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 Cornerback options 
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Post Re: Cornerback options
m2karateman wrote:
regularjoe12 wrote:
depends on whether or not the other 10 guys learn to tackle. so far that has been a big disapointment this preseason and it doesn't matter how well you cover if you can't tackle.


I agree. Projecting a possible record based on whether one position is improved slightly is just a wild guess.

Regardless of what happens with personnel, I predict a 9-7 season, give or take a game.


Dang. 7 losses? I think we lost 6 at most, and that's what I'm predicting, 10-6. Losses to San Francisco, Houston, Green Bay, Chicago, @ Philly, and 1 other game (either other GB game or Seattle).

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August 21st, 2012, 3:27 pm
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Post Re: Cornerback options
regularjoe12 wrote:
m2karateman wrote:
regularjoe12 wrote:
depends on whether or not the other 10 guys learn to tackle. so far that has been a big disapointment this preseason and it doesn't matter how well you cover if you can't tackle.


I agree. Projecting a possible record based on whether one position is improved slightly is just a wild guess.

Regardless of what happens with personnel, I predict a 9-7 season, give or take a game.



The cornbread is better over here. Im thinkin 11 wins, give or take.


Me too. I'd be disappointed if we had less wins than last year. Unless of course we were 9-7, made the playoff and won a game or three :)

I hope Smith improves though. I remember at one time he was looking like an All-pro... I hope Bentley can show us something.


August 21st, 2012, 3:38 pm
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Post Re: Cornerback options
Hystrix wrote:
regularjoe12 wrote:
m2karateman wrote:
regularjoe12 wrote:
depends on whether or not the other 10 guys learn to tackle. so far that has been a big disapointment this preseason and it doesn't matter how well you cover if you can't tackle.


I agree. Projecting a possible record based on whether one position is improved slightly is just a wild guess.

Regardless of what happens with personnel, I predict a 9-7 season, give or take a game.



The cornbread is better over here. Im thinkin 11 wins, give or take.


Me too. I'd be disappointed if we had less wins than last year. Unless of course we were 9-7, made the playoff and won a game or three :)

I hope Smith improves though. I remember at one time he was looking like an All-pro... I hope Bentley can show us something.


I remember that. He picked off everything thrown towards him. I think if he gained some weight and took tackling lessons he could definitely start.

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August 21st, 2012, 4:01 pm
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Post Re: Cornerback options
first greenwood will not be exposed to the waiver wire.he will keep a roster spot until we can move him directly to ir.also what is everyone,s opinion on kyle wilson because the tweetybird around the office is that the boss has been taking some calls from the jets about goz.not saying a trade is gonna happen but it looks like the jets have an interest in our starter.


August 21st, 2012, 4:14 pm
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Post Re: Cornerback options
allenslions wrote:
first greenwood will not be exposed to the waiver wire.he will keep a roster spot until we can move him directly to ir.also what is everyone,s opinion on kyle wilson because the tweetybird around the office is that the boss has been taking some calls from the jets about goz.not saying a trade is gonna happen but it looks like the jets have an interest in our starter.


We have depth at OT, they have depth at CB - I'm all for it. I liked Kyle Wilson coming out of Boise State in 2010.

I'd like to see RR starting as a rookie since we took him in the 1st and I think having Houston, Wilson and Bentley gives us 3 corners to work with.

Let's trade these two former first round picks for one another!

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August 21st, 2012, 4:50 pm
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Post Re: Cornerback options
Pablo wrote:
allenslions wrote:
first greenwood will not be exposed to the waiver wire.he will keep a roster spot until we can move him directly to ir.also what is everyone,s opinion on kyle wilson because the tweetybird around the office is that the boss has been taking some calls from the jets about goz.not saying a trade is gonna happen but it looks like the jets have an interest in our starter.


We have depth at OT, they have depth at CB - I'm all for it. I liked Kyle Wilson coming out of Boise State in 2010.

I'd like to see RR starting as a rookie since we took him in the 1st and I think having Houston, Wilson and Bentley gives us 3 corners to work with.

Let's trade these two former first round picks for one another!


I don't know. I'd rather have RR given a year to work on his pass blocking footwork and remain a backup. I wouldn't mind this trade happening, but if it did I just hope RR will be ready.

