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 Gorilla genome could hold key to the human condition 
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Post Gorilla genome could hold key to the human condition
apologies in advance to those that still subscribe to creationsim but...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-17239059

BBC wrote:
Gorilla genome could hold key to the human condition

Writing in the journal Nature, the scientists say that researchers can now begin to examine the similarities and differences between the apes.

Genome sequences of humans, chimpanzees and orangutans are already published.

The team hopes their work will help to uncover genetic mutations that led to language, culture and science.

"I'd like to think that in the next 20 or 30 years we will get a deeper understanding of what happened genetically in our evolutionary history, and of how those genes affect the brain and other properties that make us modern humans," said Richard Durbin of the Wellcome Trust Sanger Institute, who led the study.

Initial comparisons confirm that chimpanzees are our closest relatives, sharing 99% of our DNA. Gorillas come a close second with 98%, and orangutans third with a 97% share.

That reflects the evolutionary history of apes. Genome comparison indicates that the human lineage separated from orangutans 14 million years ago, gorillas 10 million years ago, and chimps 6 million years ago.

That order of events is not a surprise, but the dates are earlier than many scientists had thought.

Although on average we are closest to chimps, many of our individual genes are more like those of gorillas.

Among them is a gene that enables us and gorillas to hear better than other apes.

Until now, some scientists had thought that the development of hearing was what enabled us to develop language - but as a result of this research, we now know this theory is wrong.

Fifteen percent of the human genome is closer to the gorilla than the chimpanzee, and 15% of the chimpanzee genome is closer to the gorilla than to humans.

One genetic difference that will be of interest to medical researchers is a mutation that results in dementia in humans, but seems to leave gorillas completely unaffected.

Rapid emergence

The genome unravelled in the research came from a female western lowland gorilla (Gorilla gorilla gorilla) called Kamilah.

Researchers searched through more than 11,000 genes in her genome, as well as in the published versions of the human, chimp and orangutan genetic codes, for changes important in evolution.

"Our most significant findings reveal not only differences between the species, reflecting millions of years of evolutionary divergence, but also similarities in parallel changes over time since their common ancestor," said Chris Tyler-Smith, who works with Dr Durbin.

Comparative studies will also shed more light on the evolution of all the Great Apes; but the key question is whether the bounty of genetic information contains clues to the moment when the first genes emerged that made humans capable of abstract thought.

"This is the question we are all fascinated by," Dr Durbin told BBC News.

It is unlikely that a single development led to our species' advance towards modernity, or that all developments along that path were genetic.

Anatomically modern humans (Homo sapiens) emerged around 200,000 years ago, but it was not until about 50,000 years ago that our bigger brains began to make a difference.

Until then, humanity was one among small number of apes in Africa, probably living not very differently from gorillas.

So, something happened very rapidly around that time that led to the emergence of abstract thought, allowing humans to invent advanced tools and use them to shape the environment.

"There will have been genetic factors," said Dr Durbin, "but also cultural and historic factors."

The one Great Ape not to be sequenced so far is the bonobo, a close relative of the chimp. That project is underway, and scientists expect its genome and that of the chimp to be very similar.

The availability of the genomes of all the Great Apes will help scientists answer what happened over the past 200,000 years to enable our species become what we are now.

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March 7th, 2012, 4:50 pm
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Post Re: Gorilla genome could hold key to the human condition
I'm still finding it interesting that we have our "origin" species running around, and we have our post developed species running around, but we don't have ANY MIDDLE OF THE ROAD fellas running around. Where'd they go? I mean in the multi-billion years since the primordial swamp, we have chimps, and humans, but there is nothing in the mid range developmental stage. Hmmm, that's weird.

We have A, and we have Z but where's b through y? Just curious!

