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 Disappointing Tigers 
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Post Re: Disappointing Tigers
BillySims wrote:
Where are those fantastic Managing skills that Leyland supposedly possesses?


Do you want him to manage the team to hit the ball and throw strikes and the the umpires to make correct calls? Be mad at Jim all you want but this is not his fault. He hasn't lost the locker room and he hasn't given up. Give this team a little time, they should turn it around. Now if they don't make the playoffs this year then I'm all for looking into a manager change.


May 26th, 2012, 8:00 am
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Post Re: Disappointing Tigers
aManNamedSuh wrote:
BillySims wrote:
Where are those fantastic Managing skills that Leyland supposedly possesses?


Do you want him to manage the team to hit the ball and throw strikes and the the umpires to make correct calls? Be mad at Jim all you want but this is not his fault. He hasn't lost the locker room and he hasn't given up. Give this team a little time, they should turn it around. Now if they don't make the playoffs this year then I'm all for looking into a manager change.


Yes, I want him to manage the team to hit the ball and throw strikes! As opposed to what? Umps make bad calls all the time. And when your whole team starts arguing balls and strikes, your going to get more bad ball and strike calls just out of spite. It's the managers job to reign it in on arguing with the umps. Under Sparky Anderson, you rarely saw a Tigers Player arguing with the Umps. That was Sparky's job! Frankly, this years group of Tigers are looking like a bunch of highly paid, spoiled rotten brats. Every game, it seems that at least 3 calls are argued by Tigers Players. The Umps will get mighty tired of hearing it at some point. I don't see the other teams doing it near as much. They let their managers do the arguing when it merits.

As for me being mad at Leyland. I'm not mad at Leyland. I'm sure he is a great person. But, he is WAY over rated as a Manager! Why are we so pathetic at driving in runs when we have runners at 2nd and 3rd with no outs? Because Leyland lets everyone step up to the plate swing for the fences. Which usually ends up without even 1 run crossing the plate after the next batter strikes out and then the following batter hits into a double play. But, what the heck. Just go up there and swing for the fences because we all know that Leyland does not comprehend small ball. So, he can't teach small ball. There is a saying for running backs in football. " Think 2 yards, get 20". This applies to hitting a baseball. "Think, Base Hit and score the runner at 3rd".

How much more time do you need to see what this years team is? After 40 games, we are a sub 500 team. 25% of the season is gone. If they are going to turn it around, they better do it quick. Or they will just be wasting their time and effort. Cleveland is young and gaining confidence every day. Especially, after just recently kicking us in the gonads.

I'm not saying fire Leyland right this moment. I was totally against giving him a new contract for many of the same reasons I gave above. But, especially, if this multi-Hundred Million $ team fails to make the playoffs, Leyland and Dumbrowski should have to walk the plank.


May 26th, 2012, 11:18 am
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Post Re: Disappointing Tigers
Worst defensive team I have ever seen in my life. Thats what $360million dollars and 500lbs on the corners buys you and they arent even the worst offenders


June 8th, 2012, 10:39 pm
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Post Re: Disappointing Tigers
Boesch has hit better the past few games, but all around, he's got to be one of the worst regular everyday OFers in the game. He's awful all around. His swing makes me want to hurl.

Raburn and boesch have F'd this team more than anyone.

We have 2 .300 hitters hurt, our everyday catcher, and our #2 pitcher...I don't expect a 10 game winning streak, but damn, back to back wins once a month is too much?

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June 8th, 2012, 11:09 pm
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Post Re: Disappointing Tigers
2 nice wins on the road at cincy. certainly didnt play lights out and made plenty of mistakes but its nice to be able to put together what it takes to win the close ones. lets see if this can spur something. they really arent that far behind in the standings given how sloppy they have played. smyly and fister being hurt doesnt have me overly excited for a big run just yet but those wins were a sign that the team still cares


June 11th, 2012, 11:50 am
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Post Re: Disappointing Tigers
I'm more worried about dirks. He's a good hitter who can draw a walk. Good outfielder with some speed. They need to let him steal, along with ajax. Hell, I'd he comes back, let him, berry, and Ajax play the field. That's some excellent speed. Young and boesch can DH.

