Teryl Austin got fired already. So What?

For all we know the only reason Caldwell was retained last season was because Martha liked him and wanted to see what he could do with a 'real' GM. What did you expect BQ to say when firing Caldwell: I'm bringing in a new coach and we are going to suck for the first year or two? Of course he is going to put out a message of greater expectations. Nor was he blowing smoke. You can bet that he has the expectations that this team makes the playoffs even now. People have a tendency to live up or down to expectations.

Ask 10 Lions fans what is wrong with the team and you'll likely get 12 different answers. The number one answer you'll get will be a lack of talent and this is wrong almost all of the time. You don't draft or sign free agent talent, you draft and sign people with talent. If those people don't do what they should with what they have when they should all the talent in the world will make no difference. We don't have just one player messing up in just one type of situation. So then you come up with the theory that it is coaching. But is it really? It is true that coaches have to put players in a position to succeed. Yet, the player has to make the most of that and if that doesn't happen was it the coach or the player or both? Not to mention that the other players and coaches get paid also.

Right now there are a number of talking heads claiming to know that Matt Patricia is trying to be someone else. Yet, they don't know this for a fact and are only spouting it because they have to sound like they know what they are talking about and this seems plausible. What makes New England a perennial winner is the philosophy of the team. Be fundamentally sound, know your responsibilities, be situationally aware and do YOUR job. Patricia preaching this does not mean he is trying to be his former boss.

Seriously, look back at all of the times the Lions have shot themselves in the foot causing them to lose and you'll see players who aren't fundamentally sound getting beat, players trying to do too much, mis-communications and poor situational awareness. You don't have to go back too far, just the last two games and you see players getting beat like a rug for these very reasons.

You may see failure, I see growing pains


November 15th, 2018, 12:02 pm
Profile
Martha Firestone Ford
User avatar

Joined: May 7th, 2005, 3:25 pm
Posts: 9090
Location: Earth/Sagittarius Dwarf Galaxy
Post Re: R.I.P. Detroit Lions.
Jafo wrote:
What Ebron does in Indy has no bearing. Teryl Austin got fired already. So What?

For all we know the only reason Caldwell was retained last season was because Martha liked him and wanted to see what he could do with a 'real' GM. What did you expect BQ to say when firing Caldwell: I'm bringing in a new coach and we are going to suck for the first year or two? Of course he is going to put out a message of greater expectations. Nor was he blowing smoke. You can bet that he has the expectations that this team makes the playoffs even now. People have a tendency to live up or down to expectations.

Ask 10 Lions fans what is wrong with the team and you'll likely get 12 different answers. The number one answer you'll get will be a lack of talent and this is wrong almost all of the time. You don't draft or sign free agent talent, you draft and sign people with talent. If those people don't do what they should with what they have when they should all the talent in the world will make no difference. We don't have just one player messing up in just one type of situation. So then you come up with the theory that it is coaching. But is it really? It is true that coaches have to put players in a position to succeed. Yet, the player has to make the most of that and if that doesn't happen was it the coach or the player or both? Not to mention that the other players and coaches get paid also.

Right now there are a number of talking heads claiming to know that Matt Patricia is trying to be someone else. Yet, they don't know this for a fact and are only spouting it because they have to sound like they know what they are talking about and this seems plausible. What makes New England a perennial winner is the philosophy of the team. Be fundamentally sound, know your responsibilities, be situationally aware and do YOUR job. Patricia preaching this does not mean he is trying to be his former boss.

Seriously, look back at all of the times the Lions have shot themselves in the foot causing them to lose and you'll see players who aren't fundamentally sound getting beat, players trying to do too much, mis-communications and poor situational awareness. You don't have to go back too far, just the last two games and you see players getting beat like a rug for these very reasons.

You may see failure, I see growing pains


Amen. I agree. It’s just really hard to watch. I was maybe the biggest advocate for bringing in the Patriot way. I am concerned a bit that that meant hiring so many Syracuse alumni though.


November 15th, 2018, 8:56 pm
Profile
NFL Team Captain

Joined: March 21st, 2005, 2:11 pm
Posts: 1636
Location: Wolverine, Mi.
Post Re: R.I.P. Detroit Lions.
Jafo wrote:
What Ebron does in Indy has no bearing. Teryl Austin got fired already. So What?

For all we know the only reason Caldwell was retained last season was because Martha liked him and wanted to see what he could do with a 'real' GM. What did you expect BQ to say when firing Caldwell: I'm bringing in a new coach and we are going to suck for the first year or two? Of course he is going to put out a message of greater expectations. Nor was he blowing smoke. You can bet that he has the expectations that this team makes the playoffs even now. People have a tendency to live up or down to expectations.

