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 Cornerbacks 
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Post Cornerbacks
Ras-I Dowling's stock is ascending, and if there's a run on CB's at the end of 1 or early 2nd, it will be interesting to see, not only if he's still there at 44, but would the Lions pull the trigger, or show preference for a LB. Also wondering about Davon House, have seen his standing listed all over the place, but doubt he will last to our 3rd round selection. Any perspectives?


April 10th, 2011, 10:29 am
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Post Re: Cornerbacks
I am almost to the point of wanting to trade every one of our picks beyond the 2nd round for future picks. And I want us to trade down at least once in each round.

It doesn't seem to matter where we are picking, the BPA just doesn't match our need almost anywhere in this draft.


April 10th, 2011, 11:43 am
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Post Re: Cornerbacks
Personally, I like Brandon Harris and would like to see the Lions get him in the late 1st/early 2nd. The dude can cover. I somewhat question his toughness and his height is a factor, but that's why he isn't an early 1st pick.

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April 11th, 2011, 11:05 pm
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Post Re: Cornerbacks
i was very high on harris but he really disappointed at the combine.did'nt run well and was shorter then expected coming in under 5,10.with his size and just average speed i cant see him being any thing more then a solid second corner.


April 12th, 2011, 9:03 am
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Post Re: Cornerbacks
allenslions wrote:
i was very high on harris but he really disappointed at the combine.did'nt run well and was shorter then expected coming in under 5,10.with his size and just average speed i cant see him being any thing more then a solid second corner.


And a solid second corner is something the Lions could desperately use, since they have nothing beyond a verifiable nickel back on their roster (Alfonso). I have a strong feeling Chris Houston is going to be gone once free agency hits.

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April 12th, 2011, 9:14 am
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Post Re: Cornerbacks
i dont think he could beat smith out for the second corner on this team.smith has much better speed and ball skills.now hopefully the lions address both starting corners.one with a high draft pick and the other with either resigning houston or another free agent.i have to disagree on houston leaving.the lions were very happy with his play last season and i think that as soon as the new cba is signed he will be one of detroit's first priorities .but if bengals decide not to franchise joeseph i could see the lions going after him hard. mayhew really loves him.


April 12th, 2011, 11:13 am
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Post Re: Cornerbacks
allenslions wrote:
i dont think he could beat smith out for the second corner on this team.smith has much better speed and ball skills.now hopefully the lions address both starting corners.one with a high draft pick and the other with either resigning houston or another free agent.i have to disagree on houston leaving.the lions were very happy with his play last season and i think that as soon as the new cba is signed he will be one of detroit's first priorities .but if bengals decide not to franchise joeseph i could see the lions going after him hard. mayhew really loves him.


I don't think Detroit wants Chris Houston to leave either. I just get the feeling he wants to move on. I could be wrong, but it almost seemed like the Lions approached his agent about his resigning toward the end of the season, and Houston wanted to hold off to see what he could get in free agency.

I understand that you are very high on Jimmy Smith. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. He has flaws, so does Patrick Peterson. In my opinion both relied more heavily on natural talents than on strong technique for the position. That comes back to bite a player in the NFL, particularly if they don't feel they need the coaching. Smith shooting off his mouth is an indication that he may not be as coachable as some would like. He may be a born again Christian, but that has little impact on the football field or even on someone's ego. Deion Sanders is a born again Christian, and his ego could fill a rail road car.

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April 12th, 2011, 11:31 am
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Post Re: Cornerbacks
allenslions wrote:
i was very high on harris but he really disappointed at the combine.did'nt run well and was shorter then expected coming in under 5,10.with his size and just average speed i cant see him being any thing more then a solid second corner.


Harris had the best mechanics at the combine. And 4.5 is bad speed? I'll be the first to admit he doesn't have the highest ceiling of all the cornerbacks, but mentally and mechanically, he's the best of the group. And mental and mechanical players will play more consistent football. He might not have the flash of the others, but he's got a lot less risk from play to play. He'd be a #1 with over the top help, but not a Revis or other lockdown corner, which you have to admit are not very common. He'd be a solid #2 easy though. Smith is my #5 corner because he's better suited as a safety, not to mention the off-field issues. I'd rather have someone mentally sound, then have a game like thanksgiving where a good corner in Alphonso Smith got mentally beat early, and then got burnt the rest of the game because he couldn't snap out of it.

If he makes it to #44, i hope we snag him, but I think he'll be gone long before that. I wouldn't hate him as the pick at #13, but he's not worth that high a pick, so I can hope for a trade down.


April 12th, 2011, 1:30 pm
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Post Re: Cornerbacks
njroar wrote:
Harris had the best mechanics at the combine. And 4.5 is bad speed? I'll be the first to admit he doesn't have the highest ceiling of all the cornerbacks, but mentally and mechanically, he's the best of the group. And mental and mechanical players will play more consistent football. He might not have the flash of the others, but he's got a lot less risk from play to play. He'd be a #1 with over the top help, but not a Revis or other lockdown corner, which you have to admit are not very common. He'd be a solid #2 easy though. Smith is my #5 corner because he's better suited as a safety, not to mention the off-field issues. I'd rather have someone mentally sound, then have a game like thanksgiving where a good corner in Alphonso Smith got mentally beat early, and then got burnt the rest of the game because he couldn't snap out of it.

