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 I'm done... 
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Post Re: I'm done...
Fair enough Pablo.

I'm not done, though. I got through 0-16, I'll sure as hell get through 7-9 (if that's where we end up).

Yes, this season is tougher because of higher expectations. But I want to have those higher expectations. Give me a Lions team that has a shot at winning the division and blows it over a Lions team that loses every game any day.

I love the sport. I enjoy watching the sport. The W's, the playoff chances, the superbowls (if ever!) are a nice icing on the cake. But I watch it because I love the sport. You think I'd have picked the Lions as my team to support otherwise?

If the day ever comes when they win it all, I'll be happy as a pig in muck. Between then, I'll enjoy tuning in to every game - probably with the fatalistic feeling of "how will be f this up?" that comes with being a Lions fan - but I'll enjoy every game.

I'm not a decision maker at Ford Field. The standard I "hold the team to" makes the square root of f all difference to how the team performs. So I'll hold them to a standard of "entertain me each Sunday" - and if they are playing in the NFL, they'll entertain me, because I like the sport.


December 18th, 2013, 8:53 am
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Post Re: I'm done...
To Yosetvo's comment:

I think what is the most painful was made obvious during the game. The announcers began speaking about how Stafford is in a 94 MILLION dollar contract. His game check probably equals or surpasses the YEARLY salary of those fans who come to pay HIS salary, and that of others of course. So if you've invested HARD earned money from an actual job instead of a game, you expect to get some return on your investment. To see the laxidasical, "I didn't play well, got to do better, and move on" attitude from our players is not, and SHOULD NOT be acceptable. I remember when I played football, YEARS AGO (we're talking junior high, that's how good I was) if you screwed up, you were running the stands, and sprints, and laps and all kinds of other not so fun things because you screwed up. Now, these guys are coddled, and babied, and allowed to get away with murder (see Hernandez).

What I would like to see is someone start and promote a KICKSTARTER.com "Buy the Lions" campaign that will put the Ford's squarely on notice, that their mediocre mindset is no longer acceptable. It hasn't been for years! If the Kickstarter idea caught wings, and fans would donate, and then ESPN got wind of it, the attention COULD free the Lions up to be purchased by somebody like Dombrowski, or someone who has a clue as to how to run a championship organization.

Just my 2 cents...

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2 Chronicles 10:14, "if my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and I will forgive their sin and will heal their land."


December 18th, 2013, 9:16 am
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Post Re: I'm done...
WarEr4Christ wrote:
To Yosetvo's comment:

I think what is the most painful was made obvious during the game. The announcers began speaking about how Stafford is in a 94 MILLION dollar contract. His game check probably equals or surpasses the YEARLY salary of those fans who come to pay HIS salary, and that of others of course. So if you've invested HARD earned money from an actual job instead of a game, you expect to get some return on your investment. To see the laxidasical, "I didn't play well, got to do better, and move on" attitude from our players is not, and SHOULD NOT be acceptable. I remember when I played football, YEARS AGO (we're talking junior high, that's how good I was) if you screwed up, you were running the stands, and sprints, and laps and all kinds of other not so fun things because you screwed up. Now, these guys are coddled, and babied, and allowed to get away with murder (see Hernandez).

What I would like to see is someone start and promote a KICKSTARTER.com "Buy the Lions" campaign that will put the Ford's squarely on notice, that their mediocre mindset is no longer acceptable. It hasn't been for years! If the Kickstarter idea caught wings, and fans would donate, and then ESPN got wind of it, the attention COULD free the Lions up to be purchased by somebody like Dombrowski, or someone who has a clue as to how to run a championship organization.

Just my 2 cents...


Hernandez is going away for a very long time. I would have used Ray Lewis as your example.


December 18th, 2013, 9:46 am
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Post Re: I'm done...
m2karateman wrote:
yostevo wrote:
While I was at the game, I was completely amazed at how personally people seemed to take the events that were unfolding. There was a guy next to me who seemed as if he would have literally killed a few of the Lion's players if he had gotten his hands on them at the time. He was shaking and so enraged (not drinking mind you) that it was disturbing.

There was a couple behind me at the end of the game who sat there in with such shock, disbelief and horror written all over their faces you would have thought that they had just witnessed a murder. Faces in their hands, would not speak to each other and the whole 9 yards. Their lives appeared ruined.

