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 Who's your Pres Candidate? 
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Post Re: Who's your Pres Candidate?
I think welfare should be harder to get, and harder to keep. With bridge cards we make it WAY too easy to just "throw some money on their card" without requiring that these people do anything.

It's impossible to dole out the goods, really? In the 80s that's how it was done. You'd stand in line for hours to get some govt. cheese, peanut butter, powdered milk, etc. It wasn't worth it for people that didn't need it to stand in line.

I'll say this though. I really don't think it is that big of an issue of people on welfare do a small amount of drinking or drug use. There is an overwhelming self-righteous ideology that thinks that if these people are getting something for free then they 1) shouldn't have any discretionary resources whatsoever, and 2) they shouldn't do anything bad whatsoever. Alcohol, small marijuana, and even cigarette use is a release and it has been proven healthy in small doses. To say that these people shouldn't use any of the aforementioned drugs is to say that they shouldn't be allowed to be human. I can't agree with that.

That said, if they are drug abusers and they're using the system to enable their drug use, they should be kicked off of the system and put into some sort of rehab.

How to accomplish this for relatively little cost? Go back to demanding that welfare recipients pick up their check/bridge card (or have it replenished) at a fixed location. Make them wait in line to get their funds. Intentionally make it somewhat difficult for them to receive their benefits to 1) save money, and 2) provide incentive to get off of the system. Have them drug test at their monthly/bi-monthly or even weekly fund pickup, and it would be relatively inexpensive. Stand in a line to take your test. Stand in the 2nd line to receive your benefits. Once you get to the front of the 2nd line your test should be done. Here's your funds, have a nice day.

I'm sorry, but if you can't be clean for three days a month, or even six, you have issues (three days before the test X2).

This would cut down on a LOT of the abuse of the system. People get work and STILL collect because it's harder to stop collecting than it is to keep collecting, at least until your next review. That's ridiculous.


August 1st, 2012, 3:36 pm
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Post Re: Who's your Pres Candidate?
Yes - there are regular recessions in an normally-functioning economy. What that chart shows (pretty clearly, I believe) is that what we are experiencing is not normal, and extreme. I'll say it again - short of central bank intervention, we are probably in a great depression and not a recesssion. If all the people receiving food stams (44 Million!!) were standing in breadlines and the unemployed were standing in visibile lines - it would look exactly like the previous great depression. Sure, it doesn't seem totally bad to most people - in the GD, 50-75% of the population were fine. They were impacted & realized what was going on - but they were fine.

The unfortunate side of taking care of people during very rough times is that it enables those people to be made invisible. And then that hardens people who are better off into thinking the money is being spent foolishly & frivolously. My point again is, just turn the aid spigot off, and we'll see just how "invisible" the 44 million stay.

There's no way it would be financially beneficial to implement a drug testing program as part of public aid. It would require massive process and systems implementation, in addition to the cost of testing the far higher percentage of non-drug-taking people just to identify the few. And then there is the politically sticky issue of punishing spouses and children of abusers. The idea is a dumb hunt for a bogeyman that barely exists. It does - but it isn't worth the effort to manage.


August 4th, 2012, 6:17 pm
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Post Re: Who's your Pres Candidate?
Excellent post

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August 4th, 2012, 9:18 pm
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Post Re: Who's your Pres Candidate?
I.E. wrote:
Yes - there are regular recessions in an normally-functioning economy. What that chart shows (pretty clearly, I believe) is that what we are experiencing is not normal, and extreme. I'll say it again - short of central bank intervention, we are probably in a great depression and not a recesssion. If all the people receiving food stams (44 Million!!) were standing in breadlines and the unemployed were standing in visibile lines - it would look exactly like the previous great depression. Sure, it doesn't seem totally bad to most people - in the GD, 50-75% of the population were fine. They were impacted & realized what was going on - but they were fine.

The unfortunate side of taking care of people during very rough times is that it enables those people to be made invisible. And then that hardens people who are better off into thinking the money is being spent foolishly & frivolously. My point again is, just turn the aid spigot off, and we'll see just how "invisible" the 44 million stay.

There's no way it would be financially beneficial to implement a drug testing program as part of public aid. It would require massive process and systems implementation, in addition to the cost of testing the far higher percentage of non-drug-taking people just to identify the few. And then there is the politically sticky issue of punishing spouses and children of abusers. The idea is a dumb hunt for a bogeyman that barely exists. It does - but it isn't worth the effort to manage.


IE, no one is saying "shut the power off tomorrow" -- at least, no one reasonable. To do that would, as you hinted at, cause a violent uproar.

What we are saying is that the welfare state is long-term unsustainable.

And, even if it was sustainable, welfare programs do nothing to solve the problem of poverty -- the poverty rate has largely stayed stable since the 1960s, meanwhile the government has wasted trillions on welfare programs.

Unfortunately, many people are dependent upon the government or are expecting to be provided for at some future date (social security, medicare), so you can't just shut it down. But, you can begin to phase it out over time.

If you don't, there may come a day when the money just runs out and you have no choice but to shut it off. Ask Greece.

It's better to prepare people by beginning to wind these programs down now, rather than to keep extending and pretending, knowing that one day the bill will come due.


August 9th, 2012, 12:08 am
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Post Re: Who's your Pres Candidate?
Candidates you side with...
84%
Jill Stein
on healthcare, environmental, science, social, and domestic policy issues.
83%

Barack Obama
on science, social, immigration, and economic issues.

67%
Stewart Alexander
on healthcare and social issues.

61%
Gary Johnson
on social and immigration issues.

33%
Jimmy McMillan
on social issues.

18%
Ron Paul
no major issues.

1%
Virgil Goode
no major issues.

0%
Mitt Romney
no major issues.

Who you side with by party...
84%
Green

83%
Democratic

41%
Libertarian

0%
Republican

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August 9th, 2012, 12:19 pm
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Post Re: Who's your Pres Candidate?
Just went looking at a few poll and Obama seems to be the countries prez:

Fox 49-40%
CNN 52-45%
Reuters 49-42%

That is a 7-9 point advantage for BO. For those of you who thought the economy would be collapsed by now and Obama would be on his way out - thoughts?

The pattern continues, don't worry GOP - you man will win the next election as we continue down our Coke - Pepsi - Coke - Pepsi charade.

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August 10th, 2012, 3:26 pm
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Post Re: Who's your Pres Candidate?
Pablo wrote:
Just went looking at a few poll and Obama seems to be the countries prez:

Fox 49-40%
CNN 52-45%
Reuters 49-42%

That is a 7-9 point advantage for BO. For those of you who thought the economy would be collapsed by now and Obama would be on his way out - thoughts?

The pattern continues, don't worry GOP - you man will win the next election as we continue down our Coke - Pepsi - Coke - Pepsi charade.


I don't really pay attention to the media's sites for polls, because the people that visit them are a true polling accurate group. People can vote multiple times, so you always get skewed results, and you only see the parties mention them when they're ahead, but never when they're behind.

I've always paid attention to Rasmussen & Gallup (they just changed their methodology, and their not really open about their demographics) just because its a true statistical representation. That's all they do, where as the media sites are looking for their own viewer responses. Gallup has it dead even at 46% where Rasmussen has Romney up 48% to 43%. Rasmussen was dead on with Obama/McCain also. Daily polling of 45,000 people will give much more accurate long-term data then any snapshot one off poll.

Statistics can be accurate, but like Mark Twain said... there's Lies, Damn Lies, and Statistics. How many times have we seen the same polls be used to tell completely different stories? In the end it only matters who turns out and votes.


August 10th, 2012, 6:41 pm
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