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March 7th, 2012, 7:10 pm
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Post Re: Gorilla genome could hold key to the human condition
WarEr4Christ wrote:
I'm still finding it interesting that we have our "origin" species running around, and we have our post developed species running around, but we don't have ANY MIDDLE OF THE ROAD fellas running around. Where'd they go? I mean in the multi-billion years since the primordial swamp, we have chimps, and humans, but there is nothing in the mid range developmental stage. Hmmm, that's weird.

We have A, and we have Z but where's b through y? Just curious!


I find it funny how you need ANY MIDDLE OF THE ROAD fellas when our DNA is 97% the same as one species, 98% the same as another, and 99% the same as yet another. What do you need? Would 99.5% work for you?

What you are looking for is right in front of you, but in your mind you need a species that is halfway between Chimps and humans for you to grasp it. Problem is, if that species existed it would likely look still very ape-like and you would then need a species in-between to bridge the gap. You would then need an in-between species to bridge that gap and so on. That is not how mutations and evolution works over 100s of thousands of years.

Here is an important line in the article It is unlikely that a single development led to our species' advance towards modernity, or that all developments along that path were genetic." This means, after the intial mutation we continued to evolve and change within our own species thus no true linear link can be seen from one species to another but the DNA tells the story as evidenced above.

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March 7th, 2012, 7:25 pm
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Post Re: Gorilla genome could hold key to the human condition
Every species around you is an in-between species. Evolution does not stop.


March 7th, 2012, 9:00 pm
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Post Re: Gorilla genome could hold key to the human condition
And you guys say you don't have faith...................

Point A is Chimp:

so from A to Z, through the process of evolution, there should STILL BE all stages of B thru Y, but there is NOT!

Point Z is Human:

Sorry Blue, but all those people around me are not various forms of humanity. If it's human, it's human.


Funny thing is, it takes more faith to believe in this DISPROVED theory, than it does to believe in Divine Design, but have it your way I guess. I'll keep looking for the middle of the road fellas. Hey wait, maybe it's bigfoot, and he doesn't want to be discovered?

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March 7th, 2012, 9:54 pm
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Post Re: Gorilla genome could hold key to the human condition
How many books have you read on evolution?

EDIT: The reason why I ask is because you clearly don't know what you're talking about. I don't mean that arrogantly. But if you understood at the very least what evolutionary theory says, you wouldn't ask where the "in-betweens" are.


March 7th, 2012, 9:58 pm
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Post Re: Gorilla genome could hold key to the human condition
Both creationism and big-bang theory both believe the same thing... we all came from this world, whether you believe we evolved from it or were created out of it. Mice and men share 70-90% similarities and pigs are 90-95%. All Mammals have a common genome. It doesn't prove anything other than we all came from the same material. And that doesn't prove or disprove either theory.

In 2005, they said the pig genome was going to unlock all of man's medical mysteries...


March 8th, 2012, 5:23 am
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Post Re: Gorilla genome could hold key to the human condition
Guilty as charged! Haven't bothered to pick up a single book related to a corrupt theory, that even it's own author said was limited by known science.

Based upon Pablo's inital post, I was asking a common sense question. In my mind, it's pretty cut and dry. (perspective thing again)

14 billion years ago, we started out as this, 14 billion years later we've evolved into this, so where are the in betweens? I don't necessarily mean it as you have one piece of the puzzle, and then over time you have the complete puzzle. I mean where are the in between species. 1/2 man, 3/4 man, and so on.

Wait, maybe I'm looking at this from the wrong angle. Chimps aren't the starting point they are a "step" along the chain, is that what I'm to believe?

It still takes more faith to believe a lot of these leaps and canyons of thought, than to believe in a Creator God who is present, should you care to believe and accept his offer. Again, I can't tell you how awesome it is to swim, until you get in the water.

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March 8th, 2012, 9:28 am
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Post Re: Gorilla genome could hold key to the human condition
WarEr4Christ wrote:
Guilty as charged! Haven't bothered to pick up a single book related to a corrupt theory

If someone said the same thing to you about the bible, what would your response be?

