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 O-line draft hypothetical... 

Lions draft Peter Konz and Cordy Glynn in the first and 2nd round are you...?
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 O-line draft hypothetical... 
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Color Commentator - John Madden
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Post Re: O-line draft hypothetical...
Can you put a guy on IR w/o an injury? I guess you can circumvent the system that way, but if he was too valuable to the franchise, why wasn't he on the active roster then? I remember hearing something was wrong with him, but I don't remember ever hearing something specific. If academics were keeping him out of D1 then his learning curve is even sharper then other rookies, no?

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February 2nd, 2012, 1:53 pm
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Post Re: O-line draft hypothetical...
Wayne Fontes wrote:
Can you put a guy on IR w/o an injury? I guess you can circumvent the system that way, but if he was too valuable to the franchise, why wasn't he on the active roster then? I remember hearing something was wrong with him, but I don't remember ever hearing something specific. If academics were keeping him out of D1 then his learning curve is even sharper then other rookies, no?


In truth, I am not sure of exactly what the requirements are for putting a player on IR. How serious the injury must be, or who it is that makes the call. A Lions doctor? A League doctor? Independent doctor? I just don't know. There was an injury reported for Culbreath, but I forgot exactly what it was supposed to be. I just remember that it didn't seem like it was that serious.

Remember, book smarts isn't what the Lions (or any other NFL team, for that matter) are interested in. Can he learn the playbook, not can he learn Algebraic equations. Remember the term "Football IQ"? That's what the Lions would be concerned with. If he didn't have it, I doubt they would have selected him. The offense he played in at South Carolina State is what needs to be looked at. I don't know what they ran there, pro style, spread, wing, etc. But even in those different offenses, the role of the left tackle is pretty much the same. It's just about learning assignments and terminology.

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February 2nd, 2012, 2:05 pm
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Post Re: O-line draft hypothetical...
Wayne Fontes wrote:
Can you put a guy on IR w/o an injury? I guess you can circumvent the system that way, but if he was too valuable to the franchise, why wasn't he on the active roster then? I remember hearing something was wrong with him, but I don't remember ever hearing something specific. If academics were keeping him out of D1 then his learning curve is even sharper then other rookies, no?


All you have to do is say that he had sprained this or that and he qualifies for the IR. No-one can prove otherwise. And no-one would try to prove otherwise because every team does it.

I believe he was listed as a high ankle sprain.


February 2nd, 2012, 2:08 pm
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Post Re: O-line draft hypothetical...
K2 you hit it right on the head.culbreath spent all his time between the weight room and the film room.as contracts there planning on back loading alot of avrils and tullochs to allow them to go after gaither an landry


February 2nd, 2012, 3:05 pm
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Post Re: O-line draft hypothetical...
allenslions wrote:
K2 you hit it right on the head.culbreath spent all his time between the weight room and the film room.as contracts there planning on back loading alot of avrils and tullochs to allow them to go after gaither an landry


I am not so sure we SHOULD re-sign Tulloch. I know we probably will. But, Tulloch was brought in to stop the other teams run game. He failed. The wide 9 is designed to funnel the RB's inside so that the MLB tackles them at the LOS or for a loss. Tulloch may have lead the team in tackles. But, very few of them were for losses.

I agree with the concept of Backloading Avril's and CJ's Contracts with huge 1 time Roster bonuses due in 2014. The Cap is going to inflate big time by then and we will have the room available for that to happen plus re-sign Stafford and Suh at that time with them getting their huge 1 time roster bonus in 2015.

[rant]The 1 time roster bonus is in place of a signing bonus that will haunt the Lions year after year. If we can get the teams payroll set to the 1 time roster bonuses, we will have that option every year. I hate those signing bonuses. They are what completely screw up teams salary structure. Get it done in a 1 time hit.[/rant]


February 2nd, 2012, 3:30 pm
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Post Re: O-line draft hypothetical...
The wd9 defence used by shwartz with the titans was a 3rd down allignment.when we used it as such like against the chargers are backers played great.dont blame the players because of flaws in the scheme.


February 2nd, 2012, 5:17 pm
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Post Re: O-line draft hypothetical...
allenslions wrote:
The wd9 defence used by shwartz with the titans was a 3rd down allignment.when we used it as such like against the chargers are backers played great.dont blame the players because of flaws in the scheme.


