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 Lions Select Tahir Whitehead - OLB , Temple (Rd 5) 
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Post Re: Lions Select Tahir Whitehead - OLB , Temple (Rd 5)
thelomasbrowns wrote:
"I always laugh a little bit when you get graded a day after the draft and the guys grading you have generally never seen half the players." -Schwartz



Yeah. But this guy may have still been around AFTER the draft. Reading reveiews online, It sound\s like a pretty low value. I hope I'm wrong, but I doubt he'll be more than a special team player.

Him, and Jonte Green were wasted picks...


April 29th, 2012, 9:31 am
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Post Re: Lions Select Tahir Whitehead - OLB , Temple (Rd 5)
Hystrix wrote:
thelomasbrowns wrote:
"I always laugh a little bit when you get graded a day after the draft and the guys grading you have generally never seen half the players." -Schwartz



Yeah. But this guy may have still been around AFTER the draft. Reading reveiews online, It sound\s like a pretty low value. I hope I'm wrong, but I doubt he'll be more than a special team player.

Him, and Jonte Green were wasted picks...


Reviews from people paid to write about crap, because they arent good enough to be involved with the actual process itself. Only time will tell but I trust our coaching staff over any other talent evaluator out there right now. While everybody has misses every year, only a few FO's in HISTORY have brought a team even close to as far as the Lions have come in 3 seasons, and likely None have gone from 0 wins to Playoffs in that timespan.


April 29th, 2012, 12:10 pm
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Post Re: Lions Select Tahir Whitehead - OLB , Temple (Rd 5)
DJ-B wrote:
Hystrix wrote:
thelomasbrowns wrote:
"I always laugh a little bit when you get graded a day after the draft and the guys grading you have generally never seen half the players." -Schwartz



Yeah. But this guy may have still been around AFTER the draft. Reading reveiews online, It sound\s like a pretty low value. I hope I'm wrong, but I doubt he'll be more than a special team player.

Him, and Jonte Green were wasted picks...


Reviews from people paid to write about crap, because they arent good enough to be involved with the actual process itself. Only time will tell but I trust our coaching staff over any other talent evaluator out there right now. While everybody has misses every year, only a few FO's in HISTORY have brought a team even close to as far as the Lions have come in 3 seasons, and likely None have gone from 0 wins to Playoffs in that timespan.


It's one thing to get from 0-16 to the playoffs; that great work and I'm happy about it. But it's very different to get from a wild card birth & 1st rd loss to the Superbowl. I wouldn't assume the former guarantees the latter and some would argue that it may even require a different skill set. I think the biggest mistake people can make is assuming that all things that got you here are the same things that need to be done to get you to the next level.

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April 30th, 2012, 11:17 am
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Post Re: Lions Select Tahir Whitehead - OLB , Temple (Rd 5)
Don't get me wrong, I'm happy about how far we've come...but we have a long way to go. We still have only 1 playoff win in 55 years.

BTW, the Rams won the Superbowl a year after a 3-13 record. The Pats went from went from 5-11 in 2000 to winning the Superbowl in 2001. Yes we came from 0 wins, but we haven't exactly been lighting it up in the playoffs.

So is it walks like a duck... I'm gonna call them out on a bad call. I believe this guy is a reach to say the least and a bad call.


April 30th, 2012, 1:07 pm
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Post Re: Lions Select Tahir Whitehead - OLB , Temple (Rd 5)
Very salient points guys, especially the comment about it maybe requiring a different skill set. All we can do now is wait and see while we continue to root for our Leos.


April 30th, 2012, 1:47 pm
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Post Re: Lions Select Tahir Whitehead - OLB , Temple (Rd 5)
FWIW - IMO even Schwartz seemed disappointed or confused about this pick at his press conference. He basically said he's a special teams guy only (not really an endorsement for his role on the team). I understand the need to get better at kickoff coverage, but I think we were foolish for giving up a 4th round pick next year for it.


April 30th, 2012, 6:31 pm
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Post Re: Lions Select Tahir Whitehead - OLB , Temple (Rd 5)
mwill2 wrote:
Priceless. We're criticizing the value of a player that nobody here has seen or knows anything about.


And there is probably a reason that none of us know anything about him. LOL.

I think it is perfectly reasonable for us to wonder WTH. With all the info on all the draft elligible players that everyone with a computer has now days, You would think that we would have heard about a 5th round quality player.


May 1st, 2012, 7:33 pm
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Post Re: Lions Select Tahir Whitehead - OLB , Temple (Rd 5)
LionFan57 wrote:
DJ-B wrote:
Hystrix wrote:
thelomasbrowns wrote:
"I always laugh a little bit when you get graded a day after the draft and the guys grading you have generally never seen half the players." -Schwartz



Yeah. But this guy may have still been around AFTER the draft. Reading reveiews online, It sound\s like a pretty low value. I hope I'm wrong, but I doubt he'll be more than a special team player.

