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TE Situation
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Author:  Mufasa [ January 7th, 2013, 4:52 pm ]
Post subject:  TE Situation

Is it time to move on from Pettigrew aka "Mr Dropises" and looked to the later part of the draft for a cheaper TE with sure hands to go along with Scheffler? I'm liking Fauria out of UCLA or the kid out of Notre Dame but they will probably go in the 3rd to 4th Rd.

Author:  Pablo [ January 7th, 2013, 5:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TE Situation

Mufasa wrote:
Is it time to move on from Pettigrew aka "Mr Dropises" and looked to the later part of the draft for a cheaper TE with sure hands to go along with Scheffler? I'm liking Fauria out of UCLA or the kid out of Notre Dame but they will probably go in the 3rd to 4th Rd.


Pett and Scheff are both under contract for 2013 (Will Heller is a FA) so I don't expect the Lions to do much on the TE front. You can replace Heller with a UFA from college or take one late in the draft (6th/7th round).

I think the Lions are more committed to Pett than the fan base would like (he cost us a couple of games this year). Scheff has good hands for a TE so they aren't hurting there and have tons of holes elsewhere.

Author:  thelomasbrowns [ January 7th, 2013, 5:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TE Situation

Similar discussion going on with WJB somewhere else on the board, but I thought it would be good to list the rounds that the top 10 fantasy tight ends were taken:

1 Rob Gronkowski, NE 9 $39 Round 2
2 Jimmy Graham, NO 6 $36 Round 3
3 Antonio Gates, SD 7 $10 Undrafted
4 Vernon Davis, SF 9 $8 Round 1 (pick #6)
5 Jermichael Finley, GB 10 $7 Round 3
6 Aaron Hernandez, NE 9 $3 Round 4
7 Tony Gonzalez, ATL 7 $3 Round 1
8 Jason Witten, DAL 5 $2 Round 3
9 Fred Davis, WAS 10 $2 Round 2
10 Brandon Pettigrew, DET 5 $1 Round 1

So with the notable exception of Gates, it's obvious you're not getting a tight end if you wait until later rounds. Not sure where this line of thought (bargain basement TE to replace Pettigrew) originated from (probably goes back to the Oher/Pettigrew debate).

Author:  wjb21ndtown [ January 7th, 2013, 5:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TE Situation

thelomasbrowns wrote:
Similar discussion going on with WJB somewhere else on the board, but I thought it would be good to list the rounds that the top 10 fantasy tight ends were taken:

1 Rob Gronkowski, NE 9 $39 Round 2
2 Jimmy Graham, NO 6 $36 Round 3
3 Antonio Gates, SD 7 $10 Undrafted
4 Vernon Davis, SF 9 $8 Round 1 (pick #6)
5 Jermichael Finley, GB 10 $7 Round 3
6 Aaron Hernandez, NE 9 $3 Round 4
7 Tony Gonzalez, ATL 7 $3 Round 1
8 Jason Witten, DAL 5 $2 Round 3
9 Fred Davis, WAS 10 $2 Round 2
10 Brandon Pettigrew, DET 5 $1 Round 1

So with the notable exception of Gates, it's obvious you're not getting a tight end if you wait until later rounds. Not sure where this line of thought (bargain basement TE to replace Pettigrew) originated from (probably goes back to the Oher/Pettigrew debate).


You read that and THAT'S your analysis? How about that most of the premier TEs come AFTER the first round, and that we DID reach for Pett? 4 of the TEs on your list are day 2 picks, and those are the BEST TEs in the GAME. What happens when you extend it out?

Author:  rao [ January 7th, 2013, 7:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TE Situation

wjb21ndtown wrote:
thelomasbrowns wrote:
Similar discussion going on with WJB somewhere else on the board, but I thought it would be good to list the rounds that the top 10 fantasy tight ends were taken:

1 Rob Gronkowski, NE 9 $39 Round 2
2 Jimmy Graham, NO 6 $36 Round 3
3 Antonio Gates, SD 7 $10 Undrafted
4 Vernon Davis, SF 9 $8 Round 1 (pick #6)
5 Jermichael Finley, GB 10 $7 Round 3
6 Aaron Hernandez, NE 9 $3 Round 4
7 Tony Gonzalez, ATL 7 $3 Round 1
8 Jason Witten, DAL 5 $2 Round 3
9 Fred Davis, WAS 10 $2 Round 2
10 Brandon Pettigrew, DET 5 $1 Round 1

So with the notable exception of Gates, it's obvious you're not getting a tight end if you wait until later rounds. Not sure where this line of thought (bargain basement TE to replace Pettigrew) originated from (probably goes back to the Oher/Pettigrew debate).