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August 21st, 2012, 6:10 pm
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Post Re: Cornerback options
Pablo wrote:
allenslions wrote:
first greenwood will not be exposed to the waiver wire.he will keep a roster spot until we can move him directly to ir.also what is everyone,s opinion on kyle wilson because the tweetybird around the office is that the boss has been taking some calls from the jets about goz.not saying a trade is gonna happen but it looks like the jets have an interest in our starter.


We have depth at OT, they have depth at CB - I'm all for it. I liked Kyle Wilson coming out of Boise State in 2010.

I'd like to see RR starting as a rookie since we took him in the 1st and I think having Houston, Wilson and Bentley gives us 3 corners to work with.

Let's trade these two former first round picks for one another!


I'd be OK with it, but only if we also got something else in return. Gos, though not my favorite player, is a proven multi-year starter. Kyle Wilson is not. I would not trade for Wilson unless the Jets kicked in a draft pick or another player. And I'd want that pick to be something like a 5th rounder or better.

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August 21st, 2012, 6:32 pm
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Post Re: Cornerback options
k2 the only reason wilson is not starting is because of who the jets have starting ahead of him.he played extremely well in the 6 games he started last season.and less face it goz is a solid starter but he aint no world beater.a straight up trade would be a fair trade


August 21st, 2012, 7:39 pm
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Post Re: Cornerback options
allenslions wrote:
k2 the only reason wilson is not starting is because of who the jets have starting ahead of him.he played extremely well in the 6 games he started last season.and less face it goz is a solid starter but he aint no world beater.a straight up trade would be a fair trade


Regardless if he's not starting because of who's in front of him, he's never played more than a nickleback on that defense, so there's no way of knowing if he's even capable of being a #2. Being in the Jersey market, I've seen plenty of him, and while he might push Lacey down a bit, I'm not sure he'd secure the #2 spot over Bentley especially because he was drafted specifically to play nickel. So i'd agree with M2k and want a little more than a straight up trade. Especially since the Jets are hurting BAD for a RT right now. That situation demands that we get more out of the trade. We're sitting pretty with Gos, Hilliard, Reiff, and Fox capable of starting at RT, while the Jets have a turnbuckle. If they sweet the deal with a draft pick, i'd be all for it, but as it sits right now, the Jets will be lucky to win 6 games with their OL right now. Tebow is going to have to start to survive, and with the utter lack of weapons after Holmes, Green being no better than a #2 back, they NEED to fix it, and we're sitting in a position that we can ask for more. Straight up might seem fair from a talent standpoint, but from a need basis, both their GM and Head Coach have their jobs riding on it. They'll offer more.


August 22nd, 2012, 1:21 am
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Post Re: Cornerback options
I'd be happy with that trade. Even if RR isn't ready, I don't see Hilliard or Fox as too big a step down from Goz to not be happy with the improvement to our CB core.

Even if Wilson is a nickle, in today's NFL that's pretty much a starter anyway with nickel or dime packages seeing the field almost as often as base defense.

m2karateman wrote:
Regardless of what happens with personnel, I predict a 9-7 season, give or take a game.

That's pretty much what I'm expecting too. I see this as more of a consolidating season, where we build on what we've done to secure our position as a top 3rd NFL team, than one where we continue the kind of progress we've made in the last couple of seasons and become divisional champs.

If we secure a decent record, continue to maintain the most talented players on our roster whilst building quality depth and having some of the rookies come through, I'll be happy. Next season is when I'm hoping for the true breakout year.


August 22nd, 2012, 4:01 am
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Post Re: Cornerback options
njroar wrote:
allenslions wrote:
k2 the only reason wilson is not starting is because of who the jets have starting ahead of him.he played extremely well in the 6 games he started last season.and less face it goz is a solid starter but he aint no world beater.a straight up trade would be a fair trade


Regardless if he's not starting because of who's in front of him, he's never played more than a nickleback on that defense, so there's no way of knowing if he's even capable of being a #2. Being in the Jersey market, I've seen plenty of him, and while he might push Lacey down a bit, I'm not sure he'd secure the #2 spot over Bentley especially because he was drafted specifically to play nickel. So i'd agree with M2k and want a little more than a straight up trade. Especially since the Jets are hurting BAD for a RT right now. That situation demands that we get more out of the trade. We're sitting pretty with Gos, Hilliard, Reiff, and Fox capable of starting at RT, while the Jets have a turnbuckle. If they sweet the deal with a draft pick, i'd be all for it, but as it sits right now, the Jets will be lucky to win 6 games with their OL right now. Tebow is going to have to start to survive, and with the utter lack of weapons after Holmes, Green being no better than a #2 back, they NEED to fix it, and we're sitting in a position that we can ask for more. Straight up might seem fair from a talent standpoint, but from a need basis, both their GM and Head Coach have their jobs riding on it. They'll offer more.