Raburn had a great game in LF the other day, two great catches.

Miggy has made some errors, but he's made some excellent plays. I'll take it for a pace of .320, 32 hr, and 115 RBI.

Fielder has been worse in the field and hasn't shown a lot of pop yet. Miggy is a true hitter, fielder is not. Teams don't over shift for miggy like they do for fielder. Too many DPs for prince. Peralta got the shaft on his 2 bad throws that cost them the first. Chubs game. Runner was out on both plays. Bad throws but even worse calls.

Get dirks, smyly, and avila back and they should be doing fine. Please cut young when vmart is healthy. Al-Al will be huge for the pen when he gets back. Villarreal has been lights out so far - love his stuff, it's filthy.

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I have no faith this team will win a game the rest of the year. The kitties finish at 7-9 and Miss the playoffs as GB wins out and takes it from the kitties.
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June 17th, 2012, 2:56 pm
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Post Re: Disappointing Tigers
conversion02 wrote:
I'm more worried about dirks. He's a good hitter who can draw a walk. Good outfielder with some speed. They need to let him steal, along with ajax. Hell, I'd he comes back, let him, berry, and Ajax play the field. That's some excellent speed. Young and boesch can DH.

Raburn had a great game in LF the other day, two great catches.

Miggy has made some errors, but he's made some excellent plays. I'll take it for a pace of .320, 32 hr, and 115 RBI.

Fielder has been worse in the field and hasn't shown a lot of pop yet. Miggy is a true hitter, fielder is not. Teams don't over shift for miggy like they do for fielder. Too many DPs for prince. Peralta got the shaft on his 2 bad throws that cost them the first. Chubs game. Runner was out on both plays. Bad throws but even worse calls.

Get dirks, smyly, and avila back and they should be doing fine. Please cut young when vmart is healthy. Al-Al will be huge for the pen when he gets back. Villarreal has been lights out so far - love his stuff, it's filthy.


Well said. Id love to see Valverde gone too, but obviously that would never happen, I just cant stand the guy.

I heard Vmart is supposed to be back next month, is that true?

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June 17th, 2012, 4:11 pm
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Post Re: Disappointing Tigers
Quote:
I'm more worried about dirks. He's a good hitter who can draw a walk. Good outfielder with some speed. They need to let him steal, along with ajax. Hell, I'd he comes back, let him, berry, and Ajax play the field. That's some excellent speed. Young and boesch can DH.


Agree that Dirks being out a little longer is disappointing but Im not sure that he will turn out to be an everyday starter down the road. He s a nice well balanced player, I think if he continues to hit for average he could fit well as a No 2 hitter for us, 10-15 HRs/season but I dont see him as a big base stealer. Possibly he s just a good 4th outfielder. I definitely see your point though - an OF of Berry/Jackson/Dirks can cover a lot of ground. At that point though - the Tigers would have to make a decision on Delmon Young or Brennan Boesch. If those guys come around though Berry will probably head to the minors and come back as a pinchrunner, defensive sub for the month of September.

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Raburn had a great game in LF the other day, two great catches.


He also had some nice extra base hits, it d be nice bc he definitely has the potential to do more damage with the bat than either of Worth or Santiago.

Quote:
Miggy has made some errors, but he's made some excellent plays. I'll take it for a pace of .320, 32 hr, and 115 RBI.


He s also missed a lot of balls that werent called errors, eaten bunts and double plays. It doesnt truly make sense to have him there until there is a viable hitter to use as a DH. The fans turned on Inge to the point where he essentially had no chance to get anything done here in Detroit but his .750 OPS and 30 RBIs since he s gone to Oakland show how stupid mass fan sentiment is. That production would have helped the Tigers somewhere, and the Tigers are paying his contract anyway. He s hit better then Santiago, Raburn, and Worth and is a good fielder though he was lost at 2b.

Quote:
Fielder has been worse in the field and hasn't shown a lot of pop yet. Miggy is a true hitter, fielder is not. Teams don't over shift for miggy like they do for fielder. Too many DPs for prince. Peralta got the shaft on his 2 bad throws that cost them the first. Chubs game. Runner was out on both plays. Bad throws but even worse calls.