I'm a Lions fan (35+ years) and I enjoy the NFL but I think that this source of entertainment (and I stress entertainment) has gotten out of control for some people. Take a breath. It's just a game and these people playing are only human. It's not an excuse for the way they played but man o man, why take it so personally? There were lives ruined yesterday and I think some people take it too far.

Not a dig at you Pablo, I completely understand and agree with your sentiments. I need to learn to get busier on Sundays doing more fruitful things as well. I just think people need to step away from the ledge and just allow it to be a source of entertainment and nothing more.


It really is all about wanting to see the team succeed and having your hopes dashed. People love a winner, and they become emotionally involved to the point of what you witnessed. I can say that at one time, I was the same way. Yelling at the TV, screaming at games so much so that I would see red. I want this team to win, I want them in the playoffs, and I want them to win a Super Bowl. Having a team that is depleted of talent is one thing. But having a team that has the talent necessary to succeed, only to watch them piss away their chances week after week can be maddening.

Yes, it is just a game. But the Detroit fans have been slapped around by this franchise long enough. The football fans want to enjoy what the hockey, basketball, baseball and other area fans have enjoyed. They want to be able to erase the 50+ years of crap this franchise has put on the field.

The best thing I could have done for myself was to become emotionally detached from this franchise. I don't feel compelled to purchase jerseys or shirts, I don't buy game tickets, and if they are sucking on TV, I simply turn the channel. Life is so much easier that way.


The bolded is exactly how I feel. You hope for the best each year but when it fails, you can walk away and it's just water under the bridge again till next year. True change will never occur until the current ownership hands over the reigns. If you can accept that, this is still a good source of entertainment.


Last edited by yostevo on December 18th, 2013, 11:36 am, edited 1 time in total.



December 18th, 2013, 11:20 am
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Post Re: I'm done...
BillySims wrote:
yostevo wrote:
While I was at the game, I was completely amazed at how personally people seemed to take the events that were unfolding. There was a guy next to me who seemed as if he would have literally killed a few of the Lion's players if he had gotten his hands on them at the time. He was shaking and so enraged (not drinking mind you) that it was disturbing.

There was a couple behind me at the end of the game who sat there in with such shock, disbelief and horror written all over their faces you would have thought that they had just witnessed a murder. Faces in their hands, would not speak to each other and the whole 9 yards. Their lives appeared ruined.

I'm a Lions fan (35+ years) and I enjoy the NFL but I think that this source of entertainment (and I stress entertainment) has gotten out of control for some people. Take a breath. It's just a game and these people playing are only human. It's not an excuse for the way they played but man o man, why take it so personally? There were lives ruined yesterday and I think some people take it too far.

Not a dig at you Pablo, I completely understand and agree with your sentiments. I need to learn to get busier on Sundays doing more fruitful things as well. I just think people need to step away from the ledge and just allow it to be a source of entertainment and nothing more.


=D> :Idea:

I used to be like that myself. But, after the Tigers won the WS in 84, I was sitting there in my living room about to go crazy wild. And suddenly, I thought, why am I about to party like there's no tomorrow? I didn't do anything but watch on TV. The WS win was suddenly kind of unfulfilling. I was glad we won, but, I didn't do anything but be a fan.


I was 10 years old and that was my first world championship of any kind. Great feeling and I must have had 5 cups of Pepsi.


December 18th, 2013, 11:23 am
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Post Re: I'm done...
WarEr4Christ wrote:
To Yosetvo's comment:

I think what is the most painful was made obvious during the game. The announcers began speaking about how Stafford is in a 94 MILLION dollar contract. His game check probably equals or surpasses the YEARLY salary of those fans who come to pay HIS salary, and that of others of course. So if you've invested HARD earned money from an actual job instead of a game, you expect to get some return on your investment. To see the laxidasical, "I didn't play well, got to do better, and move on" attitude from our players is not, and SHOULD NOT be acceptable. I remember when I played football, YEARS AGO (we're talking junior high, that's how good I was) if you screwed up, you were running the stands, and sprints, and laps and all kinds of other not so fun things because you screwed up. Now, these guys are coddled, and babied, and allowed to get away with murder (see Hernandez).

What I would like to see is someone start and promote a KICKSTARTER.com "Buy the Lions" campaign that will put the Ford's squarely on notice, that their mediocre mindset is no longer acceptable. It hasn't been for years! If the Kickstarter idea caught wings, and fans would donate, and then ESPN got wind of it, the attention COULD free the Lions up to be purchased by somebody like Dombrowski, or someone who has a clue as to how to run a championship organization.