+1

If you watch some of the games, the wide 9 was used way too often, which has been part of my complaint about the defensive scheme. Tulloch didn't have a good year, make no mistake. More than once I saw him miss a gap by over running, or simply bouncing off a ball carrier. But you can't fault him when the opposing offense bounces a run play off tackle successfully because our ends are taught to line up two yards outside the tackles shoulder and to angle towards the running back aggressively. The offensive line simply collapses the playside DT, then the OT just allows the momentum of the DE to take him right out of the play. Now you have a wide opening for the RB to go through, and an extra blocker on that side by pulling the offside guard, to handle the nearest LB. I'll take a guard against an outside backer any day of the week, and expect the guard to win. In fact, there were some plays where the OT didn't even have to block the Lions DE. They simply pushed them outside and then went after the nearest defender in front of them. The back simply took a quick handoff and was able to avoid the DE. Of course, there were times that KVB or Avril would come back and make the tackle, but that was 8 or 10 yards downfield. The damage was done.

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February 3rd, 2012, 11:17 am
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Post Re: O-line draft hypothetical...
K2 its great to talk with fans like you. You see the game like we do.what ever you do for a living you missed your calling as i think you have what it takes to do what i do.chating with you is a pleasure.


February 3rd, 2012, 12:01 pm
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Post Re: O-line draft hypothetical...
Quote:
If you watch some of the games, the wide 9 was used way too often, which has been part of my complaint about the defensive scheme. Tulloch didn't have a good year, make no mistake. More than once I saw him miss a gap by over running, or simply bouncing off a ball carrier. But you can't fault him when the opposing offense bounces a run play off tackle successfully because our ends are taught to line up two yards outside the tackles shoulder and to angle towards the running back aggressively. The offensive line simply collapses the playside DT, then the OT just allows the momentum of the DE to take him right out of the play. Now you have a wide opening for the RB to go through, and an extra blocker on that side by pulling the offside guard, to handle the nearest LB. I'll take a guard against an outside backer any day of the week, and expect the guard to win. In fact, there were some plays where the OT didn't even have to block the Lions DE. They simply pushed them outside and then went after the nearest defender in front of them. The back simply took a quick handoff and was able to avoid the DE. Of course, there were times that KVB or Avril would come back and make the tackle, but that was 8 or 10 yards downfield. The damage was done.


i agree with this statement - the ends seemed to be completely unconcerned with outside contain. ive coached with a 44 defense that has the ends w/o contain responsibility but the OLB and CB have to make up for that. not sure if the wide 9 uses that same philosophy - to have ends play inside run and passrush the qb but not worry about outside contain - but especially to levy s side of the field the defense didnt hold up on off tackle runs. kvb would crash hard inside on a dive play and sure enough two plays later he gets toasted on an end around. kvb was also susceptible to crack back blocks - essentially the same type of block that ended his season last year on thanksgiving when hernandez cracked back on him. corners and backers need to be yelling crack crack crack so kvb knows. avril didnt really get targeted quite the same but the players inside particularly Suh had a tendency to overpenetrate and be susceptible to delayed runs or traps - suh needs to learn to feel the lack of blocking find the trapping lineman and use the wrong arm technique to blow up the play while the uncovered DL needs to follow the pulling lineman. some of these fundamentals seemed to be overlooked or nonexistent in addition to what might have been flaws in or overuse of the wide 9 scheme. i actually really liked how the defense played when nick fairley was lined up as a nose - he was too much for centers to handle but in the wide 9 the tackles almost always seemed to be shaded on the guards to avoid having huge gaps on the DL for teams to run through.


February 3rd, 2012, 3:51 pm
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Post Re: O-line draft hypothetical...
I hate to not follow the thread but I completely agree with everything in the last few post. The big problem I had was not changing the scheme to fit the team they were playing. Against the 49ers they should have been clogging running lanes and throwing zone blitzes at Smith to fluster him. Instead they went W9 and left lanes for Gore and passing lanes for Smith to find the TEs.

The same thing but slightly different should have been done against the Saints. Instead of trying to get penetration up the middle the DTs should have been pushing the pocket back into Brees and not giving him a place to step up to make throws. Instead they tried to penetrate and the Gs used their momentum and just roded them away from Brees and gave him all the room he needed to step up and make throws.


February 3rd, 2012, 10:41 pm
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Post Re: O-line draft hypothetical...
Quote:
PFT writes:
Chargers left tackle Marcus McNeill got his big contract in October of 2010. It was considered risky because of his health, and he wound up only playing nine games in 2011.

The 28-year-old two-time Pro Bowler is expected to be waived in early March according to Kevin Acee of the San Diego Union-Tribune. That would free up $10 million in cap space.