If he makes it to #44, i hope we snag him, but I think he'll be gone long before that. I wouldn't hate him as the pick at #13, but he's not worth that high a pick, so I can hope for a trade down.


I agree that Harris looked the most fluid at the Combines in drills, and that includes Peterson and Amukamara. He looked effortless flipping his hips over to change directions while backpedaling. What concerns me is his poor vertical leap numbers (32"). That shows a lack of explosion, which is critical to CBs coming out of their backpedals to break on a ball. In college he could get away with a delay of a step, but not so much in the pros. I hate to judge the guy on just that single number, but it's a concern. Still, I have Harris as my third rated corner still, and I think he should still be a first rounder.

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April 12th, 2011, 4:00 pm
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Post Re: Cornerbacks
i,m not in love with smith i just have him rated above prince and he is the right choice at 13 unless you select an end but the lions are stacked at that position and i cant see them giving up on willie young so fast and they would have to because there is only so much playing time to go around.could they go that way?sure it could this is the team that selected three 1rd receivers in a row.lol.now for harris hey i liked him too but the fact is at his size and 4.5 speed is very weak and i challenge you to find me another starter in the league with his size and speed combo.you wont.hey i still have him as a 3rd guy and thats better then what former gm charlie casserly had to say about him.he said he would'nt even draft him.now thats harsh but it what alot of gm,s feel about him.oh and you have smith the consensus third best corner the guy who only saw an average two passes thrown at him a game a guy that held the number one receiver in this draft class to two catches. you want to move him to safety.ohkay


April 12th, 2011, 4:21 pm
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Post Re: Cornerbacks
Harris's Vertical was 35.5. Smith's 36. Peterson and Prince 38.

And Smith's 40 time was 4.46. If he had Peterson's 4.34, then you can call the difference big, because then you'd have to draw bigger comparison's between Smith's time and Prince's 4.43, since 4hundreds of a second are that much more important than 3hundreds. Smith's hips are terrible. Even Deion said he'd be moved to safety, and I'll put Deion's opinions about a corner above Casserly's. Casserly's player choices are what got him fired. When he was a scout for the Redskins, he got a good reputation for finding gems in the lower rounds, but as Belichick said, "Who's been wrong more than Charley Casserly since he left the Redskins? Wherever he's been, whatever he's done, his percentage is like a meteorologist."

Quote:
i challenge you to find me another starter in the league with his size and speed combo.you wont.


I love challenges... NFL starters with similiar size and speed.. just off top of head...

Tramon Williams(4.57), Ronde Barber(4.6), Joe Hayden(4.6), Brent Grimes(4.57) and if you think the .01 difference between Prince and Smith don't matter, you could add in Asante Samuel who ran a 4.49. I could probably find a few more if I spent some time looking.

Now granted, with smaller size and slower speed, you need better technique, which all of the above have, and it's something Harris has demonstrated to have. If I'm choosing between someone who's fast but crap technique and off-the-field issues or someone who's got the technique,has been thrown into the fire since day one, I'd be safer picking the latter. Smith might be able to turn it around, but after drafting a corner last year with the same skill set that we had to move to safety in Speivey, I'm not taking chances here, especially in the first round.


April 12th, 2011, 5:18 pm
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Post Re: Cornerbacks
all the corners you listed are 5,10 or bigger williams is 5,11 ,only grimes fits what i asked for and so far he is a one year wonder now where was grimes drafted?not in the first or second round.i,ll say it again i said he would be a fair second corner worthy of a third round pick. and no matter how much you like him is'nt gonna change that fact.but i believe he will be drafted by the eagles at pick 54


April 12th, 2011, 6:49 pm
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Post Re: Cornerbacks
I remember being pretty high on Flowers a few years back and people saying he was too small and slow yet he's carved out a pretty good career so far.


April 12th, 2011, 7:18 pm
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Post Re: Cornerbacks
Of course they're 5'10 or 5'11. You yourself said he was measured at 5'10. You said to find ONE starter with similiar, not exact, stats and here you are trying to change up what you asked for because you were wrong? So now its not find one starter, but find one first round draft pick? Lol we going to keep changing the requirements to make sure you're right?

Someone who can stay on a receiver's hip, maintain inside position and get an excellent break on the ball is better than someone who has the perfect height and speed but can't do any of the previous. He will start at nickle day one, but will eventually start on the outside. 3rd round? lol, I think you have a better chance of Smith being drafted #1 than you have Harris falling to the 3rd. He won't even be available at #44. He won't make it past Pittsburg.


April 12th, 2011, 7:24 pm
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Post Re: Cornerbacks
i didnt change anything i said .what i said is he measured at the combine at under 5,10.5091 to be exact.so what i asked for is to find me a corner under 5,10 who ran in the 4.5 range and you did.know the only thing that is gonna make either of us right will be to see where he lands on draft day.i said top would be 54 to the eagles and you said 44 thats not that much of a difference then what i,m projecting so lets look at what you really said you said he was your number three corner so that must be behind peterson and prince.so your projecting there wont be another corner selected after prince who will be top 15 and number 44 and that smith and dowling will be drafted after him.we will continue this after the draft.so you can show me how this came to pass.


April 12th, 2011, 9:58 pm
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