View unanswered posts | View active topics It is currently November 14th, 2018, 3:25 pm



Reply to topic  [ 76 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next
 Caldwell. 
Author Message
Rookie Player of the Year

Joined: November 28th, 2007, 12:50 pm
Posts: 2360
Location: Newport Beach, Ca
Post Re: Caldwell.
The even bigger news is number one OL coach Ron Prince is rumored to also have been fired. Number two, Martha didn't block the firing even though she very openly loved having Caldwell on the staff. She could have easily blocked Quinn with numerous legit reason why Caldwell should be kept. It's nice to see that the GM really does have the faith of the owner backing him and the power to make changes he feels are needed.

It looks like the Lions are going to give a good look around the league. So far they are reported to be looking at Patricia, Vrabel, Wilks, and Shurmur. They are also looking at Austin in house, so that covers the Rooney rule. They are slanting towards the defense, even the one offensive coach comes from a team with a top tier defense. I'm not a fan of the Vrabel and Austin options, everyone else I could live with.


January 1st, 2018, 5:24 pm
Profile
Veteran NFL Head Coach

Joined: February 11th, 2005, 3:01 pm
Posts: 5081
Location: WSU
Post Re: Caldwell.
regularjoe12 wrote:
Am I the only one here who wants us to look at fox? I think he overachieved in Chicago. I know what their record is, but I also know they have maybe 1 WRthat would even make our practice squad. You can't win in today's league if no one can catch the ball. I personally think Chicago has one of the best front 7 on defense in the league...and a couple of those guys play for Chicago because they followed fox.


you probably are the only one. Fox overachieved and Caldwell underachieved? Its amazing how we think of our Lions!


January 1st, 2018, 5:40 pm
Profile
Veteran NFL Head Coach

Joined: February 11th, 2005, 3:01 pm
Posts: 5081
Location: WSU
Post Re: Caldwell.
rao wrote:
The even bigger news is number one OL coach Ron Prince is rumored to also have been fired. Number two, Martha didn't block the firing even though she very openly loved having Caldwell on the staff. She could have easily blocked Quinn with numerous legit reason why Caldwell should be kept. It's nice to see that the GM really does have the faith of the owner backing him and the power to make changes he feels are needed.

It looks like the Lions are going to give a good look around the league. So far they are reported to be looking at Patricia, Vrabel, Wilks, and Shurmur. They are also looking at Austin in house, so that covers the Rooney rule. They are slanting towards the defense, even the one offensive coach comes from a team with a top tier defense. I'm not a fan of the Vrabel and Austin options, everyone else I could live with.


Austin seems to get a look just to fill the Rooney rule without being a legitimate candidate. Everyone knows who the lead dog in this race is. Its really going to come down to weather or not Patricia thinks the job is a good enough opportunity to give up the life he has in MA. The other candidates only come in to play if Patricia says no. Thats not a thorough search, IMO.

Patricia may have a hard time filling out his coaching staff particularly if the Patriots make another deep playoff run so it makes sense why Quinn would only fire Caldwell and Prince for now.


January 1st, 2018, 6:01 pm
Profile
Veteran NFL Head Coach

Joined: February 11th, 2005, 3:01 pm
Posts: 5081
Location: WSU
Post Re: Caldwell.
njroar wrote:
Just posting this here since Patricia was compared to Crennel and Wies. Patricia is not the same. This is from November btw.

https://www.si.com/mmqb/2016/11/28/nfl- ... ts-defense


its from November 2016...belichik has input on every play offensive, defensive and ST that the Patriots run. the aeronautical engineering stuff thats interesting but not sure it helps him lead the Lions and as for the "cheat sheet" the Patriots defenses havent really been that special in recent years. Belichick in NE is the ultimate micromanager and control with input on every play call offense defense or ST. Belichick is the coaching talent in NE, everyone else is just gathering the information Belichick wants so that he can make a decision. Belichik s coordinators fail when they leave bc they have less autonomy even in there NE coordinator roles than most of the leagues coordinators usually have so they dont even have the coaching on there own side of the field figured out yet and have to also be involved with the other units. With the Lions its not as simple of a job where the offense is just all set and dominant and getting the defense up to an average or above average level will be all it takes to win. Lions need quite a bit of help on both sides - at least Patricia does have some OL experience although it was 10+ years ago.


