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 Jim Leyland 
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Post Re: Jim Leyland
Illitch never asked Dombrowski to over pay a ton of players, but he did. You can't justify Mags or Sheff. Sheff's BA was terrible. He had spotty power and pitchers were afraid of him for it. He was decent protection batting 5th, but that's it. He wasn't worth the coin that he re-signed for, period. Magglio should have been shown the door when he was asking for $18mill, even at the end of a deal. For that kind of money we could have let him go and signed a younger FA that was just as good.

Inge is garbage. He wouldn't start on any team in the majors, IMO. He has never been consistent, and didn't deserve starter money. Polanco and Damon both were and still are twice the player that B.I. is. If you can't see that you're blind. Polanco and Damon are also playing for salaries less than B.I. I don't really care where these guys played. Talent is talent. Polanco could have played 3rd base, or I would have been happy with Seizemore, Kelly, etc. platooning the spot until a 3rd baseman panned out. Anything would have been better than what we ended up with. That situation was mismanaged horribly, and that's Dombrowski's fault, 100%.


June 22nd, 2011, 3:06 pm
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Post Re: Jim Leyland
only a small part of your rebuttal even directly addresses anything i said. i never said inge is better than polance or damon NEVER said that but at the beginning of the season I would ve taken him over jack hannahan CLE, Brent Morel CWS, Danny Valencia MIN, and Mike Aviles KC who were the opening day 3B in the division. I didnt agree with Polanco or Damon being let go but there s no way in hell you could play left handed weak throwing damon at 3b and you cant complain about money and then the next sentence say you would play damon over boesch. Polanco and inge's contracts didnt end in the same season and Inge was an All star the year polanco was a free agent but i agree we should ve kept polanco - ultimately ilitch made the decision to cut payroll and let polance walk.

as for sheffield their was no re-signing, we extended him right after we got him. he was a beast and absolutely raking until the day he got in a collision with an infielder and injured his shoulder in July 2007. He was absolutely playing up to the contract. He got hurt.
.306 Avg, 23 HR, 86 R, 65 RBI 16 SB (91 games) then got 2 HR and 10 RBI the rest of the way but he was absolutely a beast when we first got him.

write what you want but its clear that you just make your opinion and dont consider the reasons why things turned out the way they did. im done with you, im convinced you dont even read people s posts - just see that they dont 100% agree with you and just repeat your same argument.


June 22nd, 2011, 8:30 pm
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Post Re: Jim Leyland
wjb21ndtown wrote:
The Legend wrote:
Quote:
Wasn't the hole Juan Gonzalez fiasco the brainchild of Dombrowski? Even if it weren't, he's done enough to merit getting canned.


no that was randy smith's work, if you dont know that you probably shouldnt have kept writing.

Quote:
We were the worst team in baseball, but he has spent us into top 5 payrolls, and we've had little to show for it.


AL pennant meant nothing to you? what about being perennially in contention and having meaningful games not to mention a complete resurgence in ticket sales?

Quote:
The best thing Dombrowski did was get Pudge to play for us, that's what turned the franchise around. That drafting and signing Justin Verlander were two great moves, he has done little else to earn his paycheck.


You have got to be kidding.

What about landing Cabrera? Drafting Zumaya, Granderson, Porcello, Avila, Boesch? Some others on the way. Trading for Jackson, Scherzer, Schlereth, Coke while dumping money? Signing Magglio, signing Victor Martinez, Valverde? Trading a murderous Urbina for Placido Polance? Even Kenny Rogers and Todd Jones paid off for us.

Quote:
Signing Sheffield to that ridiculous extension
Signing Inge to that ridiculous extension
Letting Polanco go
Jermey Bonderman's ridiculous extension
Willis' ridiculous contract
Guillen's extension, etc.
He has wasted literally hundreds of millions of dollars


Sheffield's extension wasnt ridiculous, 3 yrs/39mill - you dont trade all your young guns (at the time) for a 1 year player...they had to give him the extension - it didnt work out but it wasnt for that long or overpayment.

Inge got a 2 yr deal for pretty low money.

Letting Polance go hurt us but that was mostly ownership's call to cut back - I agree Polanco could help us but who acquired Polanco in the first place?

Read above posts we have already criticized Willis contract.

If Guillen wasnt re signed I think you would have listed that up there as a criticism ala Polanco. Who traded Ramon Santiago for Guillen? Not signing Guillen after he became an All Star shortstop would have been stupid. Yes, it hurts now that Guillen cant play anymore but having a strong farm system let us trade a former 19th rd pick for Peralta who is Guillen Part II.



I asked a question about Juan, I think I can do that and keep writing...

I never said that Dombrowski hasn't made other good moves, I simply said that the best thing he ever did was sign Pudge and draft Verlander. Both of those moves were more important at the time than anything else he's done for us, period.

Brandon Inge's $6.5 million per is not "reasonable." The guy sucks, he would be a utility player on any other team.

I wasn't happy when we let Damon go. Given the two I would rather have Damon than Inge, any day.

Guillen has been a basket case of injuries for years. He shouldn't have been re-signed and if he were it shouldn't have been for that kind of coin. Magglio's first contract paid off, but it was expensive, this extension has been ridiculous. You do trade your "young guys" for a one-year player and let that guy go if it comes to that. Making a bad decision and over-paying someone after a not-so-great year is moronic regardless as to what you gave up to get that player. Dombrowski runs this team in a manner that wastes disgusting amounts of money, you can't argue that.


In fairness, Damon completely sucked last year compared to the rest of his career.
And Guillen is still a very good hitter. But, at this point in his career, should be limited to just DH to keep him healthy. But, that can't happen due to Avilla and Martinez swapping back and forth.

