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 Trayvon Martin vs. George Zimmerman 
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Post Re: Trayvon Martin vs. George Zimmerman
thelomasbrowns wrote:
I don't think there should be laws based on feelings. For the stand your ground law, you have to "feel" threatened. For SB1070, the cop has to "feel" the person is undocumented. Laws should be verifiable with facts.


Your "feeling" is more based on fact that what you were actually "feeling" at the time. Remember, the law is subject to the jurisprudence of a reasonable man. It's not what Zimmerman felt, it's what a reasonable person would have felt in his shoes, and facts dictate the result.


April 23rd, 2012, 12:10 pm
Post Re: Trayvon Martin vs. George Zimmerman
Allegedly there was a picture of Zimmerman's face and head "bloodied" taken at the police station that was used to get Zimmerman out on Bail. With the bail so low the speculation is that the prosecution doesn't have much of a case. If there was a higher likelihood of conviction bail would likely reflect that likelihood.

What's ridiculous is, if this guy "gets off" that is, the facts PROVE that he's not guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, there's a probability that there will be protests, marches, and high probability of violence. I just hope that "justice" isn't dictated by what may result from a non-conviction.


April 23rd, 2012, 12:12 pm
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Post Re: Trayvon Martin vs. George Zimmerman
wjb21ndtown wrote:
Allegedly there was a picture of Zimmerman's face and head "bloodied" taken at the police station that was used to get Zimmerman out on Bail. With the bail so low the speculation is that the prosecution doesn't have much of a case. If there was a higher likelihood of conviction bail would likely reflect that likelihood.

What's ridiculous is, if this guy "gets off" that is, the facts PROVE that he's not guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, there's a probability that there will be protests, marches, and high probability of violence. I just hope that "justice" isn't dictated by what may result from a non-conviction.



I agree! But IMO the fact the he was even arrested so late after the fact is exactly the kind of political pandering you speak of. The police at the scene didn't feel arresting him was justified and it wasn't until Al Sharpton showed up that the governor appointed a 'special committee' to 'investigate'. That just meant re-look at the evidence on hand. To me that just spells pandering to the black voters and as far as I'm concerned it's as criminal as the shooting itself. Everything about this case and the way the media has handled it is simply outrageous!

Let us not forget blacks kill blacks (and whites) every day in America. Detroit alone sees upwards of 1200-1500 murders per year! Most don't even make the news anymore unless there is some degree of uniqueness about the case. Yet you NEVER hear a word from Sharpton or Jesse Jackson. But the moment that it's a white on black killing (or in this case white / Hispanic) then it's a different matter entirely and even Jennifer Grandholm is at a rally dressed in a hoodie! It's a sad, sad state of affairs our national race relations are in right now and this case is a tinderbox.

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April 23rd, 2012, 1:46 pm
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Post Re: Trayvon Martin vs. George Zimmerman
wjb21ndtown wrote:
What's ridiculous is, if this guy "gets off" that is, the facts PROVE that he's not guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, there's a probability that there will be protests, marches, and high probability of violence. I just hope that "justice" isn't dictated by what may result from a non-conviction.


I completely agree, and was thinking about this exact same thing earlier today. If the black population riots in much the same way they did with the Rodney King/police decision, then what are they saying about the views that blacks are more prone to ciminal and violent behavior? It certainly doesn't make their case that they are no more violent, no more criminal than the rest of America. I don't recall the violence and rioting when OJ Simpson was acquitted (even though SNL spoofed it, with rioting in Beverly Hills..funny).

All told, Zimmerman has/had a right to defend himself. So does everyone in this country. But in that circumstance it's hard to see the imminent peril for him. Nobody witnessed the actual initial attack that Zimmerman claims happened. All that was seen was Martin hitting Zimmerman, and then there was the sound of the gunshot. Nobody actually witnessed the shooting, or the second or two just prior to it.

And keep in mind, just because Zimmerman could be found not guilty, it doesn't make him innocent.

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April 23rd, 2012, 1:58 pm
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Post Re: Trayvon Martin vs. George Zimmerman
m2karateman wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
What's ridiculous is, if this guy "gets off" that is, the facts PROVE that he's not guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, there's a probability that there will be protests, marches, and high probability of violence. I just hope that "justice" isn't dictated by what may result from a non-conviction.


I completely agree, and was thinking about this exact same thing earlier today. If the black population riots in much the same way they did with the Rodney King/police decision, then what are they saying about the views that blacks are more prone to ciminal and violent behavior? It certainly doesn't make their case that they are no more violent, no more criminal than the rest of America. I don't recall the violence and rioting when OJ Simpson was acquitted (even though SNL spoofed it, with rioting in Beverly Hills..funny).

All told, Zimmerman has/had a right to defend himself. So does everyone in this country. But in that circumstance it's hard to see the imminent peril for him. Nobody witnessed the actual initial attack that Zimmerman claims happened. All that was seen was Martin hitting Zimmerman, and then there was the sound of the gunshot. Nobody actually witnessed the shooting, or the second or two just prior to it.