Ask 10 Lions fans what is wrong with the team and you'll likely get 12 different answers. The number one answer you'll get will be a lack of talent and this is wrong almost all of the time. You don't draft or sign free agent talent, you draft and sign people with talent. If those people don't do what they should with what they have when they should all the talent in the world will make no difference. We don't have just one player messing up in just one type of situation. So then you come up with the theory that it is coaching. But is it really? It is true that coaches have to put players in a position to succeed. Yet, the player has to make the most of that and if that doesn't happen was it the coach or the player or both? Not to mention that the other players and coaches get paid also.

Right now there are a number of talking heads claiming to know that Matt Patricia is trying to be someone else. Yet, they don't know this for a fact and are only spouting it because they have to sound like they know what they are talking about and this seems plausible. What makes New England a perennial winner is the philosophy of the team. Be fundamentally sound, know your responsibilities, be situationally aware and do YOUR job. Patricia preaching this does not mean he is trying to be his former boss.

Seriously, look back at all of the times the Lions have shot themselves in the foot causing them to lose and you'll see players who aren't fundamentally sound getting beat, players trying to do too much, mis-communications and poor situational awareness. You don't have to go back too far, just the last two games and you see players getting beat like a rug for these very reasons.

You may see failure, I see growing pains



Great write up. Absolutely agree. Often have to take a couple steps backwards.
We're all frustrated with the Lions up and down performances this year. Growing pains in a new system with a new coach that is trying to make it work with what he's been dealt. Next year's team will be a truer image of what the future holds, and I'll be amazed if JBC is still part of the equation.


November 16th, 2018, 12:45 pm
Profile
#1 Overall Pick

Joined: October 19th, 2005, 1:24 pm
Posts: 1494
Location: Nottingham, England
Post Re: R.I.P. Detroit Lions.
If JBC is gone, it will remind me of the lead up to the 0-16 season.

Defence performs worse than offence by some margin. Yet the OC is sacked because the HC is too closely linked to the defense to blame that side of the ball.


November 16th, 2018, 7:32 pm
Profile
Veteran NFL Head Coach

Joined: February 11th, 2005, 3:01 pm
Posts: 5097
Location: WSU
Post Re: R.I.P. Detroit Lions.
Jafo wrote:
What Ebron does in Indy has no bearing. Teryl Austin got fired already. So What?

For all we know the only reason Caldwell was retained last season was because Martha liked him and wanted to see what he could do with a 'real' GM. What did you expect BQ to say when firing Caldwell: I'm bringing in a new coach and we are going to suck for the first year or two? Of course he is going to put out a message of greater expectations. Nor was he blowing smoke. You can bet that he has the expectations that this team makes the playoffs even now. People have a tendency to live up or down to expectations.

Ask 10 Lions fans what is wrong with the team and you'll likely get 12 different answers. The number one answer you'll get will be a lack of talent and this is wrong almost all of the time. You don't draft or sign free agent talent, you draft and sign people with talent. If those people don't do what they should with what they have when they should all the talent in the world will make no difference. We don't have just one player messing up in just one type of situation. So then you come up with the theory that it is coaching. But is it really? It is true that coaches have to put players in a position to succeed. Yet, the player has to make the most of that and if that doesn't happen was it the coach or the player or both? Not to mention that the other players and coaches get paid also.

Right now there are a number of talking heads claiming to know that Matt Patricia is trying to be someone else. Yet, they don't know this for a fact and are only spouting it because they have to sound like they know what they are talking about and this seems plausible. What makes New England a perennial winner is the philosophy of the team. Be fundamentally sound, know your responsibilities, be situationally aware and do YOUR job. Patricia preaching this does not mean he is trying to be his former boss.

Seriously, look back at all of the times the Lions have shot themselves in the foot causing them to lose and you'll see players who aren't fundamentally sound getting beat, players trying to do too much, mis-communications and poor situational awareness. You don't have to go back too far, just the last two games and you see players getting beat like a rug for these very reasons.

