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 GAME DAY THREAD: Obama vs. Romney 
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Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Obama vs. Romney
regularjoe12 wrote:
slybri19 wrote:
I.E., I find it deplorable that you're resorting to libtard/socialist talking points to demonize me on this subject. Facts are facts and you can't spin your way out of them no matter how hard you try.

The facts are that over a hundred companies have announced layoffs, mostly due to the implementation of Obamacare. These include Boeing, Cat, US Cellular,Nextel, and many more.

One key point that you failed to mention is that Obamacare now classifies full time employment as 30 hours per week. Papa Johns is just one example, but Darden Inc., which operates Red Lobster, Olive Garden, Longhorn, and several other restaurant chains will also be cutting their employee hours under 30 per week to avoid the Obamacare mandate.

At the other end of the spectrum, I work for an automotive supplier and am forced to become a member of the UAW because of it. Instead of hiring more workers, they force many of us to work 12 hour days, 6-7 days per week. While I like getting 70 hour paychecks, I don't have much time to spend it. While our medical benefits are great, it's just another reason why they refuse to hire more workers to lessen our workload.

If anyone seriously believes that Obamacare is a job creater as Obama stated, I have a bridge to sell you. Obamacare will cost jobs and anyone who thinks otherwise is ignorant or blatantly lying.

If you seriously want to lower medical costs, you open insurance availability across state lines and limit malpractice lawsuits( i.e. tort reform).Obamacare does none of that. In fact, it encourages unneccessary procedures through executive fiat.

And contrary to what IE stated, the majority of Americans favor the repeal of Obamacare by a 10% margin. Lying may have worked for Goebels, but I won't let you get away with it. Every single poll shows that the American people want that monstrosity gone. Obamacare MUST go.


Hasn't "full time" been set at 32 hours for more than a decade now? It has been for any company i have worked for. I see what you are saying about the layoffs, ( and from a coroporate perspective the layoffs make sense) but the hours you refer to have been long standing. I dont think that can be blaimed on the current douche baggery of an administration...


The point is, RJ, that if you work less than 30 hours under Obamacare, the employer is not subject to the $2k penalty for not providing healthcare to that worker or their family. So, what businesses are doing (especially restaurants) is cutting the hours of full-time employees of waitresses and bar tenders that were working 30+ hours, or eliminating the positions altogether, to avoid the fee.

Like Republicans said, the Obamacare bill is going to cost us tens of thousands of jobs. Those were called "Republican scare tactics," but it looks like it is the reality of the situation. I wonder what Obama has to say about his beloved HC bill now? My prediction, he will call it a necessary evil or something like that, or he will say that things will equal out once the "benefits" of the bill start to be realized (but there are no real benefits, it's just going to drive up the cost of healthcare astronomically).


November 12th, 2012, 4:32 pm
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Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Obama vs. Romney
whats worse is (as i undestand it anyhow) is those people wuith the cut hours will still have to have insurance. so they will have less $$ coming in and now have an extra bill....that wont be good...

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November 12th, 2012, 4:35 pm
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Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Obama vs. Romney
For me, the election is as much about the social agenda as it is the economy. As long as the Republican party continues its quest to destroy religious freedom and marginalize gay people, I'll never even consider voting for their candidate. It's that simple.

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November 12th, 2012, 4:36 pm
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Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Obama vs. Romney
mwill2 wrote:
For me, the election is as much about the social agenda as it is the economy. As long as the Republican party continues its quest to destroy religious freedom and marginalize gay people, I'll never even consider voting for their candidate. It's that simple.


I've never understood why topics like gay marraige or abortion are even a consideration for the presidential election. Presidents dont pass laws....Thats why we have a senate. Those topics are nothing more than opinion on a presidential level. If you want want gay marraige you should get more involved with state politics. THATS where that is going to change. either that or in the senate or House. for the pres it's just a distraction for the other side to use and act like it's a HUGE deal. It simply does not matter for the pres. other than veto power (and up till now no senate has even come close to passing a law to making it to the presidents desk) the president can do NOTHING to change it.

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November 12th, 2012, 4:47 pm
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Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Obama vs. Romney
regularjoe12 wrote:
mwill2 wrote:
For me, the election is as much about the social agenda as it is the economy. As long as the Republican party continues its quest to destroy religious freedom and marginalize gay people, I'll never even consider voting for their candidate. It's that simple.


I've never understood why topics like gay marraige or abortion are even a consideration for the presidential election. Presidents dont pass laws....Thats why we have a senate. Those topics are nothing more than opinion on a presidential level. If you want want gay marraige you should get more involved with state politics. THATS where that is going to change. either that or in the senate or House. for the pres it's just a distraction for the other side to use and act like it's a HUGE deal. It simply does not matter for the pres. other than veto power (and up till now no senate has even come close to passing a law to making it to the presidents desk) the president can do NOTHING to change it.