January 1st, 2018, 6:20 pm
Profile
Team MVP

Joined: September 25th, 2007, 3:20 am
Posts: 3283
Post Re: Caldwell.
The Legend wrote:
rao wrote:
The even bigger news is number one OL coach Ron Prince is rumored to also have been fired. Number two, Martha didn't block the firing even though she very openly loved having Caldwell on the staff. She could have easily blocked Quinn with numerous legit reason why Caldwell should be kept. It's nice to see that the GM really does have the faith of the owner backing him and the power to make changes he feels are needed.

It looks like the Lions are going to give a good look around the league. So far they are reported to be looking at Patricia, Vrabel, Wilks, and Shurmur. They are also looking at Austin in house, so that covers the Rooney rule. They are slanting towards the defense, even the one offensive coach comes from a team with a top tier defense. I'm not a fan of the Vrabel and Austin options, everyone else I could live with.


Austin seems to get a look just to fill the Rooney rule without being a legitimate candidate. Everyone knows who the lead dog in this race is. Its really going to come down to weather or not Patricia thinks the job is a good enough opportunity to give up the life he has in MA. The other candidates only come in to play if Patricia says no. Thats not a thorough search, IMO.

Patricia may have a hard time filling out his coaching staff particularly if the Patriots make another deep playoff run so it makes sense why Quinn would only fire Caldwell and Prince for now.


There are 3 minority candidates, so Austin isn't only getting the interview due to the Rooney Rule. Wilks and The GB LB (also asked permission )coach would satisfy the rule, so it's nonsense to think it's not a legitimate interview. His boss getting fired makes me think it's a courtesy interview for practice in his other interviews he'll take this offseason, even if it doesn't make sense to bring him back and promote him.

Vrabel doesn't have enough experience. 1 season doesn't show a record. Fox, i think a weak division when he was in Carolina, so-so in Denver with the talent they had and now Chicago makes him someone suited for a coordinator, but not HC. Shurmur did amazing things this year in Minnesota, but he didn't do much as HC for the Browns. The reason Patricia makes the most sense to me, is because unlike the others under him who moved on, only Patricia changed how Belechik handled personnel. He started letting contract players walk, and plugged people in on the defensive side. It showed Patricia's ability to adjust, which is something Schwartz and Caldwell had issues with.

If Patricia is the guy and lays out who he would want for Coordinators, Quinn could make those hires before the season ended so it's all in place, should the Pats make the Super Bowl. They're very close, so I'm sure that would/could be communicated. Lack of candidates also assumes that all the decent names would be hired prior. The candidate pool for coordinator jobs is much bigger than HC candidates.


January 1st, 2018, 6:32 pm
Profile
Mr. Irrelevant

Joined: February 10th, 2005, 6:52 pm
Posts: 974
Location: Linden, MI
Post Re: Caldwell.
I don't know who I would want for the new HC per se, but I know who I do not want. No Josh McD for me. Please. Like free agency, these things usually don't work out as planned, and the coach ends up being not all that. Hoping for a good pick, who turns out to be one of those nice surprises that lasts a long time. Say like Sean Payton in NO or Tomlin in Pitt.

_________________
OK. Schwartz is fired, the fans are happy, now what?


January 1st, 2018, 8:02 pm
Profile
Veteran NFL Head Coach

Joined: February 11th, 2005, 3:01 pm
Posts: 5081
Location: WSU
Post Re: Caldwell.
Quote:
There are 3 minority candidates, so Austin isn't only getting the interview due to the Rooney Rule. Wilks and The GB LB (also asked permission )coach would satisfy the rule, so it's nonsense to think it's not a legitimate interview. His boss getting fired makes me think it's a courtesy interview for practice in his other interviews he'll take this offseason, even if it doesn't make sense to bring him back and promote him.


my mistake with the minority interview but i think its funny you say "its nonsense" and then you admit its a "courtesy interview." i like austin and it d be interesting to have continuity with developing players not having to start over learning process but have potentially better executive decisions during games. might ve been another win this year (PIT).