Just my 2 cents...


I know, when you think of the contracts it blows your mind and you want accountability. The problem though is that we are to blame for player apathy. They are mega rich so the competitive nature of a lot of these professionals is not what it once was.

Remember Isiaah, Bird, Magic, and the NBA of those days? They would have sold their first born and executed your's to win an NBA championship. Not just one, but even after having won one. They wanted to own you. That attitude in sports is gone and we as fans are to blame. We go, we watch on TV, we have allowed them to get payed and now we complain about what we see.

These guys are not heros nor do they really need to be. My approach to it all has changed.


December 18th, 2013, 11:30 am
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Post Re: I'm done...
yostevo wrote:
WarEr4Christ wrote:
To Yosetvo's comment:

I think what is the most painful was made obvious during the game. The announcers began speaking about how Stafford is in a 94 MILLION dollar contract. His game check probably equals or surpasses the YEARLY salary of those fans who come to pay HIS salary, and that of others of course. So if you've invested HARD earned money from an actual job instead of a game, you expect to get some return on your investment. To see the laxidasical, "I didn't play well, got to do better, and move on" attitude from our players is not, and SHOULD NOT be acceptable. I remember when I played football, YEARS AGO (we're talking junior high, that's how good I was) if you screwed up, you were running the stands, and sprints, and laps and all kinds of other not so fun things because you screwed up. Now, these guys are coddled, and babied, and allowed to get away with murder (see Hernandez).

What I would like to see is someone start and promote a KICKSTARTER.com "Buy the Lions" campaign that will put the Ford's squarely on notice, that their mediocre mindset is no longer acceptable. It hasn't been for years! If the Kickstarter idea caught wings, and fans would donate, and then ESPN got wind of it, the attention COULD free the Lions up to be purchased by somebody like Dombrowski, or someone who has a clue as to how to run a championship organization.

Just my 2 cents...


I know, when you think of the contracts it blows your mind and you want accountability. The problem though is that we are to blame for player apathy. They are mega rich so the competitive nature of a lot of these professionals is not what it once was.

Remember Isiaah, Bird, Magic, and the NBA of those days? They would have sold their first born and executed your's to win an NBA championship. Not just one, but even after having won one. They wanted to own you. That attitude in sports is gone and we as fans are to blame. We go, we watch on TV, we have allowed them to get payed and now we complain about what we see.

These guys are not heros nor do they really need to be. My approach to it all has changed.


Good post. I do think there are some in the various professional sports today who are more about the game and winning than they are about the money they are paid. Remember, Tom Brady took much less than Peyton Manning some years back, even though Brady just won a SB. He realized that to win, it takes a team, not just a highly paid QB.

I agree that part of the biggest problem SOCIETY has today is putting sports stars, TV stars, movie stars and reality show participants on some kind of a pedestal and allowing them to make ridiculous demands in regards to not just salaries, but their expectations of being treated differently than the rest of society.

I truly believe that there are members of the Lions organization that are doing everything they can to win games. I think that there are those who would gladly give up half their salary to be able to guarantee a Super Bowl berth. Unfortunately, there are others who seem like they really don't care. And Stafford is one of them. To a point, so is Calvin. I don't expect these guys to be all rah, rah and going nuts when they aren't winning. But I do expect some level of accountability more than just the standard week in, week out 'we have to get better' comment. It's insulting when I hear it now.

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December 18th, 2013, 12:08 pm
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Post Re: I'm done...
One of the frustrations, and I think I know the way to fix it as well.

Tackling! I'm so tired of watching our DB's dive at a run to try and blow him up as compared to wrapping them up. I've actually had this discussion at work and here's our unproven theory. Reduce the padding, and take away the helmets or face masks. For one season the injuries will be horrendous, but once the message gets through to the players about HOW to tackle, HOW to do your job without the safety nets of padding and helmets and face masks, then you'll see better play.

As for the players: ALL pay should be incentive based. You win the game you get this amount, you LOSE the game you get half. You lose because of a lack of discipline, repeated penalties, or personal fouls, and you DON'T get paid at all. Tell me how quickly the culture would change then?

_________________
2 Chronicles 10:14, "if my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and I will forgive their sin and will heal their land."


