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 2009 Detroit Lions Draft Grades 
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JEBWrench wrote:
kendawg wrote:
and that's been a proven strategy used by most NFL teams hasn't it? Fix everything else first and get your QB last.


I'm not sure if you're agreeing with me or disagreeing with me, but more than a few teams have progressed well by doing that. Baltimore, Pittsburgh, San Diego, Miami....


Sure, and some have progressed opposite of that: Indy(Manning), Patriots (Bledsoe), Eagles (McNabb), Giants (Manning)... heck I'll even contend that San Diego was in a slump and got Rivers (wanted Manning).

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April 27th, 2009, 4:14 pm
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Does anyone know if there is any youtube video of Kiper/McShay or any other professional talent evaluator that went over the Lions' picks?

For example: Rd 1. Stafford (Kiper makes a schpiel)
Rd 2. Pettigrew (Kiper or ESPN guys discuss)
Rd 3. Same
and so on....

I am interested in seeing what the people who get paid lots of money to have bad hair, and discuss these things, had to say about our choices.

What about written Draft Grades from these guys, anyone know anything?

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April 27th, 2009, 4:40 pm
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DevilDoc wrote:
Does anyone know if there is any youtube video of Kiper/McShay or any other professional talent evaluator that went over the Lions' picks?

For example: Rd 1. Stafford (Kiper makes a schpiel)
Rd 2. Pettigrew (Kiper or ESPN guys discuss)
Rd 3. Same
and so on....

I am interested in seeing what the people who get paid lots of money to have bad hair, and discuss these things, had to say about our choices.

What about written Draft Grades from these guys, anyone know anything?


I only remember what I read about the first two picks.

McShay thought you should have went with someone besides Stafford though he believes he'll be a good QB. He loved Pettigrew.

Kiper felt Pettigrew was a reach for where you got him and that you probably could've waited for him in the second round. Of course he loved the Stafford pick.


April 27th, 2009, 4:43 pm
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steensn wrote:
JEBWrench wrote:
kendawg wrote:
and that's been a proven strategy used by most NFL teams hasn't it? Fix everything else first and get your QB last.


I'm not sure if you're agreeing with me or disagreeing with me, but more than a few teams have progressed well by doing that. Baltimore, Pittsburgh, San Diego, Miami....


Sure, and some have progressed opposite of that: Indy(Manning), Patriots (Bledsoe), Eagles (McNabb), Giants (Manning)... heck I'll even contend that San Diego was in a slump and got Rivers (wanted Manning).


SD had most of its pieces in place, I think. And the Patriots had me waffling in that regard as to whether they had QB then pieces, or pieces, then QB. Or QB, pieces, QB in pieces, then QB.


April 27th, 2009, 5:00 pm
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kendawg wrote:
I only remember what I read about the first two picks.

McShay thought you should have went with someone besides Stafford though he believes he'll be a good QB. He loved Pettigrew.

Kiper felt Pettigrew was a reach for where you got him and that you probably could've waited for him in the second round. Of course he loved the Stafford pick.


I don't think Pettigrew would've lasted into the second round. I genuinely think the Browns wanted him.


April 27th, 2009, 5:03 pm
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Post Re: Same old song and dance!
Sven Draconian wrote:
Blueskies wrote:
LionFan57 wrote:
This draft is exactly what you would expect from a rookie front office. High price gamble's; A little bit of flash; A few decent athletes; BUT woefully short at filling needs and even further from putting this team in a position of respectability. Looking at the drafts (and off seasons) of Minnesota, Green Bay & Chicago; The Lions have only slipped further into the abyss. With the exception of TE I'm not convinced that any position is stronger today than it was last season.

While I have more confidence in this coaching regime's ability to get more from the players than Marinelli's Misfits did; I'm still not excited about the possibilities of winning more than 6 games.

In the end Mayhew didn't deliver the goods and he failed IMO in his first NFL draft.


LF57 wrote:
BUT woefully short at filling needs


I find it hilarious that people are criticizing this draft because it didn't "fill needs".