i think we are hurting just as bad for a corner (and probably worse for a safety). im with allenslions on this one. i think gosder picked it up around mid way last season, may have had something to do with his health but wilson s a good player who can erase the entire aaron berry debacle. from a financial standpoint it would work well bc wilson has one of those rare 5 year rookie contract which means that instead of being a 1 yr rental like eric wright we could have him until 2014 for reasonable cost. cherilus is in the last year of his deal. i see a small but not huge dropoff moving from cherilus to hilliard for the season but that opens some space for fox and reiff to project into down the road. it also kind of solves the problem of keeping too many tackles on the roster in place of someone who could provide some interior OL depth.


August 22nd, 2012, 10:05 am
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Post Re: Cornerback options
I think that Kyle Wilson would be tremendous for Gos! This was someone that I was high on in the draft coming out of Boise. He is playing nickle on a team that has the best two starting corners in the league with Revis and the baby maker Cro. If that trade would be possible we would have Houston, Bentley, Wilson, Lacey, Smith, Greenwood. This for the first time would have you with real depth at this position. As far a Gos, I think a trade would allow us to keep Hillard, Fox, Rieff, Backus for the tackels and not have us cut young talent at this position. The way our Lions are designed at this point we would have to cut one of these Tackels, you cant carry 5 into the start of the season.


August 22nd, 2012, 10:17 am
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Post Re: Cornerback options
311nic wrote:
I think that Kyle Wilson would be tremendous for Gos! This was someone that I was high on in the draft coming out of Boise. He is playing nickle on a team that has the best two starting corners in the league with Revis and the baby maker Cro. If that trade would be possible we would have Houston, Bentley, Wilson, Lacey, Smith, Greenwood. This for the first time would have you with real depth at this position. As far a Gos, I think a trade would allow us to keep Hillard, Fox, Rieff, Backus for the tackels and not have us cut young talent at this position. The way our Lions are designed at this point we would have to cut one of these Tackels, you cant carry 5 into the start of the season.


If they don't trade Gos, they will carry 5, because all 3 non-starters can backup every position except center, leaving just Gandy to back Dom up. If any were to be released, it'd be Hilliard with Fox staying healthy this offseason.

And we don't have a serious problem at corner, we have a serious problem at Safety. The corners are doing what they're supposed to do. The safeties is where there is a lack of depth with Delmas down with his knee. Coleman and Wendling are all we have. Everyone beneath them are horrendous.

At Corner, you have Houston and Bentley 1 and 2, Lacey and smith at nickle, Green and Greenwood behind them. Wilson would definitely help there, but Lacey or Smith would be the loser there. Green and Greenwood are draft picks, so will be kept around to grow. An improvement in the nickle without a doubt, but still doesn't solve the real issue at safety. I'm praying extra hard that Coleman doesn't get hurt again.

Again, I'm not saying its a bad trade. I just know Mayhew could pull a great deal because the Jets are in a terrible situation. Neither Sanchez or Tebow will survive behind that line, and neither Tannebaum or Ryan (possibly Ryan because he gets Woody media attention) will survive if they have a losing record. How badly a team needs a player is a far bigger part of the equation of the deal than most give credit too. I think it will happen or not after this weekend's games, before the cutdown. The Jet's next-tackle-in-line is having a good week of practice, but how he plays this week will determine how desperate the Jets become. They're the only team that hasn't scored a TD yet in the preseason.


August 22nd, 2012, 2:40 pm
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Post Re: Cornerback options
njroar wrote:
311nic wrote:
I think that Kyle Wilson would be tremendous for Gos! This was someone that I was high on in the draft coming out of Boise. He is playing nickle on a team that has the best two starting corners in the league with Revis and the baby maker Cro. If that trade would be possible we would have Houston, Bentley, Wilson, Lacey, Smith, Greenwood. This for the first time would have you with real depth at this position. As far a Gos, I think a trade would allow us to keep Hillard, Fox, Rieff, Backus for the tackels and not have us cut young talent at this position. The way our Lions are designed at this point we would have to cut one of these Tackels, you cant carry 5 into the start of the season.


