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 Offensive Line discussion 
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Fair Weather Fan

Joined: April 23rd, 2010, 11:52 am
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Post Re: Offensive Line discussion
hey guys, i setup a post in the smack forum and got directed here.

(not smacking)

i feel that the Suh and Best picks did your franchise no favours as, although Suh is a great player and will be a stud in the D, he wont keep the other team to 0. Best is a slightly better pick as he will take some pressure from Stafford, but to run the ball effectively you need a good O line. also you can't be chasing games and play a run game.

i feel it wont be long before Stafford is

1. on IR again
2. asking for a trade as he's sick of being beaten to a pulp

as i said in my 1st post, i fear another 0-16 season is winging it's way to Ford's Field.

as i football fan i cant think of anything worse for a team, it's players and it's fans.

hope i'm wrong but i think you may regret the Suh pick


April 23rd, 2010, 12:22 pm
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RIP Killer
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Post Re: Offensive Line discussion
Lets not forget that the RB is key to blocking. Smith sucked at it and I'm not sure that Best will be great at it. Play action only works if the back can block.

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April 23rd, 2010, 12:23 pm
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Joined: February 28th, 2007, 10:37 pm
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Location: Corona, CA
Post Re: Offensive Line discussion
buccobrit wrote:
hey guys, i setup a post in the smack forum and got directed here.

(not smacking)

i feel that the Suh and Best picks did your franchise no favours as, although Suh is a great player and will be a stud in the D, he wont keep the other team to 0. Best is a slightly better pick as he will take some pressure from Stafford, but to run the ball effectively you need a good O line. also you can't be chasing games and play a run game.

i feel it wont be long before Stafford is

1. on IR again
2. asking for a trade as he's sick of being beaten to a pulp

as i said in my 1st post, i fear another 0-16 season is winging it's way to Ford's Field.

as i football fan i cant think of anything worse for a team, it's players and it's fans.

hope i'm wrong but i think you may regret the Suh pick


Suh is the best player in the draft, you can never regret getting the best player in the draft.

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April 23rd, 2010, 12:25 pm
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Fair Weather Fan

Joined: April 23rd, 2010, 11:52 am
Posts: 8
Post Re: Offensive Line discussion
true he was the best player in the draft, but i think the FO should have been smart and started from the base, trade back for Lupati, get extra picks and get the players who WILL make a difference over the comming seasons.

IMO you made the icing before you had the cake


April 23rd, 2010, 12:29 pm
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Post Re: Offensive Line discussion
As Stallion said on the previous page, the OL is only as good as it's weakest link, and hopefully they improved the LG position by the addition of Rob Sims. I'm quite sure that they have since it couldn't get any worse, could it? Regardless, I think the keys to the OL this year will be the play of Backus and Cherilus. Will Backus continue to perform as well as he did last season, or will he return to the inconsistent play of the past few years? And just as important, will Cherilus finally "get it" and live up to his draft status, or will he continue to disappoint? Time will tell.

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April 23rd, 2010, 12:43 pm
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Fair Weather Fan

Joined: April 23rd, 2010, 11:52 am
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Post Re: Offensive Line discussion
i really liked the look of Cherilus defore the draft but now feel he is another Gaines Adams (RIP)

i hope you have improved the O line as Stafford will be getting sick of being a punch bag


April 23rd, 2010, 12:47 pm
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Joined: February 28th, 2007, 10:37 pm
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Location: Corona, CA
Post Re: Offensive Line discussion
buccobrit wrote:
true he was the best player in the draft, but i think the FO should have been smart and started from the base, trade back for Lupati, get extra picks and get the players who WILL make a difference over the comming seasons.

IMO you made the icing before you had the cake


Check my message on the last page. It is the last one there. Trading back and losing the best player in the draft is not an option when all indication is he is a difference maker and he will be elite.

How do you feel about the decision the Bucs made to get McCoy?

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April 23rd, 2010, 12:47 pm
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Player of the Year - Defense

Joined: September 25th, 2007, 3:20 am
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Post Re: Offensive Line discussion
It starts on the line. We have a dominant defensive line now, and we went after Sims in the offseason to fill our weakest link on the OL. This doesn't make us worse, its makes us better. Okung as the 2nd pick was all smokescreen. They weren't going to draft him, they were trying to get trade offers to move down, which weren't going to come. We'll see who's heading towards 0-16 when Bradford goes on the IR week 5.


April 23rd, 2010, 12:47 pm
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Fair Weather Fan

Joined: April 23rd, 2010, 11:52 am
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Post Re: Offensive Line discussion
really pleased with the McCoy pick as he'll fit well in our D.

njroar - i think the rams being 0-16 was understood by all ;)


April 23rd, 2010, 1:06 pm
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Joined: March 30th, 2009, 11:55 pm
Posts: 182
Post Re: Offensive Line discussion
Pablo wrote:
I wasn't too high on the OL availabe at the top of the draft and think LT is one of the most over rated positions on the field, don't believe me then look at the most successful offenses in the league.

