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 Questions about the Bible, Jesus and Christianity. 
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RIP Killer
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Post Re: Questions about the Bible, Jesus and Christianity.
Someone posted this definition of Christianity that boils things down pretty good:

The belief that some cosmic Jewish Zombie can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him that you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-women was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree.

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October 10th, 2011, 10:13 am
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Post Re: Questions about the Bible, Jesus and Christianity.
Pablo wrote:
Someone posted this definition of Christianity that boils things down pretty good:

The belief that some cosmic Jewish Zombie can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him that you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-women was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree.


My day has started out with a good laugh after reading this!

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October 10th, 2011, 11:08 am
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Post Re: Questions about the Bible, Jesus and Christianity.
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My point is. That science is disproved far more often than it is proven. And for every 1 thing that science disproves about the Bible, there are several things that it proves about the Bible. Especially, in regard to historical record.


This is a ridiculous comment. Science explains, or is working on explaining, almost everything that occurs in the universe. This is a long and tedious process and Scientists know that they may later be proven wrong. Christianity simple can say "God did it" and get applause when they have not proven that God exists.

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October 10th, 2011, 11:26 am
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Post Re: Questions about the Bible, Jesus and Christianity.
Pablo knows this very well, because I've illustrated it time and again to him.

We seek proof of God with our mind instead of our heart. The two are mutually exclusive, because the mind can not fully understand what the heart is saying, and visa versa.

How do you know that you love your wife and or kids? You could argue the chemical processes of the brain, but those are the results of the EMOTIONAL aspect.

Science will NEVER be able to prove or disprove God, because:

1. it's man made
2. it's analytical, and or mind oriented.
3. God has stated throughout Scripture that He is RELATIONAL

So you can kick over stones, and search the stars, but in all of that, I would say you have set your sights too low. Search your heart, seeking the author who hung the stars in their places. Then you shall know, see is not believing unless you can see with the eyes of your heart.

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October 10th, 2011, 11:40 am
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Post Re: Questions about the Bible, Jesus and Christianity.
The funny thing is it was my heart that pushed me away. I realized one day that it made no sense that good people burn for an eternity in a lake of fire for any sin they committed, especially if the primary causation is simply not believing in some divine being who refuses to give definitive proof us his existence.

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October 10th, 2011, 12:13 pm
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Post Re: Questions about the Bible, Jesus and Christianity.
That is the problem with Humanity: Because it doesn't make sense to us, it must be wrong, therefore God is to blame!

That is a lie straight from the pit of hell, and it will be the doom of many.

Is it hard to wrap your mind around the belief in a righteous, loving God who wants nothing more than a relationship with you? Absolutely! But once we come to realize our fallen nature, our lives as Born Again Christians are lived out as a response to the gift that we've been given.

Our good works, or moral lives will NOT get us into heaven; the reason being is that we are BORN on the wrong side of the fence if you will. God saw that because of Adam and Eve's first rejection of God, that all of their offspring were NEVER going to be able to cross the gap. Absolutely nothing we can do is ever going to be good enough to earn our way into Heaven. The penalty for sin, always has been and always will be blood! Sin is not graded by degrees or severity, it is man who makes that distinction.

Since we were unable to present the perfectly pure sacrifice that was needed to cross that gap, God had to do it for us. That is where the story of Jesus comes in, and how redemption was brought to mankind. It's a gift, you can buy it, nor earn it; only receive it.

I got to go but I'll be back to add further to this....

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October 10th, 2011, 1:16 pm
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Post Re: Questions about the Bible, Jesus and Christianity.
So God, being all knowing, created us knowing that we would fall into sin. He then decided that in order to be saved we must believe in him or burn in hell for all eternity without showing himself to us or in many places of the world without even sending people with his message for dooming many generations to eternal lake of fire?

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October 10th, 2011, 1:30 pm
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Post Re: Questions about the Bible, Jesus and Christianity.
WarEr4Christ wrote:
Is it hard to wrap your mind around the belief in a righteous, loving God who wants nothing more than a relationship with you?


Funny, if God really wants "nothing more than a relationship with you" then you would think with all his powers he would find a very easy way to communicate with us. Communication is a pretty important aspect of any relationship. And when it comes to God and communication two words come to mind - epic fail.

As such, it seems to me the exact opposite of what you stated is true. He obviously does not care about having any sort of relationship with us any more than a parent who abandons their child and never tries to communicate with them again does.

And I have to agree with Stallion here, it was my heart that first started pushing me away and the mind took over from there. And unlike WarEr4Christ, I no longer see the heart and mind being mutually exclusive, in fact the mind is a very powerful filter for what the heart feels if you allow it to be. The two can work so well in unison, but like any muscle they need to be exercised or atrophy occurs from too much reliance on just one.