Every position on this team outside of WSLB (Sims), SSLB (Peterson), #1 WR (Johnson), and RT (Cherilus) was a need.

You can sit there and argue that MLB was a bigger need than safety and tackle was a bigger need than TE and so on. To do that it is to look at it from the wrong mindset.

The Lions are not winning more than four games this year. Even if they had drafted Rey and Oher, they still wouldn't win more than four games.

So they patch two of their bigger holes this year. So what? That just means they'd have to take a safety and TE next year, forcing them to reach for players at specific positions. And then what do you have? Two sub-par prospects this year, and two sub-par prospects next. This way you're getting the best talent with the picks you have.

You can knock the players, but don't knock the FO for not addressing "needs".


Bingo.



I agree almost every position on the team is a need but some more so than others. And you can pick the BPA with an eye on filling needs.

Stafford was not the BPA. AND he won't even be (or shouldn't be unless pressed into it) a starter this year. The only way he starts is if Cullpepper gets hurt or the wheels come off the tracks and the FO / Coaching staff press him (Stafford) into service. (Which will likely happen right about after the bye week). Other than that he's NOT a starter this season.

Pettigrew will start; and I agree he will help the team; but he was not the PBA and in fact a TE is a luxury for a 1st round pick for this team.

Delmas was not the PBA although he will start. However I don't consider S as important a need as OL, DL, or MLB. This is probably the least damning pick of the draft.

All the rest are NON STARTERS!! Maybe Levy starts - but only until he gets crushed. Trading back in the 3rd round was moronic. Drafting a WR and a RB (Williams & Brown) for depth was completely asinine. None of these were the BPA nor were these needs by any stretch of the emagination.

Hill & Murtha are projects and may eventually contribute; but they are likely NOT starters.

Follett & Gronkowski are definitely not starters and may not even make the team.

5 picks in the first 85 and the Lions yield 2, perhaps 3 starters for this season!! Are you fricken kidding me!! And we never bolstered our biggest needs on the 2 lines with starters as Schwartz, Mayhew & Lewand said we would!!

And you're happy with this? :question:

We could have had starters at OL, DL, MLB & DB, and still had room for several projects such as Hill and / or KR/PR such as Williams. And that says nothing of the money we could have saved!!

This draft was a joke and this rookie FO just proved (again) why you don't hire inexperienced people to run billion dollar organizations.

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April 27th, 2009, 5:04 pm
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Post Re: Same old song and dance!
LionFan57 wrote:
All the rest are NON STARTERS!! Maybe Levy starts - but only until he gets crushed. ...

Hill & Murtha are projects and may eventually contribute; but they are likely NOT starters.

Follett & Gronkowski are definitely not starters and may not even make the team.

5 picks in the first 85 and the Lions yield 2, perhaps 3 starters for this season!! Are you fricken kidding me!! And we never bolstered our biggest needs on the 2 lines with starters as Schwartz, Mayhew & Lewand said we would!!


Remember, the Lions' definition of "starter" can be a fourth-round DT and a 7th round LB. This is a really REALLY bad roster we're talking about.

By the start of the 2010 season, I think there are definitely three starters, possibly a fourth (Hill), and maybe one of the LBs could start by then. Five certainly isn't bad.

The 2009 season is most likely going to mostly irrelevant. Just a matter of jockeying for draft position. So honestly, I wouldn't be worrying about who's starting during it. As long as the young guys get a fair share of regular-season snaps. Even the sixth and seventh round guys.


April 27th, 2009, 5:25 pm
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Quote:
So can you honestly say that Matthew Stafford was the best player available? [/devilsadvocate]


Stafford was the exception. He wasn't taken because he was the BPA. (though the FO might try to sell that) He wasn't taken because he was the biggest need either. He was taken because of contract size and potential reward per cost. Sad but true. Just an unfortunate consequence of having no rookie pay scale.

Quote:
We might have been able to get a first rounder next year for our 33 pick, in addition to a later round pick this year. Who knows?