Inge's value is in his defense at the hot corner. I can live with his poor hitting if the rest of the lineup is full of good hitters.

Maggs: sadly, it is time to part with Maggs. He was a great hitter. Not any more though. ( Steroids have worn off and can't get away with taking them anymore?). I don't have a big problem with his extension though. I look at it as a reward for coming here of his own free will, when nobody wanted to, willfully, come here. It was Pudge and Maggs that turned this team around.


June 23rd, 2011, 9:07 am
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Post Re: Jim Leyland
wjb21ndtown wrote:
Illitch never asked Dombrowski to over pay a ton of players, but he did. You can't justify Mags or Sheff. Sheff's BA was terrible. He had spotty power and pitchers were afraid of him for it. He was decent protection batting 5th, but that's it. He wasn't worth the coin that he re-signed for, period. Magglio should have been shown the door when he was asking for $18mill, even at the end of a deal. For that kind of money we could have let him go and signed a younger FA that was just as good.

Inge is garbage. He wouldn't start on any team in the majors, IMO. He has never been consistent, and didn't deserve starter money. Polanco and Damon both were and still are twice the player that B.I. is. If you can't see that you're blind. Polanco and Damon are also playing for salaries less than B.I. I don't really care where these guys played. Talent is talent. Polanco could have played 3rd base, or I would have been happy with Seizemore, Kelly, etc. platooning the spot until a 3rd baseman panned out. Anything would have been better than what we ended up with. That situation was mismanaged horribly, and that's Dombrowski's fault, 100%.


The biggest problem I have with Dumbrowski is that, while he is good at drafting really good pitching, he really sucks at drafting the really good position players that can hit good.

I don't see Sizemore as any kind of answer anywhere on the Tigers. I have to see more of Kelly. He has potential. But, I'm not sold yet.

And I agree that we should have kept Polanco. And Shef completely blew here.


June 23rd, 2011, 9:15 am
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Post Re: Jim Leyland
Sizemore is hitting very well and playing some decent 2B for the A's...

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June 24th, 2011, 9:47 pm
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Post Re: Jim Leyland
i think sizemore will be a decent player for them with time but he s only played 3 innings at 2b and has been bad at 3b for them so far. ur right he s hitting well, i wonder if dombrowski regrets the trade given that wilk and furbush could probably have filled the role just as well as purcey though he s been good and the bullpen needed a lift at that time


June 25th, 2011, 1:14 pm
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Post Re: Jim Leyland
A bit off course here but......Verlander is on fire!

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June 26th, 2011, 8:20 am
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Post Re: Jim Leyland
grgrundge wrote:
A bit off course here but......Verlander is on fire!


Verlander is HOF bound and just might end up being the greatest Tigers SP of all time before he is done. I will hate the Tigers forever if they ever let him get away. And while I am not much of a DUMB Rowski fan, I do give him MAJOR kudos for drafting Verlander.


June 26th, 2011, 9:42 am
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Post Re: Jim Leyland
BillySims wrote:
grgrundge wrote:
A bit off course here but......Verlander is on fire!


Verlander is HOF bound and just might end up being the greatest Tigers SP of all time before he is done. I will hate the Tigers forever if they ever let him get away. And while I am not much of a DUMB Rowski fan, I do give him MAJOR kudos for drafting Verlander.


Since his no-hitter he has reminded me a lot of the great Bob Gibson but has a variety of more pitches then Gibson. Just sheer mental toughness and command of all his pitches much like Gibson and for those who know the game, just a joy to watch. HOF, well we'll wait and see but I am going to enjoy watching him pitch the rest of this season.

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June 26th, 2011, 10:20 am
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Post Re: Jim Leyland
The only two things I really thought we horrible decisions by Dombrowski were, number one and by far the worse move trading Jair Jurrjens for Edgar Renteria. That still makes my stomach turn, and the second was giving Willis that huge extension. All the other moves I feel he was actually trying to make the team into a winner, not all of those moves worked out but at least he's not shedding players to save money.


July 1st, 2011, 9:25 am
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Post Re: Jim Leyland
I have'nt read the other posts, I just saw "Jim Leyland" and I think we should find a new manager after the season.

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July 8th, 2011, 5:47 pm
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Post Re: Jim Leyland
Killwill25 wrote:
I have'nt read the other posts, I just saw "Jim Leyland" and I think we should find a new manager after the season.



Yup!!

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July 8th, 2011, 9:03 pm
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Post Re: Jim Leyland
killwill wrote:

Quote:
I have'nt read the other posts, I just saw "Jim Leyland" and I think we should find a new manager after the season.



for what reason and who do you think would do better?


July 9th, 2011, 11:55 am
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Post Re: Jim Leyland
The Legend wrote:
killwill wrote:

Quote:
I have'nt read the other posts, I just saw "Jim Leyland" and I think we should find a new manager after the season.



for what reason and who do you think would do better?

I don't know who would be better. I'm just sick of the choking

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July 18th, 2011, 9:51 pm
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Post Re: Jim Leyland
Killwill25 wrote:
The Legend wrote:
killwill wrote:

Quote:
I have'nt read the other posts, I just saw "Jim Leyland" and I think we should find a new manager after the season.



for what reason and who do you think would do better?

I don't know who would be better. I'm just sick of the choking


I hate the way Leyland plans the offense out to go for the HR all the time. He is incapable of coaching the Tigers offense to play small ball and manufacture a run from time to time. Minnesota Twins have mastered the ability to manufacture a run when they really need one.

It infuriates me when the Tigers could really use a run, and they all come up to the plate swinging for the fences.


July 18th, 2011, 10:02 pm
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