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October 10th, 2011, 2:27 pm
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Post Re: Questions about the Bible, Jesus and Christianity.
Okay, this is going to get pretty deep pretty quickly, but I will give the cliff notes version:

Genesis 1:26-27, " Then God said, "Let US make man in OUR image, after OUR likeness. And let them have dominion over the fish of the sea nad over the birds of the heavens and over the livestock and over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth." So God created man in his own image, in the image of Godhe created him, male and female he created them."

The God of relationship, father, son, and Holy Spirit created man for relationship. God knew the story, but he created man with the one thing that no other creature has, free will. You have the right to choose or deny Him. After all, what kind of relationship do you truly have if you have forced someone to love you? Do they really love you or are they afraid of you?

In Genesis 3 you have the story of the fall, in which Eve was tempted of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. If you look at it very closely you will notice lucifer states, "Did God ACTUALLY say," and Eve went on to answer out of her OWN words. God's word in this regard was, "but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die." Gen. 2:17

Eve's answer was, "God said, 'You shall not eat of the fruit of the tree that is in the midst of the garden, NEITHER SHALL YOU TOUCH IT, lest you die." I bring this up because it illustrates how God's words were corrupted by man even at that early stage. Then the serpent used that against Eve and enticed her with deception.

Now just because death is mentioned does not mean that death was the cessation of life. What actually occurred was the Spiritual death or separation from God. This is what happened, and how the "void" was created.

Man is now fallen, Adam, was there with Eve and did nothing to defend her or stop her, so he participated in this. Because they were fallen they could not redeem themselves, they had violated the relationship, and another way had to be created.

This ushers in the story of Jesus, and goes even further. So basically what I am trying to say, is that God created mankind for relationship, but man was unfaithful. more later....

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October 10th, 2011, 3:57 pm
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Post Re: Questions about the Bible, Jesus and Christianity.
I don't see this as deep in any way, in fact just the exact opposite. Let's recap this one for you...

God created man (Adam), then took his rib to create a women (Eve). He gave them free will and gave them some rules to follow knowing full well they wouldn't since he is all knowing and knew the snake would talk the woman into eating the fruit who would in turn talk the man into eating the fruit.

God told them they would "die" if they even touched the fruit and he is certainly a being that would follow through on such a simple command - right? But alas, neither Adam nor Eve die and instead go on to live a long life (Adam was said to have lived 930 years himself) baring children and becoming parents of all peoples.

How is that deep? It is a silly story. Morals, God is a liar and won't follow through on his threats and don't trust women or snakes. This also clearly represents what sort of "relationship" God wants to have with man.

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October 10th, 2011, 4:14 pm
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Post Re: Questions about the Bible, Jesus and Christianity.
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October 10th, 2011, 4:40 pm
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Post Re: Questions about the Bible, Jesus and Christianity.
Pablo wrote:
Someone posted this definition of Christianity that boils things down pretty good:

The belief that some cosmic Jewish Zombie can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him that you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-women was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree.



Ok Pablo thats not fair and you know it.

Maybe we're all here because the universe was farted out of a puckered up butthole the size of a needle head, that spewed so much matter out of it that it created planets, galaxies, universes....hell everything. AND THEN, like an 8 year old who can control his luggies, just before everything gets too big it gets sucked right back into the puckered butthole only to be farted back out again.


See how blatant mocking can make anything look silly?

Look, personally I think that anyone who says something that has yet to be disproven as absolutly impossible is being a little naive. I think that closing your mind to options is.....well....im sorry but, foolish.I realize that like others on this board you require more proof. And if proof is what you need, I'm afraid you will never be satisfied. (To be fair I think it is equally silly for some to say that they have found proof that god does exist, as it is for others to say that since there is no proof, that must be proof that he doesn't.)

To quote Samuel L. in Boondocks: "The absence of evidnece is not evidence of absence." (great show btw!)

Here is how I like to think a rational Christian/Jew thinks of things. If a God smart and complex enough to create...everything, he MUST be creative enough to keep all direct evidence of him hidden if thats what he so chooses.

side note here...but I often find it funny that some people would say that was impossible, then say that aliens would be capable of doing that same thing. Now I'm not saying anything about Aliens here, just that i find it odd that aliens would be capable of doing things that a GOD (dont care which one) couldn't!

My god really asks nothing of me but to beleive in him.....and to try and live by a certain code (we'll leave this 2nd part alone for now as it's not really pertinant to what im trying to say). There is a difference between believeing and knowing. I believe that if God wanted us to know he existed, we would see proof and evidence everywhere. We would probably all have seen him at one point or another durring our lives. But thats not what he wanted, he wanted us to BELIEVE. For that there must be doubt to overcome. For there to be doubt there must be.....Absence of evidence.

