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 Peter Konz 
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Post Re: Peter Konz
regularjoe12 wrote:
mwill2 wrote:
To be fair, I think what WJB is saying is that if the Lions offense can extend drives in the first half of that game, it could have worn down the New Orleans defense for the second half. If that happens vs. New Orleans, the Lions have a chance to win the game--not just a half. And of course anytime you extend a drive, you keep the other team's QB on the sidelines. In today's NFL, elite QBs cannot be stopped. With guys like Brees, one can argue that the best defense is to keep them off the field.

I'm of the opinion that both sides of the ball need improvement but establishing a rushing game would be a great way to help the defense deal with solid QB play. In that regard, I'm completely OK with an O-lineman being the first round pick, even an interior lineman.


I would LOVE for us to improve the o-line. But if we dont focus on the defense we are not going to see the improvement we've been seeing over the past 3 years. If you only have 1 stop (not counting turnovers) in 2 games...you have a serious problem that can no longer be set aside.


Please understand--I don't think this should be an either/or discussion. I think the defense AND offense need improvement. However, my point here is that you CAN'T stop an elite offense. It's the reality of the NFL right now. Scoring and yardage records are being broken for a reason--the game is now designed so an offense is unstoppable. So yes, a improved defense would be helpful but it likely won't stop Brees and Brady from throwing for 500 yards and 4 TDs.

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January 26th, 2012, 12:31 pm
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Post Re: Peter Konz
we agree that both sides of the ball need help. But yes you can stop breese. not every drive, but you can stop him here or there. we did not do this once. thats SCARY bad...if you need more than that please review the GB game. A back up gets 6 TD's on us?


Like I said SCARY bad.

Our offense works. not like we'd like but it DOES work. By the end of the season it's pretty clear that our defense does not...at all

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January 26th, 2012, 12:37 pm
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Post Re: Peter Konz
mwill2 wrote:
Please understand--I don't think this should be an either/or discussion. I think the defense AND offense need improvement. However, my point here is that you CAN'T stop an elite offense. It's the reality of the NFL right now. Scoring and yardage records are being broken for a reason--the game is now designed so an offense is unstoppable. So yes, a improved defense would be helpful but it likely won't stop Brees and Brady from throwing for 500 yards and 4 TDs.


Here's the thing....it wasn't like the defense was getting worn down versus Green Bay or New Orleans. The problem wasn't fatigue, it was complete inadequacy. The drives orchestrated by both teams weren't long, grinding, time eating drives. They were a run here, a run there and fill the rest with passes that picked apart a shabby defense.

I don't think anybody expects the Lions to put together a defense that will shut down Green Bay, New Orleans....whoever. But it would be nice to see the Lions have a defense that comes up with a stop in situations where they must be relied upon to do so on a consistent basis. Yes, the defense made stops in a couple games at critical times. But that was the exception, not the rule.

From a personal standpoint, let me put it this way. I have MUCH more faith in the Lions offense to score to win the game than in the defense to make a stop to win the game. Pick a team, either conference, and that holds true.

This is the reason why I say just getting improvement in the offensive line and a respectable running game won't really make the defense much better. It will help them rest a little more between their getting torched on drive after drive, and that's about it.

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January 26th, 2012, 2:21 pm
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Post Re: Peter Konz
You make a good point.

The only thing I can say is, why not fix BOTH?? I mean, we dont ONLY have a 1st round pick and thats it. We have a whole draft of players and not to mention Free Agency. I think theyll try and upgrade both.

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January 26th, 2012, 2:51 pm
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Post Re: Peter Konz
kdsberman wrote:
You make a good point.

The only thing I can say is, why not fix BOTH?? I mean, we dont ONLY have a 1st round pick and thats it. We have a whole draft of players and not to mention Free Agency. I think theyll try and upgrade both.


No one is saying "neglect one side of the ball." I just know that if we don't fix at least one portion of the OL THIS YEAR (remember, we have three holes on our offensive line) it's going to become a problem for us and this team will regress. The OL, IMO, is the most important unit on any team in football. You literally can't win with a horrible OL.


January 26th, 2012, 3:10 pm
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Post Re: Peter Konz
wjb21ndtown wrote:
kdsberman wrote:
You make a good point.

The only thing I can say is, why not fix BOTH?? I mean, we dont ONLY have a 1st round pick and thats it. We have a whole draft of players and not to mention Free Agency. I think theyll try and upgrade both.


No one is saying "neglect one side of the ball." I just know that if we don't fix at least one portion of the OL THIS YEAR (remember, we have three holes on our offensive line) it's going to become a problem for us and this team will regress. The OL, IMO, is the most important unit on any team in football. You literally can't win with a horrible OL.



Oh I definetely know what you mean and i 100% agree with you. If we dont start with at least one of the 3 OL positions NOW, it is gonna be a real mess when we do. Which is why, like said many many times, Peter Konz makes SOOOO much sense.