December 18th, 2013, 12:19 pm
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Post Re: I'm done...
m2karateman wrote:
yostevo wrote:
WarEr4Christ wrote:
To Yosetvo's comment:

I think what is the most painful was made obvious during the game. The announcers began speaking about how Stafford is in a 94 MILLION dollar contract. His game check probably equals or surpasses the YEARLY salary of those fans who come to pay HIS salary, and that of others of course. So if you've invested HARD earned money from an actual job instead of a game, you expect to get some return on your investment. To see the laxidasical, "I didn't play well, got to do better, and move on" attitude from our players is not, and SHOULD NOT be acceptable. I remember when I played football, YEARS AGO (we're talking junior high, that's how good I was) if you screwed up, you were running the stands, and sprints, and laps and all kinds of other not so fun things because you screwed up. Now, these guys are coddled, and babied, and allowed to get away with murder (see Hernandez).

What I would like to see is someone start and promote a KICKSTARTER.com "Buy the Lions" campaign that will put the Ford's squarely on notice, that their mediocre mindset is no longer acceptable. It hasn't been for years! If the Kickstarter idea caught wings, and fans would donate, and then ESPN got wind of it, the attention COULD free the Lions up to be purchased by somebody like Dombrowski, or someone who has a clue as to how to run a championship organization.

Just my 2 cents...


I know, when you think of the contracts it blows your mind and you want accountability. The problem though is that we are to blame for player apathy. They are mega rich so the competitive nature of a lot of these professionals is not what it once was.

Remember Isiaah, Bird, Magic, and the NBA of those days? They would have sold their first born and executed your's to win an NBA championship. Not just one, but even after having won one. They wanted to own you. That attitude in sports is gone and we as fans are to blame. We go, we watch on TV, we have allowed them to get payed and now we complain about what we see.

These guys are not heros nor do they really need to be. My approach to it all has changed.


Good post. I do think there are some in the various professional sports today who are more about the game and winning than they are about the money they are paid. Remember, Tom Brady took much less than Peyton Manning some years back, even though Brady just won a SB. He realized that to win, it takes a team, not just a highly paid QB.

I agree that part of the biggest problem SOCIETY has today is putting sports stars, TV stars, movie stars and reality show participants on some kind of a pedestal and allowing them to make ridiculous demands in regards to not just salaries, but their expectations of being treated differently than the rest of society.

I truly believe that there are members of the Lions organization that are doing everything they can to win games. I think that there are those who would gladly give up half their salary to be able to guarantee a Super Bowl berth. Unfortunately, there are others who seem like they really don't care. And Stafford is one of them. To a point, so is Calvin. I don't expect these guys to be all rah, rah and going nuts when they aren't winning. But I do expect some level of accountability more than just the standard week in, week out 'we have to get better' comment. It's insulting when I hear it now.


There are still athletes that care but even the ones (Brady/Manning) you mentioned are more cut from our generation's cloth than the athletes today. RGIII gets essentially demoted and he's told it's about protecting his health and he accepts that by saying "It's the coach's decision yada yada". Meanwhile, he's losing his locker room street cred. Do you think Brady or Manning would have accepted that so easily? Why would RGIII take it? He's already made to the NFL, achieved a great deal of fame, has endorsements and is getting paid in a big fat way. That's really what today's athlete is all about IMO. If they run into a Super Bowl along the way even better.


December 18th, 2013, 1:36 pm
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Post Re: I'm done...
WarEr4Christ wrote:
One of the frustrations, and I think I know the way to fix it as well.

Tackling! I'm so tired of watching our DB's dive at a run to try and blow him up as compared to wrapping them up. I've actually had this discussion at work and here's our unproven theory. Reduce the padding, and take away the helmets or face masks. For one season the injuries will be horrendous, but once the message gets through to the players about HOW to tackle, HOW to do your job without the safety nets of padding and helmets and face masks, then you'll see better play.

As for the players: ALL pay should be incentive based. You win the game you get this amount, you LOSE the game you get half. You lose because of a lack of discipline, repeated penalties, or personal fouls, and you DON'T get paid at all. Tell me how quickly the culture would change then?

You really hit the nail on the head here. It amazes me that there isn't a more disciplined system of pay. There are a ton of logistics to consider,truth be told, but it would be the only way to get the modern athlete to reverse their motivation for the game.

Also, if they don't live up to contractual expectations, they lose money.


December 18th, 2013, 1:45 pm
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Post Re: I'm done...
"I'll try harder next time... now let me get back to to shopping for a Bentley...."


December 18th, 2013, 3:32 pm
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