I agree. The bottom line is that the majority of Americans knew that Romney was better for the economy (something he CAN control and help with), but they preferred Obama on social issues (something that the President has zero control over). It's ridiculous.


November 12th, 2012, 4:52 pm
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Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Obama vs. Romney
wjb21ndtown wrote:
regularjoe12 wrote:
mwill2 wrote:
For me, the election is as much about the social agenda as it is the economy. As long as the Republican party continues its quest to destroy religious freedom and marginalize gay people, I'll never even consider voting for their candidate. It's that simple.


I've never understood why topics like gay marraige or abortion are even a consideration for the presidential election. Presidents dont pass laws....Thats why we have a senate. Those topics are nothing more than opinion on a presidential level. If you want want gay marraige you should get more involved with state politics. THATS where that is going to change. either that or in the senate or House. for the pres it's just a distraction for the other side to use and act like it's a HUGE deal. It simply does not matter for the pres. other than veto power (and up till now no senate has even come close to passing a law to making it to the presidents desk) the president can do NOTHING to change it.



I agree. The bottom line is that the majority of Americans knew that Romney was better for the economy (something he CAN control and help with), but they preferred Obama on social issues (something that the President has zero control over). It's ridiculous.


Ummm...you guys know about the Supreme Court, right? You know who nominates the justices, right?

You guys know who has to SIGN a bill before it becomes a law, right? This is 7th grade civics.

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November 12th, 2012, 4:54 pm
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Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Obama vs. Romney
mwill2, it's because of ignorant single issue voters that the country is in the state it's in. Congrats on your stupidity. You're gonna get what you deserve.

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November 12th, 2012, 5:00 pm
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Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Obama vs. Romney
mwill2 wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
regularjoe12 wrote:
mwill2 wrote:
For me, the election is as much about the social agenda as it is the economy. As long as the Republican party continues its quest to destroy religious freedom and marginalize gay people, I'll never even consider voting for their candidate. It's that simple.


I've never understood why topics like gay marraige or abortion are even a consideration for the presidential election. Presidents dont pass laws....Thats why we have a senate. Those topics are nothing more than opinion on a presidential level. If you want want gay marraige you should get more involved with state politics. THATS where that is going to change. either that or in the senate or House. for the pres it's just a distraction for the other side to use and act like it's a HUGE deal. It simply does not matter for the pres. other than veto power (and up till now no senate has even come close to passing a law to making it to the presidents desk) the president can do NOTHING to change it.



I agree. The bottom line is that the majority of Americans knew that Romney was better for the economy (something he CAN control and help with), but they preferred Obama on social issues (something that the President has zero control over). It's ridiculous.


Ummm...you guys know about the Supreme Court, right? You know who nominates the justices, right?

You guys know who has to SIGN a bill before it becomes a law, right? This is 7th grade civics.


ok 7th grader.....you ARE aware that the S.C. does not make laws either right? they just determine if a law is constitutional or not. and since you brought up signing the laws by the pres, can you please tell me when a bill to legalize gay marraige has hit the presidents desk to sign or veto....take your time to look...I'll wait. when you've had enough searching I'll lgive you a hint...it's NEVER


so tell me again how the pres dictates those kinds of laws again? fact is you are barking up the wrong tree.....once again look to your senators, house reps, or state senate. this one is out of teh presidents hands. plain and simple.

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November 12th, 2012, 5:04 pm
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Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Obama vs. Romney
SLY...you will NEVER win the hearts and minds of voter by calling them stupid bro. you NEED to revise your tactics. you are turning people AWAY from your cause!



of course I say this after i insult a guy by calling him a 7th grader....so i'm a hipocryte! lol :oops:

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November 12th, 2012, 5:04 pm
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Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Obama vs. Romney
regularjoe12 wrote:
mwill2 wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
regularjoe12 wrote:
mwill2 wrote:
For me, the election is as much about the social agenda as it is the economy. As long as the Republican party continues its quest to destroy religious freedom and marginalize gay people, I'll never even consider voting for their candidate. It's that simple.


I've never understood why topics like gay marraige or abortion are even a consideration for the presidential election. Presidents dont pass laws....Thats why we have a senate. Those topics are nothing more than opinion on a presidential level. If you want want gay marraige you should get more involved with state politics. THATS where that is going to change. either that or in the senate or House. for the pres it's just a distraction for the other side to use and act like it's a HUGE deal. It simply does not matter for the pres. other than veto power (and up till now no senate has even come close to passing a law to making it to the presidents desk) the president can do NOTHING to change it.



I agree. The bottom line is that the majority of Americans knew that Romney was better for the economy (something he CAN control and help with), but they preferred Obama on social issues (something that the President has zero control over). It's ridiculous.