The Top Five Scoring offense and their LTs were:

1. New Orleans, LT = Jermon Bushrod (7.5 sacks allowed)
2. Minnesota, LT = Bryant McKinnie (9 sacks)
3. Green Bay, LT = 3 different starters (11.5 sacks)
4. San Diego, LT = Marcus McNeill (5 sacks)
5. Philly, LT = Jason Peters (6 sacks)

The Saints lost starter Jammal Brown in the preseason, Busrod had been active for only 2 games over the past two seasons and they still had a decent season. The Colts got to the SB with Charle Johnson (pick 199 in 2006), not a great LT there.

In 2007, the Giants won with LT David Diehl who allowed the 2nd most sacks in the league at LT that year with 10.5. The Pats have won with Matt Light, no a pro bowl LT there.

I know everyone hates Backus and it would be nice to have a great LT protecting Stafford's blindside but is a great LT needed to have a great offense? In a word, NO...


Sorry, what I see here is a textbook example of what Benjamin Disreali was talking about when he made his famous quote: "there are lies, damn lies, and statistics".

If you want to point out that a lot of the better offenses recently have lacked pro bowl quality LTs to prove your point, totally understandable. You want to compare their LT production to our own? Also understandable.

But using the evidence of my eyes, here's what I see: a list populated by a bunch of veteran, potential future HoF QBs (possible exception of Rodgers, but he also got to sit and watch and learn from a HoF QB for 3+ years), who know when to try to make a play and know when taking the sack is the better alternative. What I saw watching Detroit last season was far, far different form the above examples... a young QB often running for his life from the snap of the ball.

I know apparently many are mesmerized by looking at all the potential talent we have at the skill positions and believe that they alone, with the addition of Sims up front, are enough to turn our OL from porous to solid. I hope you all are right, but I'm not nearly as certain.


April 23rd, 2010, 5:13 pm
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Post Re: Offensive Line discussion
How much different this discussion would be if they moved up to draft Saffold instead of Best.

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April 23rd, 2010, 5:20 pm
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Joined: March 30th, 2009, 11:55 pm
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Post Re: Offensive Line discussion
... And how very much different would it have been if they had moved down in the 2nd, added picks, and still got Saffold?


April 23rd, 2010, 5:32 pm
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Post Re: Offensive Line discussion
CalvintheBeast wrote:
... And how very much different would it have been if they had moved down in the 2nd, added picks, and still got Saffold?


Very Unlikely. The Group of teams that were expected to make a run on OTs happen in the 1st round did not. Likely , that means the rest of the OTs go to that same group here at the top of the 2nd round. But yes, we could have takens affold at #34 likely, but they wanted Best, and I am willing to trust this FO/Coaching Group.


April 23rd, 2010, 5:48 pm
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Post Re: Offensive Line discussion
We all know Mike Martz thought both of our tackles were crap. That said, the pocket collapsed A LOT last season. A 4 man rush ate up our 5-6 man line regularly. Any sort of a blitz and Staff was throwing early or getting his badonkadonk planted.

That said, Backus isn't bad, but he isn't a standout either. He's average. Average only. Goz has been a huge disappointment and Ray Edwards had a field day against him. He's below average. You can't have an average LT and a bad RT. Not to mention a C who can't hold his own and 1 OG who is just plain terrible. Goz is the weakspot on the line now. Maybe they'll nab a RT with their 4th rounder.

Sims is a huge upgrade from either Loper, Ramirez, or any other turd we had there. I watched him a bit in Seattle and he's pretty solid - very good in pass protection, average in the run. Peterman played pretty damn well when he was healthy (prior to IR). Raiola should be playing for the Broncos or the Colts.

Backus - C+
Peterman - B
Raiola - B-
Sims - C+
Goz - D

Overall - C+

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April 23rd, 2010, 6:45 pm
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Post Re: Offensive Line discussion
I remember during the season, Mayhew talking about the inept running game. And he didn't squarely put it on the Oline. He was saying at some point, the RB's just have to make a play. Make people miss. Schwartz may have also said something to that affect as well. That may be the basis of passing on Oline and taking Best. At least the thought process is there. But I started to buy into it, and for the first time, I felt like this has been the best our Oline performed since the Barry era. "Least Sucked," might be more appropriate. But those comments alluded to hesitation by Kevin Smith. And I started to see it. The injuries scared him or something.

And what seemed to confirm it even more, was when Maurice Morris started to run through those same holes at the end of the season and actually get good production.

Pass protection is also suffers negatively from a direct correlation to a poor running game. When defenses know a team can't run, of course they can just pin their ears back and go. It only gets compounded when the ineptitude on both sides of the ball forces the team to always play from behind... and we know that means passing more than they'd like.

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April 23rd, 2010, 6:47 pm
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