McNeill’s contract was guaranteed for skill, but not injury. So he has to pass a physical by March 15 or his salary is not guaranteed. Acee reports McNeill, who reportedly wants to keep playing football, is not expected to pass the physical. McNeill will immediately become the most talented and risky free agent tackle out there.

Acee writes the Chargers have a few other ways to clear up cap space. Defensive end Luis Castillo will likely have to reduce his salary or he will be cut. Linebacker Takeo Spikes, due almost $3 million next year, is also a candidate for release.

Calling this a crucial offseason for Chargers G.M. A.J. Smith would be an understatement. There are a lot of question marks on the Chargers roster and not a lot of time to fix them with Smith and coach Norv Turner on the hot seat.


Does this mean that they will try to resign Gaither? I do.

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February 8th, 2012, 11:52 am
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Post Re: O-line draft hypothetical...
Wayne Fontes wrote:
Quote:
PFT writes:
Chargers left tackle Marcus McNeill got his big contract in October of 2010. It was considered risky because of his health, and he wound up only playing nine games in 2011.

The 28-year-old two-time Pro Bowler is expected to be waived in early March according to Kevin Acee of the San Diego Union-Tribune. That would free up $10 million in cap space.

McNeill’s contract was guaranteed for skill, but not injury. So he has to pass a physical by March 15 or his salary is not guaranteed. Acee reports McNeill, who reportedly wants to keep playing football, is not expected to pass the physical. McNeill will immediately become the most talented and risky free agent tackle out there.

Acee writes the Chargers have a few other ways to clear up cap space. Defensive end Luis Castillo will likely have to reduce his salary or he will be cut. Linebacker Takeo Spikes, due almost $3 million next year, is also a candidate for release.

Calling this a crucial offseason for Chargers G.M. A.J. Smith would be an understatement. There are a lot of question marks on the Chargers roster and not a lot of time to fix them with Smith and coach Norv Turner on the hot seat.


Does this mean that they will try to resign Gaither? I do.


It would appear so.

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February 8th, 2012, 1:20 pm
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Post Re: O-line draft hypothetical...
I watched every game this year and I don't understand how Tulloch underachieved. Please explain to me how this year was not a good season for him. Yes our run defense did get shredded at times but if I recall there were quite a few games in which he had to subsidize for Bobby Carpenter and Levy did nothing. Tulloch made HUGE plays plays for us and I see absolutely no reason to replace him. plus the wide 9 seemed to get killed by good running attacks as someone alluded to earlier.

I think we should build the LB unit around him. for those who don't think he should be resigned: Who can we bring in at MLB that would give us more than Tulloch gave us this season? plus he's is in his prime and still getting better. Let's not forget that 4 of our losses were because of our offense being ineffective.

You could argue that Tulloch was our best defender this season.

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February 8th, 2012, 10:24 pm
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Post Re: O-line draft hypothetical...
Wayne Fontes wrote:
Quote:
PFT writes:
Chargers left tackle Marcus McNeill got his big contract in October of 2010. It was considered risky because of his health, and he wound up only playing nine games in 2011.

The 28-year-old two-time Pro Bowler is expected to be waived in early March according to Kevin Acee of the San Diego Union-Tribune. That would free up $10 million in cap space.

McNeill’s contract was guaranteed for skill, but not injury. So he has to pass a physical by March 15 or his salary is not guaranteed. Acee reports McNeill, who reportedly wants to keep playing football, is not expected to pass the physical. McNeill will immediately become the most talented and risky free agent tackle out there.

Acee writes the Chargers have a few other ways to clear up cap space. Defensive end Luis Castillo will likely have to reduce his salary or he will be cut. Linebacker Takeo Spikes, due almost $3 million next year, is also a candidate for release.

Calling this a crucial offseason for Chargers G.M. A.J. Smith would be an understatement. There are a lot of question marks on the Chargers roster and not a lot of time to fix them with Smith and coach Norv Turner on the hot seat.


Does this mean that they will try to resign Gaither? I do.


There's the operative word.....try. I think he wants to test the market. I also think that while cutting McNeill may save them $10M, it will cost them close to that, on average, to sign Gaither to a new deal.

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February 8th, 2012, 10:26 pm
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Post Re: O-line draft hypothetical...
Now that the lions drafted Reiff, do you still stand by your vote, to take a T and Peter Konz in the first and 2nd round?

Personally i think it would be a highly successful first 2 rounds. if they also can stay where they are in the 2nd round draft Konz at 54, keeping all there picks in later rounds could turn out good if they can find a gem of a CB there in round 3.

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April 27th, 2012, 1:14 am
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