You read that and THAT'S your analysis? How about that most of the premier TEs come AFTER the first round, and that we DID reach for Pett? 4 of the TEs on your list are day 2 picks, and those are the BEST TEs in the GAME. What happens when you extend it out?


He's not wrong, even when to go out to the top 25 virtually all are drafted in the 2nd or 3rd round. You are also right though in that it seems like your better waiting till day 2 to get a TE and use your first rounder on a more premium position.

I'd really like to see Pett under a new coaching staff before he is let go. All the receivers have the dropsies, so I dont know if Pett should really be singled out. I think a lot of Petts drops are just more visible because he gets targeted a lot for first downs and in the endzone.

Author:  wjb21ndtown [ January 7th, 2013, 7:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TE Situation

rao wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
thelomasbrowns wrote:
Similar discussion going on with WJB somewhere else on the board, but I thought it would be good to list the rounds that the top 10 fantasy tight ends were taken:

1 Rob Gronkowski, NE 9 $39 Round 2
2 Jimmy Graham, NO 6 $36 Round 3
3 Antonio Gates, SD 7 $10 Undrafted
4 Vernon Davis, SF 9 $8 Round 1 (pick #6)
5 Jermichael Finley, GB 10 $7 Round 3
6 Aaron Hernandez, NE 9 $3 Round 4
7 Tony Gonzalez, ATL 7 $3 Round 1
8 Jason Witten, DAL 5 $2 Round 3
9 Fred Davis, WAS 10 $2 Round 2
10 Brandon Pettigrew, DET 5 $1 Round 1

So with the notable exception of Gates, it's obvious you're not getting a tight end if you wait until later rounds. Not sure where this line of thought (bargain basement TE to replace Pettigrew) originated from (probably goes back to the Oher/Pettigrew debate).


You read that and THAT'S your analysis? How about that most of the premier TEs come AFTER the first round, and that we DID reach for Pett? 4 of the TEs on your list are day 2 picks, and those are the BEST TEs in the GAME. What happens when you extend it out?


He's not wrong, even when to go out to the top 25 virtually all are drafted in the 2nd or 3rd round. You are also right though in that it seems like your better waiting till day 2 to get a TE and use your first rounder on a more premium position.

I'd really like to see Pett under a new coaching staff before he is let go. All the receivers have the dropsies, so I dont know if Pett should really be singled out. I think a lot of Petts drops are just more visible because he gets targeted a lot for first downs and in the endzone.


Call it what you want, IMO that analysis shows that you should NEVER pick a TE in round 1, period, and shows how disgusting it was that we picked Pett in the first round.

It's not necessary, and you can get better TEs later, flat out. Extend that list to the top 15 or 20 TEs and see what happens to the rounds picked... I bet it starts getting deeper and deeper in the draft.

Author:  The Legend [ January 7th, 2013, 8:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TE Situation

Pablo wrote:
Mufasa wrote:
Is it time to move on from Pettigrew aka "Mr Dropises" and looked to the later part of the draft for a cheaper TE with sure hands to go along with Scheffler? I'm liking Fauria out of UCLA or the kid out of Notre Dame but they will probably go in the 3rd to 4th Rd.


Pett and Scheff are both under contract for 2013 (Will Heller is a FA) so I don't expect the Lions to do much on the TE front. You can replace Heller with a UFA from college or take one late in the draft (6th/7th round).

I think the Lions are more committed to Pett than the fan base would like (he cost us a couple of games this year). Scheff has good hands for a TE so they aren't hurting there and have tons of holes elsewhere.



Scheffler had some huge catches but he had dropsies at time also and he is mostly an awful blocker unless he s lined up as a slot receiver. I think Heller gives a good performance, he s the best blocker of the three by far and seems to have more sure hands then Pettigrew. I wouldnt mind seeing them trade Pettigrew rather than go with the status quo. This is a good position for the Lions on paper but not in reality.