And keep in mind, just because Zimmerman could be found not guilty, it doesn't make him innocent.



M2 - there were threats of violence if OJ wasn't acquitted...


April 23rd, 2012, 2:14 pm
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Post Re: Trayvon Martin vs. George Zimmerman
m2karateman wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
What's ridiculous is, if this guy "gets off" that is, the facts PROVE that he's not guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, there's a probability that there will be protests, marches, and high probability of violence. I just hope that "justice" isn't dictated by what may result from a non-conviction.


I completely agree, and was thinking about this exact same thing earlier today. If the black population riots in much the same way they did with the Rodney King/police decision, then what are they saying about the views that blacks are more prone to ciminal and violent behavior? It certainly doesn't make their case that they are no more violent, no more criminal than the rest of America. I don't recall the violence and rioting when OJ Simpson was acquitted (even though SNL spoofed it, with rioting in Beverly Hills..funny).

All told, Zimmerman has/had a right to defend himself. So does everyone in this country. But in that circumstance it's hard to see the imminent peril for him. Nobody witnessed the actual initial attack that Zimmerman claims happened. All that was seen was Martin hitting Zimmerman, and then there was the sound of the gunshot. Nobody actually witnessed the shooting, or the second or two just prior to it.

And keep in mind, just because Zimmerman could be found not guilty, it doesn't make him innocent.


You mean the fact that black males represent 6% of the population but somehow find a way to commit 52% of the murders and 34% of the rapes. Is that the "no more violent, no more criminal" somebody was referring to.

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April 23rd, 2012, 2:20 pm
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Post Re: Trayvon Martin vs. George Zimmerman
wjb21ndtown wrote:

M2 - there were threats of violence if OJ wasn't acquitted...


And what's your point? As far as I'm concerned, any one who was rioting should have been shot and killed by police or anyone else. I guarantee you NONE of the rioters knew Rodney King, nor the police officers, when that whole situation went down. Yet they somehow felt "justified" and "entitled" to loot and pillage like Spanish Conquistadors or Carribean Pirates.

Threats of anything shouldn't prevent justice from being served. Rioters should be dealt with swiftly and convincingly. If they had dropped a bomb on LA, they would have done the world a favor.

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April 23rd, 2012, 3:41 pm
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Post Re: Trayvon Martin vs. George Zimmerman
m2karateman wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:

M2 - there were threats of violence if OJ wasn't acquitted...


And what's your point? As far as I'm concerned, any one who was rioting should have been shot and killed by police or anyone else. I guarantee you NONE of the rioters knew Rodney King, nor the police officers, when that whole situation went down. Yet they somehow felt "justified" and "entitled" to loot and pillage like Spanish Conquistadors or Carribean Pirates.

Threats of anything shouldn't prevent justice from being served. Rioters should be dealt with swiftly and convincingly. If they had dropped a bomb on LA, they would have done the world a favor.



My point is that I'm sure there will be similar threats from the black community around this ordeal. They refuse to let "justice" play out. They want the justice they demand, not the justice that the system affords. In their eyes Zimmerman is already tried and convicted, and anything to the contrary will be an outrage - that's what my point is...


April 23rd, 2012, 3:48 pm
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Post Re: Trayvon Martin vs. George Zimmerman
wjb21ndtown wrote:
m2karateman wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:

M2 - there were threats of violence if OJ wasn't acquitted...


And what's your point? As far as I'm concerned, any one who was rioting should have been shot and killed by police or anyone else. I guarantee you NONE of the rioters knew Rodney King, nor the police officers, when that whole situation went down. Yet they somehow felt "justified" and "entitled" to loot and pillage like Spanish Conquistadors or Carribean Pirates.

Threats of anything shouldn't prevent justice from being served. Rioters should be dealt with swiftly and convincingly. If they had dropped a bomb on LA, they would have done the world a favor.



My point is that I'm sure there will be similar threats from the black community around this ordeal. They refuse to let "justice" play out. They want the justice they demand, not the justice that the system affords. In their eyes Zimmerman is already tried and convicted, and anything to the contrary will be an outrage - that's what my point is...


OK. I agree, there will be threats. And the fact is, anybody making those threats should be arrested for inciting a riot. I'm tired of the justice system being afraid of what might happen because of the outcome of a high profile case like this.

Like I said...let them riot. Then shoot them dead in the streets and see what comes of it. They don't like it? There's hundreds of other countries to move to.

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April 24th, 2012, 10:28 am
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Post Re: Trayvon Martin vs. George Zimmerman
m2karateman wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
m2karateman wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:

M2 - there were threats of violence if OJ wasn't acquitted...


And what's your point? As far as I'm concerned, any one who was rioting should have been shot and killed by police or anyone else. I guarantee you NONE of the rioters knew Rodney King, nor the police officers, when that whole situation went down. Yet they somehow felt "justified" and "entitled" to loot and pillage like Spanish Conquistadors or Carribean Pirates.

Threats of anything shouldn't prevent justice from being served. Rioters should be dealt with swiftly and convincingly. If they had dropped a bomb on LA, they would have done the world a favor.