WarEr4Christ wrote:
Chimps aren't the starting point they are a "step" along the chain, is that what I'm to believe?

They are a closely related branch of the tree.


March 8th, 2012, 9:40 am
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Post Re: Gorilla genome could hold key to the human condition
Nice attempt but it doesn't apply here.

1. Historically the Bible has been proven factual
* many of said characters and events have been proven true
* sodom and gomorrah (have been discovered)
* King David, Solomon and others did exist

2. In regards to it being a corrupt theory, I've shown YOU specifically some answers to questions you've posed, but then suddenly the conversation stopped. Hmmm, :-k why is that?

3. The Bible is the 1 book written by 40 different people from 4 DIFFERENT Continents, over 1600 years. It is the INSPIRED word of God, which means it is a living document. Having read it through, you can go back and re-read it, and find it to mean something altogether different based upon current circumstances.

4. As I've said more times than I have fingers and toes, GOD IS RELATIONAL! That means you only need to look at how you RELATE to your wife and kids, to see HOW a RELATIONSHIP with God could be. The offer is there, you just have to say yes or no.

So these are just some of the answers I would say!

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2 Chronicles 10:14, "if my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and I will forgive their sin and will heal their land."


March 8th, 2012, 9:59 am
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Post Re: Gorilla genome could hold key to the human condition
WarEr4Christ wrote:
Nice attempt but it doesn't apply here.

1. Historically the Bible has been proven factual
* many of said characters and events have been proven true
* sodom and gomorrah (have been discovered)
* King David, Solomon and others did exist

How would you know without reading it?

WarEr4Christ wrote:
It is the INSPIRED word of God

How could you possibly know without reading it?

The point isn't whether books on evolution are right/wrong - the point is that to dismiss the theory without even attempting to understand what it is, is perhaps a bit rash.


March 8th, 2012, 10:30 am
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Post Re: Gorilla genome could hold key to the human condition
WarEr4Christ wrote:
Funny thing is, it takes more faith to believe in this DISPROVED theory, than it does to believe in Divine Design, but have it your way I guess. I'll keep looking for the middle of the road fellas. Hey wait, maybe it's bigfoot, and he doesn't want to be discovered?


So all these brilliant scientist are perpetuating a "DISPROVED" theory? :lol:

It doesn't take faith to believe in a theory, in this case you can use common sense to fill in missing pieces. We continue to fill in the pieces, but are you actually surprised that not every primate that ever walked the earth is still fosilized somewhere?

Quote:
Historically the Bible has been proven factual
* many of said characters and events have been proven true
* sodom and gomorrah (have been discovered)
* King David, Solomon and others did exist


And because some aspects of the Bible are true does not mean 1) all parts are true or 2) the premise behind it is correct. Have you read the Bible Code? Well the Vatican exist in the real world as do many of the places, people and artifacts - does that mean the premise behind it is also true? Based on your thought process, Jesus did indeed have a love child with a lady of the night.

Quote:
The Bible is the 1 book written by 40 different people from 4 DIFFERENT Continents, over 1600 years. It is the INSPIRED word of God, which means it is a living document. Having read it through, you can go back and re-read it, and find it to mean something altogether different based upon current circumstances.


There are many books that are collaborations. And pretty much every book you can find different meanings depending on where you are in your life, it is called perspective. I read the toungue twisting Dr. Suess books to my boys almost every night, I can tell you they have a much different meaning now to me than when I first read them.

Quote:
As I've said more times than I have fingers and toes, GOD IS RELATIONAL! That means you only need to look at how you RELATE to your wife and kids, to see HOW a RELATIONSHIP with God could be. The offer is there, you just have to say yes or no.


Funny, I can touch, speak, hear, play with, etc. my wife and kids. If I had the same relationship with them as you do with God I would most likely be institutionalized. I had imaginary friends when I was two, but I have a real wife and kids and no need for imaginary friends anymore (in fact, it has been quite a long time). So I say "no" to your imaginary friends - sorry.