You may see failure, I see growing pains


Couldnt disagree more. This was never a slash and burn as far as having too much aging old talent and Quinn didnt inherit a salary cap mess. Mayhew got fired bc of a combination of some bad drafting and having top picks prior to new rookie wage scale put them in salary cap bind disadvantage compared to other teams. There was one cap hell year where Mayhew could no longer cover up his draft mistakes with shrewd free agency maneuvers. Quinn got a team that had some pieces that needed to be added to. But Bob Quinn incorrectly interpreted what he had. He said they needed to upgrade the "middle class". He thought depth was the issue and Im not sure its ever been worse than it is now. He thought the nucleus was strong enough. In turn, he really hasnt done much adding, he s done some replacing. Marvin Jones for Calvin Johnson, TJ Lang and Wagner for Warford and Reiff. In the meantime Bob Quinn has had 3 offseasons where he has failed to add high end talent. Taylor Decker looked like he might be that for part of his rookie year but he appears similar overall quality to Reiff with difft strengths and weaknesses. Frank Ragnow looks promising physically at least in bw penalties and mental gaffes, Jarrad Davis has all the traits in the world but is just mistake after mistake on the football field bc he lacks instincts at a position where that might be the most important attribute. Kenny Golladay looks like he could be a star and Kerryon Johnson is a real NFL runner. Dashawn Hand started out this season strong and Ashawn Robinson looks good despite the coaching staff using him like a backup. Love the Harrison addition. Despite some of the positives the fact remained even this year that the Lions best players were brought in by Martin Mayhew - Glover Quin, Ansah, Slay, Stafford, Tate, Diggs. This season we re seeing what happens when you subtract Mayhew s players and coach from Quinn s Lions. Glover Quin is showing his age, Ansah and Slay are battling injuries, Tate was traded away, Diggs is trying to make up for some major deficiencies on the back end, Stafford struggling badly minus Tate with the line collapsing. The loss of Caldwell's calm, steady leadership - the loss of a very strong group of position coaches he built up over 4 years in exchange for an inexperienced thin skinned Patricia with ties to really only one organization and unable to build a strong group of coaches around him. The New England philosophy state above seemed far better executed by Caldwell than Patricia. I dont see "growing pains" - I see a disorganized unprepared team led by a coaching staff struggling to make adjustments and that seems very much in doubt of the leadership at the GM and head coach level. If there are growing pains - the only place where that could be acceptable is with Patricia. Quinn should be beyond that now. Im really sorry to say it but if you are seeing "growing pains" you re drinking the same Kool Aid that some were on when they thought the Lions had a chance at something this season after they Quinn conceded the season with the Tate trade.

The slashing and burning is happening now, not by design but naturally and by Bob Quinn s lack of foresight. Ansah has long been an injury waiting to happen and yet where are the other passrushers? There isnt even a legitimate attempt at even getting a passrusher, bargain bin shopping doesnt cut it at an effort to secure the most important part of your defense. Its been 3 years - not one legitimate attempt. The Ebron situation was so mismanaged that the Lions let what they developed over 4 years into a Pro Bowl player walk without any compensation. They held Tate through the offseason when they knew his bargain deal was way under market and had value. Rather than trading him at peak value they waited until his value slipped a bit and in a way that crushed any confidence the new coach had earned from his players. TJ Lang got paid above market despite his injury risks and his spot has mostly been an expensive hole the last two years. Quinn s bigger attempts at obtaining depth on the OL were largely laughable bw Greg Robinson and Kenny Wiggins. He couldnt get a return on Theo Riddick or Ameer Abdullah. Choosing ultimately to cut Abdullah and keep Riddick when trading the more productive Riddick and allowing the quicker Abdullah a chance to grow into Riddick s role while on his rookie deal made more financial sense. They did after all have so much confidence a year ago in Abdullah being there feature back that they didnt bring in any additional depth at the spot.

For the Lions to improve Quinn cannot continue with the same approach. His growing pains are over, time to show he learned his original approach will not work. They need to be players in free agency, they need to try and get a passrush, they cant come into the season with holes at positions they didnt even try to fill, they need to maximize value in the draft. When a draft pick like Teez Tabor doesnt pan out for a major role they need to get someone who can do the job. They cant count on indefinitely rolling money into future years without ever planning on using it to there advantage. Quinn needs to get better, it starts with him.


November 17th, 2018, 12:46 pm
Profile
3rd Round Selection
User avatar

Joined: January 11th, 2005, 11:35 pm
Posts: 1188
Post Re: R.I.P. Detroit Lions.
This team is in 100% flux right now. It's clear the Lions are trying to change their defensive scheme and clearly don't have the players for it. They have a few nice pieces (Harrison, Hand, Kennard, Slay, Diggs, and maybe Davis. But rest of the holes are so glaring right now.

The offense is even more disappointing than the defense. At first it looked like the offense was going to be solid but it's been a disaster. Starting with the Jets game when they said they knew exactly what plays the offense was running and looks like other teams have a pretty good idea also. But the thing that is baffling is how they pushed Golden Tate out the door. It seems they wanted to go from a pass first offense to a more balanced offense which requires something the Lions don't have TWO TIGHT ENDS WHO CAN BLOCK AND CATCH THE BALL.

Trading Tate and dumping Ebron has rendered this offense complete garbage.

_________________
The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.


November 18th, 2018, 11:37 am
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic   [ 14 posts ] 

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 39 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.
Designed by STSoftware.