Him, and Jonte Green were wasted picks...


Reviews from people paid to write about crap, because they arent good enough to be involved with the actual process itself. Only time will tell but I trust our coaching staff over any other talent evaluator out there right now. While everybody has misses every year, only a few FO's in HISTORY have brought a team even close to as far as the Lions have come in 3 seasons, and likely None have gone from 0 wins to Playoffs in that timespan.


It's one thing to get from 0-16 to the playoffs; that great work and I'm happy about it. But it's very different to get from a wild card birth & 1st rd loss to the Superbowl. I wouldn't assume the former guarantees the latter and some would argue that it may even require a different skill set. I think the biggest mistake people can make is assuming that all things that got you here are the same things that need to be done to get you to the next level.


I agree with LF57? :shock:


May 1st, 2012, 7:37 pm
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Post Re: Lions Select Tahir Whitehead - OLB , Temple (Rd 5)
well I look @ Hogue , and how he's projected to be a starter this upcoming season . the guy might be surprise .


May 1st, 2012, 11:51 pm
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Post Re: Lions Select Tahir Whitehead - OLB , Temple (Rd 5)
I read that Whitehead, Greenwood, and Green were listed as sleeper picks by various publications.

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May 2nd, 2012, 1:49 am
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Post Re: Lions Select Tahir Whitehead - OLB , Temple (Rd 5)
there arent any no brainer stars in rd 5 and below so im not sure what people are griping about. i didnt like that they traded away a future 4th rder for a 5th rder and i also thought that they would have been better off moving into the early parts of round 4 than backwards. i felt there was a big dropoff in talent at the bottom of rd4 and the lions took themselves out of the running on some very good players with where they positioned themselves to pick but I dont know enough to bash the players that they took after that point. really there didnt seem to be a lot of good alternatives


May 2nd, 2012, 8:35 pm
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Post Re: Lions Select Tahir Whitehead - OLB , Temple (Rd 5)
The Legend wrote:
there arent any no brainer stars in rd 5 and below so im not sure what people are griping about. i didnt like that they traded away a future 4th rder for a 5th rder and i also thought that they would have been better off moving into the early parts of round 4 than backwards. i felt there was a big dropoff in talent at the bottom of rd4 and the lions took themselves out of the running on some very good players with where they positioned themselves to pick but I dont know enough to bash the players that they took after that point. really there didnt seem to be a lot of good alternatives


I agree with both aspects of your statement. I don't like that they traded away a future 4th round pick for Tahir Whitehead, who appears to be a project player. I also don't like that they moved down in round four rather than up. They basically gave up shots at Boykin and Brooks, both pretty decent corners, once they moved down. While I understand that Ronnell Lewis is a solid find in that round, both Boykin and Brooks were considered values at that point as well.

What bothers me most about this draft is that the Lions got no safety help, and they limited themselves to a single offensive lineman. They could have Konz over Broyles, and that is a move I just can't fathom. While I like some of the value and talent they got, other teams were able to find the Holy Trinity in the draft....Value, Talent, Need. For instance, Pittsburgh got David DeCastro...Value, Talent, Need. Then took Mike Adams in round two. While he's not elite, as a late second round pick he is VTN all the way. The Steelers first five picks were all representative of fill needs with talented players at places where they represented value. However, I think the team that had the absolute best draft among all was Cincinnati. Talk about filling needs, gaining talent and doing it with value picks. All ten of their picks were great. Only Zeitler could be looked at as something of a reach, but not by much. I had Zeitler possibly going to Baltimore in the draft, but no further than the 49ers at 30. They got a starting corner, starting guard, two really good DT prospects, a very talented tight end that fell due to recent legal issues, a pretty good corner in Prater, tow pretty solid receivers, a great safety value in Iloka in late round five, and a running back prospect in Dan Herron that could be their day one starter in the sixth round. That's some pretty strong drafting right there. They add starters, quality depth and did it on both sides of the ball. They are going to be a team to look for.

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May 3rd, 2012, 10:20 am
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Post Re: Lions Select Tahir Whitehead - OLB , Temple (Rd 5)
m2karateman wrote:
The Legend wrote:
there arent any no brainer stars in rd 5 and below so im not sure what people are griping about. i didnt like that they traded away a future 4th rder for a 5th rder and i also thought that they would have been better off moving into the early parts of round 4 than backwards. i felt there was a big dropoff in talent at the bottom of rd4 and the lions took themselves out of the running on some very good players with where they positioned themselves to pick but I dont know enough to bash the players that they took after that point. really there didnt seem to be a lot of good alternatives


I agree with both aspects of your statement. I don't like that they traded away a future 4th round pick for Tahir Whitehead, who appears to be a project player. I also don't like that they moved down in round four rather than up. They basically gave up shots at Boykin and Brooks, both pretty decent corners, once they moved down. While I understand that Ronnell Lewis is a solid find in that round, both Boykin and Brooks were considered values at that point as well.