You are so quick to dismiss science that threatens your beliefs - that is a shame. As you have already admitted you haven't read a single book on the subject yet you claim it has been "DISPROVED". You continue to ask us to look at videos, articles, books, etc. that support your faith - which a number of us have - kind of hypocritical don't you think?

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March 8th, 2012, 10:59 am
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Post Re: Gorilla genome could hold key to the human condition
I knew I shoulda kept my mouth shut, but I was feeling a little frisky and so I bit. Now realizing I shoulda left well enough alone, only because it's too incendiary to discuss adequately.

However, to your point about all these Scientist doing the research, my response is that they are looking at the WRONG target. They need to adjust their sights a little higher, but then again, they could not understand the Spiritual, because well there isn't a whole lot of tangible that goes along with it. So it goes back to my opening statement.

To your other point, your wife, and kids did NOT become a part of your life, UNTIL 1. she accepted the relationship with you, 2. or you her. Prior to that she was just some other woman on this planet. But when she CHOSE YOU, and Accepted your offer, then you began to know EACH OTHER, and your relationship grew from there. You can't know God, until you accept the offer, just sayin....

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2 Chronicles 10:14, "if my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and I will forgive their sin and will heal their land."


March 8th, 2012, 1:55 pm
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Post Re: Gorilla genome could hold key to the human condition
You know I'm always trying to rile you up a bit WE4C. :lol:

As for your comment, how do you know it is the WRONG target? How do you know that God doesn't want us to discover a little bit of him at a time and it is actually scientist doing his work? Or do you think your God would prefer we still believe the Earth rest on pillars and the sun, and rest of the universe for that matter, revolves around us?

Why does science seem to threaten your beliefs so much? What are you afraid of?

As a father, do you not want your own daughter to know as much as you do and more? There is a timing of when you impart that knowlege as she is not ready to absorb certain things at certain ages. Wouldn't our "heavenly" father want the same for his children?

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March 8th, 2012, 2:25 pm
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Post Re: Gorilla genome could hold key to the human condition
WarEr4Christ wrote:
I knew I shoulda kept my mouth shut, but I was feeling a little frisky and so I bit. Now realizing I shoulda left well enough alone, only because it's too incendiary to discuss adequately.

However, to your point about all these Scientist doing the research, my response is that they are looking at the WRONG target. They need to adjust their sights a little higher, but then again, they could not understand the Spiritual, because well there isn't a whole lot of tangible that goes along with it. So it goes back to my opening statement.

To your other point, your wife, and kids did NOT become a part of your life, UNTIL 1. she accepted the relationship with you, 2. or you her. Prior to that she was just some other woman on this planet. But when she CHOSE YOU, and Accepted your offer, then you began to know EACH OTHER, and your relationship grew from there. You can't know God, until you accept the offer, just sayin....


The only thing that is incendiary is you professing to "know" about something that you know literally nothing about, and you admit that you know nothing about it. That's the epitome of ignorance right there, coupled with a ridiculous degree of stubbornness.

You make the claim that quite literally ALL of the Bible is "proven factual" because certain places and people have been known to exist. That because Jesus was proven to walk the planet, and that he walked the planet in places known to us, and that because he was associated with Kings that were known to live, etc. that ALL OF THE MIRACLES TOO (i.e. the miracle that we were "created") contained therein must then be factual as well. That's ridiculous.

The same can be said about evolution theory - we know that DNA exists, we know that DNA changes, we know that things change over time, so ALL OF THE MIRACLES OF EVOLUTION MUST THEN BE TRUE (i.e. the miracle that we evolved).

Man, you're blind, but yet so brilliant that you don't even need to read to know that you know something... Brilliant! Have a Guniess.


Last edited by wjb21ndtown on March 19th, 2012, 11:55 am, edited 1 time in total.



March 8th, 2012, 3:25 pm
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