If they don't trade Gos, they will carry 5, because all 3 non-starters can backup every position except center, leaving just Gandy to back Dom up. If any were to be released, it'd be Hilliard with Fox staying healthy this offseason.


Completely agree. The Lions have said they will keep the best football players, and they have been cross training the offensive linemen to be able to play all positions. Reiff, Hilliard and Fox have seen time at both tackle positions and both guard positions. Cherilus has even been used at guard, both this year and last year, in practice.

njroar wrote:
And we don't have a serious problem at corner, we have a serious problem at Safety. The corners are doing what they're supposed to do. The safeties is where there is a lack of depth with Delmas down with his knee. Coleman and Wendling are all we have. Everyone beneath them are horrendous.

At Corner, you have Houston and Bentley 1 and 2, Lacey and smith at nickle, Green and Greenwood behind them. Wilson would definitely help there, but Lacey or Smith would be the loser there. Green and Greenwood are draft picks, so will be kept around to grow. An improvement in the nickle without a doubt, but still doesn't solve the real issue at safety. I'm praying extra hard that Coleman doesn't get hurt again.


Again, right on the mark. Although our corner situation could use some experience and improvement, it was our safety play last year that really let us down in the second half. When Delmas went down, Spievey got super exposed and nobody else was up to the task. Coleman and Wendling are good, but neither excels in coverage. Even Delmas, who I would say is our best coverage safety, isn't really that strong in that area. This is the Lions Achille's Heel. Anything deep over the middle against this defense causes me to hold my breath. Getting Kyle Wilson would not suck, but it does nothing for the safety position.

njroar wrote:
Again, I'm not saying its a bad trade. I just know Mayhew could pull a great deal because the Jets are in a terrible situation. Neither Sanchez or Tebow will survive behind that line, and neither Tannebaum or Ryan (possibly Ryan because he gets Woody media attention) will survive if they have a losing record. How badly a team needs a player is a far bigger part of the equation of the deal than most give credit too. I think it will happen or not after this weekend's games, before the cutdown. The Jet's next-tackle-in-line is having a good week of practice, but how he plays this week will determine how desperate the Jets become. They're the only team that hasn't scored a TD yet in the preseason.


Gosder would be a good pickup for the Jets for two reasons. First, they want to run the ball more than most teams. They are lacking a right tackle, in a big way, and need that component to be able to move the ball how they want. Second, if Tebow ever becomes their starter, the right tackle position becomes that much more important to them. I see the Jets being much more needy for a good, starting quality RT than the Lions are for a starting CB. And that is exactly why I say the Lions should ask for something beyond just a straight up trade. Kyle Wilson is NOT a proven starter. Despite playing the nickle spot, he faces a different type of receiver there than he would at the outside spot. The only thing that works in the Jets favor is the contracts. With Gos in the last year of this deal, it causes his value to go down a bit. Also, the fact that he had microfracture surgery doesn't help either. But he seems to have put that behind him.

Somehow I don't think the trade will happen. But I wouldn't be terribly upset if it did. I would hope that Mayhew pulls his magic one more time and maximizes the return.

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August 22nd, 2012, 3:03 pm
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Post Re: Cornerback options
Shotty wrote:
m2karateman wrote:
regularjoe12 wrote:
depends on whether or not the other 10 guys learn to tackle. so far that has been a big disapointment this preseason and it doesn't matter how well you cover if you can't tackle.


I agree. Projecting a possible record based on whether one position is improved slightly is just a wild guess.

Regardless of what happens with personnel, I predict a 9-7 season, give or take a game.


Dang. 7 losses? I think we lost 6 at most, and that's what I'm predicting, 10-6. Losses to San Francisco, Houston, Green Bay, Chicago, @ Philly, and 1 other game (either other GB game or Seattle).


You have to remember that last season we EASILY could have been a six or seven win team. We pulled four victories from the jaws of defeat by big comebacks against teams that weren't really that good (Dallas, Minnesota, Oakland, Carolina). Sorry, but that's something that can't be relied upon to happen season after season.

I immediately think we have three losses in our division alone (GB twice and Chicago). Last year Chicago handed the Lions their butts when they went to the Windy City. Take those three losses, and now look at having to beat San Fran at Candlestick, the Eagles in Philly, Houston and Atlanta. Those could all realistically be losses, and that's seven right there.

I don't think 9-7 is an unrealistic prediction. Not at all. This won't be a cakewalk, and an 11 win season would be something phenomenal.

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August 22nd, 2012, 3:18 pm
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