Fielder has also stunk in the field - again why are him and Cabrera in the field at the same time when there is no viable DH? Egos - thats why. His hitting though has been good considering the lack of protection behind him in the lineup.

The Peralta plays - I think they had the out at 2B but it looked like Fielder came off the bag at 1b. Still two terrible plays by Peralta, and that Santiago was late covering 2b and that Fielder is 5'10 at 1B didnt help.

Quote:
Get dirks, smyly, and avila back and they should be doing fine. Please cut young when vmart is healthy. Al-Al will be huge for the pen when he gets back. Villarreal has been lights out so far - love his stuff, it's filthy.


The division stinks so we are in good shape. Chicago wasnt aggressively playing for a championship in the offseason and I think they have a chance to fade. Cleveland is an up and coming team and the Royals might be a factor too if some of there guys come around.

Villareal and Below have been huge in the bullpen. Coke has been very good and Benoit has been dominant. Valverde obvioulsy leaves a lot to be desired. If Dotel and Al Al come back strong, is there a chance that Valverde gets displaced and Benoit closes? If Valverde doesnt turn it around who is the closer next year? Could it be Villareal, Benoit? Would they move Scherzer into the role if Turner and Smyly can sustain some success in the rotation? At least we dont see them pretending that Schlereth is the answer to anything these days.


June 18th, 2012, 9:46 pm
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Post Re: Disappointing Tigers
Trade bait?

Who do we have that is potential trade bait?

Minors/prospects -

Castellanos 3B, doubt they trade him but if they do it would have to be a big return

Jacob Tuner SP - I dont think his value is quite as high as it was last season but he could also net a nice return and the Tigers might be more willing to seel him given there need for lefty starter and Drew Smyly's emergence. Verlander is under contract for a couple more years, and Scherzer/Porcello/Smyly/Fister are all under club control until 2014 and beyond - meaning they cant hit free agency and can be kept on the cheap.

Rob Brantly - hitting very well in the minors and is supposedly average defensively. Probably the No 3 prospect after Castellanos and Turner. Catchers that can hit should have some value and with Avila being so young I could see the Tigers moving him and using veteran backups like Laird or developing Bryan Holaday or James McCann as potential backups for Avila in the future.

Casey Crosby/ Andrew Oliver - I dont think these guys have much value though i ve seen there names listed in trade rumors. No trade would be centered around them, I feel like they would be throw ins in a trade that involved someone on the big league roster.

Tigers roster

Dirks/Boesch - I think both have shown some potential. Dirks is more well rounded, Boesch more power potential. Would one of them plus a couple minor leaguers be enough to get a bat like Carlos Quentin to hit 5th?

Young/Raburn - no value given either age, contract status and recent play.

Porcello/Scherzer - either might have a lot of value in a trade either for a more veteran starting pitcher or to land a bat if Turner shows he can hold his own.

Gerald Laird - he s been hitting better than usual and done well in an everyday role since Avila has been out. Probably more valuable to the Tigers than any other team though given how beaten up Avila tends to get.

I dont see a whole lot of other tradable assets that the Tigers would be willing to trade this season but they probably have enough to make at least one helpful trade for the stretch run.


June 18th, 2012, 10:04 pm
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Post Re: Disappointing Tigers
Why would you even include Verlanders name in a trade discussion, that makes no sense. And Scherzer has been darn near lights out his past few games. Why trade him? If ANYONE, get rid of Porcello.

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June 19th, 2012, 5:07 am
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Post Re: Disappointing Tigers
what on earth are you talking about? verlander was listed to show that the tigers have control of 5 Starting pitchers until 2014 or later. I didnt say anything about trading him. If Smyly and Turner show they are ready then there is an extra starting pitcher and inconsistent Max has some value. Scherzer was lights out in his last one game - not last few games which includes a 4 inning, 8 run game and the team losing 2 of his last 3 starts. He s got worlds of potential and I am a fan but he is as inconsistent as it gets. Either him or Porcello has trade value if they are serious about getting an older more consistent option or landing a regular 2nd baseman.

Im not advocating trading anyone, just hypothesizing which players might have value and which players the Tigers might be willing to trade in the right circumstances.


June 19th, 2012, 6:30 pm
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