Quote:
Vrabel doesn't have enough experience. 1 season doesn't show a record. Fox, i think a weak division when he was in Carolina, so-so in Denver with the talent they had and now Chicago makes him someone suited for a coordinator, but not HC. Shurmur did amazing things this year in Minnesota, but he didn't do much as HC for the Browns. The reason Patricia makes the most sense to me, is because unlike the others under him who moved on, only Patricia changed how Belechik handled personnel. He started letting contract players walk, and plugged people in on the defensive side. It showed Patricia's ability to adjust, which is something Schwartz and Caldwell had issues with.


Vrabel has head coach personality, charisma and leadership written all over him. I agree his experience is limited but his recent playing career commands respect from a lot of the players. he s not my top coach but i dont think he should be quickly dismissed. Shurmur had a good year and probably didnt get a fair shot with the Browns. I think he s the only offensive coach Quinn is interviewing though so maybe odds are stacked against him in that respect.

Disagree on last part - Lawyer Milloy, Richard Sherman, Asante Samuel and many others. Belichik has been letting his players walk and getting away with it for a long time and it didnt start with Patricia.

Quote:
If Patricia is the guy and lays out who he would want for Coordinators, Quinn could make those hires before the season ended so it's all in place, should the Pats make the Super Bowl. They're very close, so I'm sure that would/could be communicated. Lack of candidates also assumes that all the decent names would be hired prior. The candidate pool for coordinator jobs is much bigger than HC candidates.


Regardless, it looks like Quinn thinks some of the Lions current coaches might be worthy of being on the next staff and for now he s holding on to them to give his hire first shot at them. Caldwell had to be held responsible for never adjusting his opening gameplans and not being able to keep up with the game pace, too few men but Cooter made a major impact on Stafford and Alan Williams seems to be a solid coach with coordinator experience as well.


January 1st, 2018, 8:52 pm
Profile
Team MVP

Joined: September 25th, 2007, 3:20 am
Posts: 3283
Post Re: Caldwell.
I agree Quinn is smart for keeping rest of coaches in place. Gives the new HC options and it gives Quinn the ability to use them as resources prepping for the draft/offseason. Depending on his choice, that's a month that could be spent preparing ahead.

I also believe Vrabel will make a decent HC eventually. I think 1 season is not enough, just as Nagy is getting a lot of talk in KC, but he only took over play-calling mid-season. I also think a few teams will try to copycat Rams and Eagles and promote younger coordinators or position coaches that haven't had the experience. McVay is a once in a lifetime coach, so I think a lot will fall in that trap. But it's always been a copycat league.

"Nonsense" as in just to fill the Rooney Rule. He could wow Quinn and get hired, but I think it's entirely unlikely. They didn't have to grant him one, so that's why I think it's a courtesy, especially since it's tomorrow, giving him the whole offseason to get prepared for future interviews after he gets out of Quinn's office tomorrow.


January 1st, 2018, 9:55 pm
Profile
3rd Round Selection

Joined: October 24th, 2005, 6:23 am
Posts: 1133
Post Re: Caldwell.
As long as Quinn kicks anyone out of the interview that utters the words, "A great quarterback can hide a lot of holes."
or
"You don't have to run the ball much, just be effective whren you do."

I'm kind of defense minded when it comes to head coach candidates, though Shumer wouldn't bother me. Actually would kind of like it if it turns out that way since it will weaken the Vikings at the same time.

To tell the truth, I want a guy that puts an emphasis on line play. The closest we got with Caldwell was a defense that was suppose to bring the pressure with just four guys. Unfortunately, it wasn't a defense that had control of the line of scrimmage as part of the scheme, just pressure. It showed in our inability to stop the running games of opponents.

Of course, if we do get a guy like that it will mean having a running game instead of a suggestion of one. One of the best ways to help an offensive line is to mix in the run with the pass on a fairly regular basis hitting all along the LoS using both drive blocking and zone blocking schemes so the defense gets hit too.

I have not been a big fan of Stafford over the years, but have really like the way he has improved. Trouble is we don't have anyone on the roster with his kind of talent should he get hurt ala Rogers. A solid offensive line would at least give Ruddock a fighting chance, especially with a running game.