What bothers me most about this draft is that the Lions got no safety help, and they limited themselves to a single offensive lineman. They could have Konz over Broyles, and that is a move I just can't fathom. While I like some of the value and talent they got, other teams were able to find the Holy Trinity in the draft....Value, Talent, Need. For instance, Pittsburgh got David DeCastro...Value, Talent, Need. Then took Mike Adams in round two. While he's not elite, as a late second round pick he is VTN all the way. The Steelers first five picks were all representative of fill needs with talented players at places where they represented value. However, I think the team that had the absolute best draft among all was Cincinnati. Talk about filling needs, gaining talent and doing it with value picks. All ten of their picks were great. Only Zeitler could be looked at as something of a reach, but not by much. I had Zeitler possibly going to Baltimore in the draft, but no further than the 49ers at 30. They got a starting corner, starting guard, two really good DT prospects, a very talented tight end that fell due to recent legal issues, a pretty good corner in Prater, tow pretty solid receivers, a great safety value in Iloka in late round five, and a running back prospect in Dan Herron that could be their day one starter in the sixth round. That's some pretty strong drafting right there. They add starters, quality depth and did it on both sides of the ball. They are going to be a team to look for.


m2k, i appreciate your analysis, but it seems like your notion of value is at least partially driven by how well known someone is in the media. As we've seen in the draft, team boards and media draftnik boards do tend to generally line up until the middle of the second round or so, but after that, all bets are off. If Mayhew and co. say they took the best players on their board, especially after the 2nd, then we have to take their word for it. Now if these guys are busts and the better known players succeed, then it's fair to question the board itself. But so far in the Mayhew regime, that has almost never been the case.

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May 3rd, 2012, 1:07 pm
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Post Re: Lions Select Tahir Whitehead - OLB , Temple (Rd 5)
thelomasbrowns wrote:
m2k, i appreciate your analysis, but it seems like your notion of value is at least partially driven by how well known someone is in the media. As we've seen in the draft, team boards and media draftnik boards do tend to generally line up until the middle of the second round or so, but after that, all bets are off. If Mayhew and co. say they took the best players on their board, especially after the 2nd, then we have to take their word for it. Now if these guys are busts and the better known players succeed, then it's fair to question the board itself. But so far in the Mayhew regime, that has almost never been the case.


Players are well known because of what they have accomplished, or what they are seen as being capable of. Rarely do you see complete unknowns being drafted high. I can't say that I ever saw Tahir Whitehead play, since Temple is not a team I watch that frequently. However, in a case such as this I will read several reports from different reputable sites, and draw my conclusion based on what I read there. And every one of those considers this pick a mystery. Maybe the Lions saw something and he'll work out. But to have traded a 4th round pick next year for the right to draft this kid means they had better seen something that makes him stand out or they will get criticized for the move, and deservedly so. Remember, they moved up to get Jahvid Best and were criticized by some of us for it, and I would say deservedly so. He had a known injury history that is now haunting him and the team. I officially consider it a very questionable decision to draft him at all, aside from them moving up and giving up any pick to do so.

And while I agree that Mayhew and company have had some success in the draft, the jury is still out on a number of players. And it's not like they have hit on every pick. Jahvid Best is one example. Derrick Williams ring a bell? Many of us wondered what they were doing with that pick, and it turns out we were right. Aaron Brown was another pick that didn't work out (6th rounder), neither did Tim Toone (7th rounder). And I would have to say that Amari Spievey is on some pretty shaky ground right now as well.

I agree, the majority of their picks have been pretty good, and I have gone on record as saying I am pleased with this past draft, grading it as a "B" overall. But that doesn't make them perfect, and in fact it could make them a bit overconfident. And EVERY team is going to say they took the best players on their board. They will never admit they reached, or made a mistake, or anything of that nature.

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May 4th, 2012, 9:29 am
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Post Re: Lions Select Tahir Whitehead - OLB , Temple (Rd 5)
I'm not a worshiper of Sirius radio but Pat Kirwan said something interesting yesterday. He reviewed the 2009-2011 drafts and found that over the past three years, the average team finds one starter in each draft. Playoff teams average less than one starter per draft. Any expectation that a decent draft will yield more than one starter is unrealistic. One could argue that the trade up for Whitehead is warranted if Whitehead simply makes the roster.

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May 4th, 2012, 10:01 am
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