Author:  DJ-B [ January 7th, 2013, 8:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TE Situation

The reason Pett was given a 1st rd grade (agree with it or not) which went as high as #12 for some draft sites was because he supposedly was a Solid receiver (not Gates/Gonzalez, but good) and Excelled in Run blocking, and most of the TEs listed (A La Jimmy Graham) are "Catching TEs" vs Blocking TEs. Very few each ytear grade out as being capable at the PRO level of being good at both.

Not saying Pett has proven to be worth it, or even that he is good at both of those things, only explaining why comparing the Rd Picked vs Fantasy value doesnt tell the whole story as to why some might be picked higher than others.

Author:  wjb21ndtown [ January 7th, 2013, 8:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TE Situation

The Legend wrote:
Pablo wrote:
Mufasa wrote:
Is it time to move on from Pettigrew aka "Mr Dropises" and looked to the later part of the draft for a cheaper TE with sure hands to go along with Scheffler? I'm liking Fauria out of UCLA or the kid out of Notre Dame but they will probably go in the 3rd to 4th Rd.


Pett and Scheff are both under contract for 2013 (Will Heller is a FA) so I don't expect the Lions to do much on the TE front. You can replace Heller with a UFA from college or take one late in the draft (6th/7th round).

I think the Lions are more committed to Pett than the fan base would like (he cost us a couple of games this year). Scheff has good hands for a TE so they aren't hurting there and have tons of holes elsewhere.



Scheffler had some huge catches but he had dropsies at time also and he is mostly an awful blocker unless he s lined up as a slot receiver. I think Heller gives a good performance, he s the best blocker of the three by far and seems to have more sure hands then Pettigrew. I wouldnt mind seeing them trade Pettigrew rather than go with the status quo. This is a good position for the Lions on paper but not in reality.


I agree with you completely. I don't know what Petts market value is (3rd - 5th round pick?), and it's going to suck watching him flourish somewhere else (and I think he would), but I don't think he will ever be the player he can be here. He's too far gone in this organization.

Author:  The Legend [ January 7th, 2013, 8:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TE Situation

wjb21ndtown wrote:
The Legend wrote:
Pablo wrote:
Mufasa wrote:
Is it time to move on from Pettigrew aka "Mr Dropises" and looked to the later part of the draft for a cheaper TE with sure hands to go along with Scheffler? I'm liking Fauria out of UCLA or the kid out of Notre Dame but they will probably go in the 3rd to 4th Rd.


Pett and Scheff are both under contract for 2013 (Will Heller is a FA) so I don't expect the Lions to do much on the TE front. You can replace Heller with a UFA from college or take one late in the draft (6th/7th round).

I think the Lions are more committed to Pett than the fan base would like (he cost us a couple of games this year). Scheff has good hands for a TE so they aren't hurting there and have tons of holes elsewhere.



Scheffler had some huge catches but he had dropsies at time also and he is mostly an awful blocker unless he s lined up as a slot receiver. I think Heller gives a good performance, he s the best blocker of the three by far and seems to have more sure hands then Pettigrew. I wouldnt mind seeing them trade Pettigrew rather than go with the status quo. This is a good position for the Lions on paper but not in reality.


I agree with you completely. I don't know what Petts market value is (3rd - 5th round pick?), and it's going to suck watching him flourish somewhere else (and I think he would), but I don't think he will ever be the player he can be here. He's too far gone in this organization.


If Pettigrew cleans up his focus/hands he could have some big seasons bc he knows how to get open despite being pretty slow and does a great job shielding defenders with his body. Still I think he wont accomplish this regardless of who he plays for. Their are dime a dozen players at TE (like Heller) that block more reliably than Pettigrew and he has a propensity to come up with nagging injuries, he s already turning 28 soon - Im not sure he s "productive" in this league more than another 2 seasons.

Author:  rao [ January 7th, 2013, 8:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TE Situation

wjb21ndtown wrote:
rao wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
thelomasbrowns wrote:
Similar discussion going on with WJB somewhere else on the board, but I thought it would be good to list the rounds that the top 10 fantasy tight ends were taken:

1 Rob Gronkowski, NE 9 $39 Round 2
2 Jimmy Graham, NO 6 $36 Round 3
3 Antonio Gates, SD 7 $10 Undrafted
4 Vernon Davis, SF 9 $8 Round 1 (pick #6)
5 Jermichael Finley, GB 10 $7 Round 3
6 Aaron Hernandez, NE 9 $3 Round 4
7 Tony Gonzalez, ATL 7 $3 Round 1
8 Jason Witten, DAL 5 $2 Round 3
9 Fred Davis, WAS 10 $2 Round 2
10 Brandon Pettigrew, DET 5 $1 Round 1

So with the notable exception of Gates, it's obvious you're not getting a tight end if you wait until later rounds. Not sure where this line of thought (bargain basement TE to replace Pettigrew) originated from (probably goes back to the Oher/Pettigrew debate).