M2K, much of the criticism you level against the Lions' draft this year is based on fact that they didn't trade down in a back-loaded draft. While that may be valid, I think it is pretty unjustifiable to say "they should have traded down at #33, they should've traded down at #20..." you weren't there and you don't know what offers they had for the picks--if any.

Further, I'm actually fairly certain that they we're going to trade #20, but someone backed out at the last second. I base this on the Philly trade. Why did Philly jump over the Lions to take Maclin? The Lions weren't going to take him. Perhaps the Giants were going to trade with the Lions to jump Philly?


April 27th, 2009, 7:12 pm
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m2k wrote:
Murtha - I actually like this pick. I thought Murtha would go in the fifth to sixth round. He has experience at both tackle spots, but projects more as a RT in the pros, which is kind of bothersome. However, he has the athleticism to play the guard spots and contribute with his speed for traps, counters and sweeps, which would be good.


I know it might be a long shot, but i'm hoping he can be our LT. He has all the tools needed. He's basically the same size as the top 3 tackles in the draft, and more athletic than all of them. The thing that gives me hope is his footwork, which is most important for a left tackle.

So to me he was the one tackle in the draft who could have the type of Jason Peters ascension to Franchise Left Tackle.

Like I said it's a stretch and it'll take some development, but like you said he's super versatile. If he can transform his superior athleticism to the NFL game we got ourselves a steal. And if he can play Left Tackle for us, then he would be the most important pick in this draft. If he doesn't, no biggie, we picked him up in the 7th round.

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April 27th, 2009, 8:34 pm
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Murtha is my favorite pick in the draft in terms of value where we got him.

I am also hoping he finds the skills neccessary under our coaches to become a staple on our line.

I am even willing to wait a couple years as we continue to pay Backus more money than he deserves.

This guy could be a diamond in the rough.

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April 27th, 2009, 8:38 pm
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On the subject of grading the draft: I give it a solid B+ and leaning toward an A-. Most of criticism levied against the FO is based on us not filling needs. Most of us know that drafting for need is a poor way to build talent, which is the ultimate goal. Drafting for needs helps us next year, but drafting talent makes a winning franchise.

The second criticism I hear is that the 3rd round picks don't make sense. Linebacker was a need, albeit in the middle. How many times do you have to hear that Schwartz doesn't believe in the exclusiveness of positions, especially at linebacker? My guess is that the talent at MLB at that part of the draft graded lower than Levy at OLB. They opted for talent, and will try Levy at MLB.

The second pick of the round was Williams. We have heard Schwartz opinion of the return game, and most have agreed with him. We knew this was coming, yet we criticize the move. Between Williams, Brown, Buchanon, and Jennings- we WILL have a return game this year. This guy is a burner too, and may find use in the passing game.

Loved the picks of Hill, Murtha, Follet. Stafford is the BEST pick we could have made *IF* he pans out. This is not even debatable. Pettigrew and Delmas were great picks if you separate yourself from the idea of drafting for need.

I think most criticism is due to fans not having an open mind locking into certain players, over estimating their own talent evaluation skills. There I said it. Good job FO, even if I'm the only one to recognize it.

-ILMP


April 27th, 2009, 10:32 pm
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Classic Kool Aid and Cornbread :roll:

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April 27th, 2009, 10:40 pm
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Honolulu_Blue wrote:
Classic Kool Aid and Cornbread :roll:


Classic basher :rolleyes:

See, anyone can do it :lol:


April 27th, 2009, 10:42 pm
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Honolulu_Blue wrote:
Classic Kool Aid and Cornbread :roll:


I for one am forcing myself a helping of the cornbread. I need to have some optimism around here. The locals rag on my team for sucking, and they're bloody Chiefs fans!


April 27th, 2009, 10:46 pm
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mwill2 wrote:
I can't quibble with any of the Lions' picks. I love this draft. Maybe I'm the only one, I dunno.


Your not alone. I can see the value of each pick we made. We should be a much better team this season.


April 27th, 2009, 11:02 pm
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