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October 10th, 2011, 7:25 pm
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Post Re: Questions about the Bible, Jesus and Christianity.
God told them they would "die" if they even touched the fruit and he is certainly a being that would follow through on such a simple command - right? But alas, neither Adam nor Eve die and instead go on to live a long life (Adam was said to have lived 930 years himself) baring children and becoming parents of all peoples.

How is that deep? It is a silly story. Morals, God is a liar and won't follow through on his threats and don't trust women or snakes. This also clearly represents what sort of "relationship" God wants to have with man.


Pablo, I think you are trying to stir the pot a little by using such language and you've totally missed the point. Show me in the above statement where death was said to be physical? You and all of mankind have made the assumption that there is only ONE form of death. What if you were to die SPIRITUALLY? Okay, let me take it to another perspective? What is death? SEPARATION from the living right? So if they were to "die" could it possibly be they were to be separated from the relationship with God?

Adam and Eve, walked with God in the garden prior to the fall, they were in His presence, walked and talked and fellowshipped with Him. Then deception came through the enemy of God, who enticed man through Eve.

What I have been saying all along is that God wants that relationship back, He offers it, but it is up to us to accept it. Check the box yes or no, like elementary school.

In looking at the Bible you have the old testament which was a time of the law. The do's and don'ts of the relationship, the penalty after the fall became physical death. At the coming of Jesus Christ, that ushered in the time of grace, in which the final sacrifice or requirement of blood had been paid, death was no longer called for during this time. The time that is coming is the time of judgment, and that will be swift, sure, and terrible.

I am beginning to see a pattern here, and I'd like to make an assumption that is only partially true. It is my opinion that most "atheist" come from some form of organized religion. ie the catholic church, methodist, or whatever.

Here's the reason I say this: "By your own traditions, you make the word of God of none affect." Mark 7:9

In my opinion it has been the traditional mind set that has spoiled and soiled the relationship. In a marriage if you just do the same hum drum things to go through life, it gets boring and unexciting, and loses it's passion pretty quick. But if the relationship is constantly pursued, and fought for, and cherished through doing things that you know the other person loves, it remains hot, solid and true. Traditional church has grabbed the book and said, this is the word of God read it, live by it, come to church, don't do this or that, and give us your money. The relationship with Christ says, "I love you, I have given my life for you, I want you to know me, as I know you." How do you get to know the Lord? By reading His word, but not from the same perspective as the Traditional church.

My strongest growth, and knowledge of the Lord has come when I have chosen to seek him. When I have pursued him, that's when I've found him, and been blessed in ways I can not describe. My relationship with Jesus is my own, and I can share with you the nasty stories of who I was before CHrist, and compare them to who I am now. It's not because of a moral decision, I can guarantee you that! That is why I have discussed it so openly, that it is all about the RELATIONSHIP, not the duty, or the demand, but the willingness to approach and say, "Here I am Lord I want to konw you."

I've got to go, but if you want to know who I was before and compare it to now, pm me, I'll share my testimony. Have a blessed day guys!

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October 11th, 2011, 9:04 am
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Post Re: Questions about the Bible, Jesus and Christianity.
by the way I read this for bible study this morning and it seemed to fit our conversation. The highlighted portion really seemed to speak towards Pablo's perspective.

1 Corinthians 2: 6-16, "God’s Wisdom Revealed by the Spirit
6 We do, however, speak a message of wisdom among the mature, but not the wisdom of this age or of the rulers of this age, who are coming to nothing. 7 No, we declare God’s wisdom, a mystery that has been hidden and that God destined for our glory before time began. 8 None of the rulers of this age understood it, for if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory. 9 However, as it is written: “What no eye has seen, what no ear has heard, and what no human mind has conceived” the things God has prepared for those who love him— 10 these are the things God has revealed to us by his Spirit.
The Spirit searches all things, even the deep things of God. 11 For who knows a person’s thoughts except their own spirit within them? In the same way no one knows the thoughts of God except the Spirit of God. 12 What we have received is not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, so that we may understand what God has freely given us. 13 This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, explaining spiritual realities with Spirit-taught words. 14 The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit. 15 The person with the Spirit makes judgments about all things, but such a person is not subject to merely human judgments, 16 for,
“Who has known the mind of the Lord
so as to instruct him?”[c]

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October 11th, 2011, 9:17 am
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Post Re: Questions about the Bible, Jesus and Christianity.
WarEr4Christ wrote:
Pablo, I think you are trying to stir the pot a little by using such language


always! :twisted:

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October 11th, 2011, 9:45 am
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