January 3rd, 2018, 9:14 pm
Profile
Rookie Player of the Year

Joined: November 28th, 2007, 12:50 pm
Posts: 2360
Location: Newport Beach, Ca
Post Re: Caldwell.
Austin is interviewing for the Bengals DC opening. I wonder if the Lions already know what they are going to do or if Austin is just seeing the writing on the wall and looking to get his new job lined up.


January 4th, 2018, 10:55 pm
Profile
Veteran NFL Head Coach

Joined: February 11th, 2005, 3:01 pm
Posts: 5081
Location: WSU
Post Re: Caldwell.
rao wrote:
Austin is interviewing for the Bengals DC opening. I wonder if the Lions already know what they are going to do or if Austin is just seeing the writing on the wall and looking to get his new job lined up.



yeah i feel the same way about it, does he know something we dont know?


January 4th, 2018, 11:32 pm
Profile
Martha Firestone Ford
User avatar

Joined: May 7th, 2005, 3:25 pm
Posts: 9082
Location: Earth/Sagittarius Dwarf Galaxy
Post Re: Caldwell.
The Legend wrote:
rao wrote:
Austin is interviewing for the Bengals DC opening. I wonder if the Lions already know what they are going to do or if Austin is just seeing the writing on the wall and looking to get his new job lined up.



yeah i feel the same way about it, does he know something we dont know?


Austin is still under contract to the Lions. So, they had to give permission for that interview to take place.


January 5th, 2018, 1:19 am
Profile
Rookie Player of the Year

Joined: November 28th, 2007, 12:50 pm
Posts: 2360
Location: Newport Beach, Ca
Post Re: Caldwell.
BillySims wrote:
The Legend wrote:
rao wrote:
Austin is interviewing for the Bengals DC opening. I wonder if the Lions already know what they are going to do or if Austin is just seeing the writing on the wall and looking to get his new job lined up.



yeah i feel the same way about it, does he know something we dont know?


Austin is still under contract to the Lions. So, they had to give permission for that interview to take place.


Exactly what I was thinking about. The rumor was that Patricia has been their target, so maybe they already have a "handshake" deal in place and are just going through the motions. This is just wild speculation, but I was also thinking about Vrabel and the possibility they could be trying to steal him as DC. If they hired Patricia and Vrabel doesn't get an HC spot, they could offer him the DC and assistant HC jobs to steal him. That's probably a completely crazy idea and it would also require Vrabel to leave his buddy Crennel, so like I said crazy.


January 5th, 2018, 12:13 pm
Profile
3rd Round Selection

Joined: October 24th, 2005, 6:23 am
Posts: 1133
Post Re: Caldwell.
Not happy with the defensive scheme Austin uses here so if he leaves it won't bother me. Patricia is interviewing wih other teams as well, so i don't think there is a handshake deal in place. As far as I am concerned right now, if Austin leaves he can take JBC with him.


January 6th, 2018, 7:10 pm
Profile
Veteran NFL Head Coach

Joined: February 11th, 2005, 3:01 pm
Posts: 5081
Location: WSU
Post Re: Caldwell.
Jafo wrote:
Not happy with the defensive scheme Austin uses here so if he leaves it won't bother me. Patricia is interviewing wih other teams as well, so i don't think there is a handshake deal in place. As far as I am concerned right now, if Austin leaves he can take JBC with him.



its hard to say how austin would adjust his scheme if he was head coach. in other words, I think that a lot of the conservative play calls both offensive and defensive came from caldwell s approach as a head coach. thats how caldwell wanted to approach each game and he wasnt flexible with that regardless of the opponent. it sounds like quinn keeps emphasizing he wants someone who is flexible with scheme and game plans. this may be a coaching philosophy/tendency of caldwell s that quinn is identifying as a part of the lions problem. makes sense that quinn is now looking for the opposite much like the back and forth that sometimes happen with personalities ie one coach is a disciplinarian next coach is a players coach, etc.


January 6th, 2018, 9:09 pm
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic   [ 76 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 42 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.
Designed by STSoftware.