My point is that I'm sure there will be similar threats from the black community around this ordeal. They refuse to let "justice" play out. They want the justice they demand, not the justice that the system affords. In their eyes Zimmerman is already tried and convicted, and anything to the contrary will be an outrage - that's what my point is...


OK. I agree, there will be threats. And the fact is, anybody making those threats should be arrested for inciting a riot. I'm tired of the justice system being afraid of what might happen because of the outcome of a high profile case like this.

Like I said...let them riot. Then shoot them dead in the streets and see what comes of it. They don't like it? There's hundreds of other countries to move to
.


I completely agree! Which is why I'm disappointed that nothing has come out of the Black Panthers having issued a bounty for Zimmerman's death. Very little has been said on the news and naturally not one arrest. It's absurd! If a white Nazi group issued a bounty on Al Sharpton's head it would dominate the news!!

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April 24th, 2012, 3:13 pm
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Post Re: Trayvon Martin vs. George Zimmerman
LionFan57 wrote:
I completely agree! Which is why I'm disappointed that nothing has come out of the Black Panthers having issued a bounty for Zimmerman's death. Very little has been said on the news and naturally not one arrest. It's absurd! If a white Nazi group issued a bounty on Al Sharpton's head it would dominate the news!!


Well of course they won't pursue it. Eric Holder isn't going to arrest his homies. He wouldn't even pursue them when they were breaking federal laws by threatening people at the polls during the 2008 elections. Despite being filmed making those threats, it was officially viewed as a non-issue. But if the KKK or some other white supremacist group had been threatening people to NOT vote for Obama, it would have been a major thing in the news, and they would have all been arrested, tried and convicted in short order.

That is exactly why I agree with Chris Rock....there is no bigger racist than an old black man.

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April 24th, 2012, 4:13 pm
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Post Re: Trayvon Martin vs. George Zimmerman
m2karateman wrote:
That is exactly why I agree with Chris Rock....there is no bigger racist than an old black man.



I think it's hilarious that the City of Detroit is DEMANDING that the City be ran by a black person, and they call anything to the contrary "racist." That's just laughable... Think about who's really being racist there... Hmmm....


April 25th, 2012, 12:21 pm
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Post Re: Trayvon Martin vs. George Zimmerman
So let me understand this?

A witness sees Zimmerman getting his face stomped in and head slammed against the pavement and we are arguing whether or not he had the right to shoot the guy???

If I have someone on top of me stomping my face to the point that he has broken my nose and is slamming my head against the concrete in the street in the middle of night. (Granted I'm still concious) You can bet your sweet arse that dude is getting my XD-9 shoved up his arse and I mean quick like.

If Zimmerman walked up and shot him, then yes, he goes to jail and does not pass go. We all know that is not the case, the police have confirmed that.

Fact is two people know the truth and one is dead. With that said I think you got an over zealous neighborhood watchmen, trying to play the role of the police. Confronts somebody that he feels is suspicious, probably didn't go over well and fight breaks out. Unfortunately for Martin, Zimmerman was a licensed hand gun carrier and when he didn't stop with the beating, it cost him his life. Black, White, Yellow, Purple, it's irrelevant at this point. Zimmerman claims he feared for his life and had reasonable wounds to substantiate his claims, the law claims In order for deadly force to be justified there must be an immediate, otherwise unavoidable threat of death or grave bodily harm to yourself or other innocents. Deadly force is that force which could reasonably be expected to cause death or grave bodily harm. "Unavoidable" is the key word here, Martin is on top, stomping and slamming his head on the concrete, I don't see Zimmerman's way to avoid what is happening, especially if a witness hears Zimmerman begging Martin to stop.

I wonder if Martin would have killed Zimmerman and it was discovered that Zimmerman had a gun on his person, but didn't use it in self defense, how many people would be talking about what an idiot Zimmerman was for not using his weapon?

I don't condone anyone killing another person, but I firmly believe in your right to self defense, whether it be physically or deadly if justified.

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April 28th, 2012, 1:11 am
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Post Re: Trayvon Martin vs. George Zimmerman
I really don't believe that he was getting his faced smashed into concrete.

Have you ever seen that happen? His face would be pretty ****ed up, likely with a broken nose, etc.

That said, maybe it happened maybe it didn't. I really don't like people jumping to strong conclusions one way or the other.


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Post Re: Trayvon Martin vs. George Zimmerman
Blueskies wrote:
I really don't believe that he was getting his faced smashed into concrete.

Have you ever seen that happen? His face would be pretty ****ed up, likely with a broken nose, etc.

That said, maybe it happened maybe it didn't. I really don't like people jumping to strong conclusions one way or the other.


He wasn't getting his face smashed in, he was punched (and he did get a broken nose) and then the back of his head was bashed against the concrete, hence the photos of his head bleeding from behind.

Just seeing how easy it was for you to read that wrong shows how easy it has been for NBC and CNN to push this as a racial dividing point.


April 28th, 2012, 7:31 pm
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