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January 26th, 2012, 3:21 pm
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Post Re: Peter Konz
m2karateman wrote:
mwill2 wrote:
Please understand--I don't think this should be an either/or discussion. I think the defense AND offense need improvement. However, my point here is that you CAN'T stop an elite offense. It's the reality of the NFL right now. Scoring and yardage records are being broken for a reason--the game is now designed so an offense is unstoppable. So yes, a improved defense would be helpful but it likely won't stop Brees and Brady from throwing for 500 yards and 4 TDs.


Here's the thing....it wasn't like the defense was getting worn down versus Green Bay or New Orleans. The problem wasn't fatigue, it was complete inadequacy. The drives orchestrated by both teams weren't long, grinding, time eating drives. They were a run here, a run there and fill the rest with passes that picked apart a shabby defense.

I don't think anybody expects the Lions to put together a defense that will shut down Green Bay, New Orleans....whoever. But it would be nice to see the Lions have a defense that comes up with a stop in situations where they must be relied upon to do so on a consistent basis. Yes, the defense made stops in a couple games at critical times. But that was the exception, not the rule.

From a personal standpoint, let me put it this way. I have MUCH more faith in the Lions offense to score to win the game than in the defense to make a stop to win the game. Pick a team, either conference, and that holds true.

This is the reason why I say just getting improvement in the offensive line and a respectable running game won't really make the defense much better. It will help them rest a little more between their getting torched on drive after drive, and that's about it.



M2, I disagree with you about the N.O. game. They were pounding the ball pretty good against us, picking up fairly large chunks of yards and retaining control of the ball and the clock. They had an 11 play drive, a 7 play drive, and a 14 play drive right after our 3 and out.

I'll say again, after our 2nd turnover and the offense going three and out, our defense seemed demoralized and worn out. N.O. had four drives the first half, that's it. The Lions D was successful on three of those four drives, giving up ONE FG and getting two turnovers. That's pretty damn good if you ask me.


January 26th, 2012, 3:41 pm
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Post Re: Peter Konz
kdsberman wrote:
You make a good point.

The only thing I can say is, why not fix BOTH?? I mean, we dont ONLY have a 1st round pick and thats it. We have a whole draft of players and not to mention Free Agency. I think theyll try and upgrade both.


And the 2nd and 3rd rounds are traditionally where you draft your starting Centers and Guards.

The 1st round is usually for your impact Skill players and OT's.


January 26th, 2012, 5:10 pm
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Post Re: Peter Konz
BillySims wrote:
kdsberman wrote:
You make a good point.

The only thing I can say is, why not fix BOTH?? I mean, we dont ONLY have a 1st round pick and thats it. We have a whole draft of players and not to mention Free Agency. I think theyll try and upgrade both.


And the 2nd and 3rd rounds are traditionally where you draft your starting Centers and Guards.

The 1st round is usually for your impact Skill players and OT's.


Alex Mack, Nick Mangold, the Pouncey Brothers... Really? Billy, we're not picking top 10 anymore. We're 9 picks away from the 2nd round.


January 26th, 2012, 5:12 pm
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Post Re: Peter Konz
wjb21ndtown wrote:
BillySims wrote:
kdsberman wrote:
You make a good point.

The only thing I can say is, why not fix BOTH?? I mean, we dont ONLY have a 1st round pick and thats it. We have a whole draft of players and not to mention Free Agency. I think theyll try and upgrade both.


And the 2nd and 3rd rounds are traditionally where you draft your starting Centers and Guards.

The 1st round is usually for your impact Skill players and OT's.


Alex Mack, Nick Mangold, the Pouncey Brothers... Really? Billy, we're not picking top 10 anymore. We're 9 picks away from the 2nd round.


Yeah. I can't deny that they were in the 1st round. But, you can't deny where Centers and Guards are normally drafted either. You are banking on a very recent exception to the norm for your proposition.


January 26th, 2012, 5:27 pm
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Post Re: Peter Konz
BillySims wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
BillySims wrote:
kdsberman wrote:
You make a good point.

The only thing I can say is, why not fix BOTH?? I mean, we dont ONLY have a 1st round pick and thats it. We have a whole draft of players and not to mention Free Agency. I think theyll try and upgrade both.


And the 2nd and 3rd rounds are traditionally where you draft your starting Centers and Guards.

The 1st round is usually for your impact Skill players and OT's.


Alex Mack, Nick Mangold, the Pouncey Brothers... Really? Billy, we're not picking top 10 anymore. We're 9 picks away from the 2nd round.


Yeah. I can't deny that they were in the 1st round. But, you can't deny where Centers and Guards are normally drafted either. You are banking on a very recent exception to the norm for your proposition.


I'm more pointing out that it's damn near the 2nd round anyhow... I'd rather not slip into the 2nd tier of OGs or Cs when we're looking to start them this year.


January 26th, 2012, 5:30 pm
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