You read that and THAT'S your analysis? How about that most of the premier TEs come AFTER the first round, and that we DID reach for Pett? 4 of the TEs on your list are day 2 picks, and those are the BEST TEs in the GAME. What happens when you extend it out?


He's not wrong, even when to go out to the top 25 virtually all are drafted in the 2nd or 3rd round. You are also right though in that it seems like your better waiting till day 2 to get a TE and use your first rounder on a more premium position.

I'd really like to see Pett under a new coaching staff before he is let go. All the receivers have the dropsies, so I dont know if Pett should really be singled out. I think a lot of Petts drops are just more visible because he gets targeted a lot for first downs and in the endzone.


Call it what you want, IMO that analysis shows that you should NEVER pick a TE in round 1, period, and shows how disgusting it was that we picked Pett in the first round.

It's not necessary, and you can get better TEs later, flat out. Extend that list to the top 15 or 20 TEs and see what happens to the rounds picked... I bet it starts getting deeper and deeper in the draft.


I didn't type them all out in my last post, but in the top 25 TEs I believe only Owen Daniels was drafted after the third round when you look at 11-25. That's when looking at Fantasy TEs though so you may look at it differently if your not looking for a pass catching TE.

Author:  kdsberman [ January 7th, 2013, 9:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TE Situation

I think the coaching staff likes Pettigrew too much to even think about them looking into a different TE. And lets be honest, Pettigrew does not suck. Frustrating at times, but far from sucking.

Author:  I.E. [ January 7th, 2013, 9:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TE Situation

Holy crap - Pettigrew is almost 28 already? Wow.

I wouldn't give up on the guy. Just like the Pack shouldn't give up on Finley because he's had a terrible year. Both guys should call up Tim Jennings and ask him what the heck he did in the off-season. Last year, Jennings had a ton of dropped INTs (right in his hands). He did something in the offseason - some kind of catching workout - that turned him into Mr. Goodhands.

Author:  thelomasbrowns [ January 7th, 2013, 10:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TE Situation

I.E. wrote:
Holy crap - Pettigrew is almost 28 already? Wow.

I wouldn't give up on the guy. Just like the Pack shouldn't give up on Finley because he's had a terrible year. Both guys should call up Tim Jennings and ask him what the heck he did in the off-season. Last year, Jennings had a ton of dropped INTs (right in his hands). He did something in the offseason - some kind of catching workout - that turned him into Mr. Goodhands.


While you're at it, you can ask the Bears how well drafting their TEs in the later rounds has worked out for them.

And wjb, using "second day" to describe the 2nd round is ridiculous...you're using a term that is tied to the old way the draft used to be set up to describe today's draft.

Author:  The Legend [ January 7th, 2013, 11:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: TE Situation

I.E. wrote:
Holy crap - Pettigrew is almost 28 already? Wow.

I wouldn't give up on the guy. Just like the Pack shouldn't give up on Finley because he's had a terrible year. Both guys should call up Tim Jennings and ask him what the heck he did in the off-season. Last year, Jennings had a ton of dropped INTs (right in his hands). He did something in the offseason - some kind of catching workout - that turned him into Mr. Goodhands.


yeah he is 6-7 months older than calvin johnson despite being in the league two years less. I just dont think 28 year olds that have already played as much as Pettigrew have that much room to grow. If he was going to become great it probably already would have happened by now...people get a little confused I think bc their probably are players that were in Pettigrew s draft class that are still 24-25 years old.

Willie Young is a similar case, where he is older than Avril but in the league 2 years less and people just think you can let Avril walk and plug and play Willie Young without a drop off. I dont think so

Willie Young (DOB Sept 1985) 3 career sacks, 25 tackles, 0 Forced Fumbles/recoveries/INTs, 1 pass defensed, 1 tackle for loss
Cliff Avril (DOB April 1986): 39.5 career sacks, 16 forced fumbles, 5 fumble recoveries, 13 passes defensed, 13 tackles for loss, 1 INT, 2 TDs

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