Ummm...you guys know about the Supreme Court, right? You know who nominates the justices, right?

You guys know who has to SIGN a bill before it becomes a law, right? This is 7th grade civics.


ok 7th grader.....you ARE aware that the S.C. does not make laws either right? they just determine if a law is constitutional or not. and since you brought up signing the laws by the pres, can you please tell me when a bill to legalize gay marraige has hit the presidents desk to sign or veto....take your time to look...I'll wait. when you've had enough searching I'll lgive you a hint...it's NEVER


so tell me again how the pres dictates those kinds of laws again? fact is you are barking up the wrong tree.....once again look to your senators, house reps, or state senate. this one is out of teh presidents hands. plain and simple.


I never wrote that a President writes legislation. It was stated that the President's role on legislation was nothing more than "opinion." That is False. A President has veto power. Therefore, any legislation regarding social issues (abortion, religious rights, gay marriage, etc.) goes right across the President's desk. Are you suggesting that there have been no bills involving social issues in Congress over the last four years?

Regarding the Supreme Court, if you've been paying attention, there are now over 30 states with some kind of gay marriage ban in their state code--many of these states (like my home state of NC) have strengthened these measures by adding constitutional amendments banning same-sex marriages and domestic partnerships. Read about David Boies and Ted Olson and the decision rendered by the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals--that decision could go before the US Supreme Court. If not their case, another case will follow shortly. The SCOTUS has the power strike down all of those state bans. So yes, that particular social issue directly involves the Presidential election.

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November 12th, 2012, 5:38 pm
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Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Obama vs. Romney
wjb21ndtown wrote:
UK Lion wrote:
slybri19 wrote:
Every single poll shows that the American people want [Obamacare ] gone.

Every single poll apart from one last Tuesday ... :lol:

UK, that election wasn't about Obamacare.

It wasn't only about Obamacare, I agree. So to make out it was a referendum on Obamacare was unfair of me. But in my defence, I only did it to try and troll sly :lol:


November 12th, 2012, 6:14 pm
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Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Obama vs. Romney
a couple of things:


Veto power is usless when a bill never crosses his desk to begin with, so while you are right about that, when it comes to abortion and gay marraige it's a moot point, cuz it has yet to happen (and wont in any near future). so on the 2 cases that swade your vote, it IS just an opinion.

and you are correct about the SC being able to overturn laws, they dont make them themselves. the other part is they dont volunteer which laws to address. the laws they look to appeal are ones that are brought to them. if you are so concerned, get a civil case with enough people together and bring it before them THEN make the descion on weather the Pres dictates what happens in the SC.

Long story short what you base your descicion making on voting for the pres should be changed. Put the focus of gay marraige and Abortion on to your localized and house/senate votes. The pres is for the overall direction of the country. Those issues simply don't have a real impact on the presidency is all.

Change the officials in your state and you can change the mormon-esk laws that are in place. The president will NEVER help you there. Ever.

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Last edited by regularjoe12 on November 12th, 2012, 6:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.



November 12th, 2012, 6:20 pm
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Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Obama vs. Romney
mwill2 wrote:
regularjoe12 wrote:
mwill2 wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
regularjoe12 wrote:
mwill2 wrote:
For me, the election is as much about the social agenda as it is the economy. As long as the Republican party continues its quest to destroy religious freedom and marginalize gay people, I'll never even consider voting for their candidate. It's that simple.


I've never understood why topics like gay marraige or abortion are even a consideration for the presidential election. Presidents dont pass laws....Thats why we have a senate. Those topics are nothing more than opinion on a presidential level. If you want want gay marraige you should get more involved with state politics. THATS where that is going to change. either that or in the senate or House. for the pres it's just a distraction for the other side to use and act like it's a HUGE deal. It simply does not matter for the pres. other than veto power (and up till now no senate has even come close to passing a law to making it to the presidents desk) the president can do NOTHING to change it.



I agree. The bottom line is that the majority of Americans knew that Romney was better for the economy (something he CAN control and help with), but they preferred Obama on social issues (something that the President has zero control over). It's ridiculous.


Ummm...you guys know about the Supreme Court, right? You know who nominates the justices, right?

You guys know who has to SIGN a bill before it becomes a law, right? This is 7th grade civics.


ok 7th grader.....you ARE aware that the S.C. does not make laws either right? they just determine if a law is constitutional or not. and since you brought up signing the laws by the pres, can you please tell me when a bill to legalize gay marraige has hit the presidents desk to sign or veto....take your time to look...I'll wait. when you've had enough searching I'll lgive you a hint...it's NEVER


so tell me again how the pres dictates those kinds of laws again? fact is you are barking up the wrong tree.....once again look to your senators, house reps, or state senate. this one is out of teh presidents hands. plain and simple.


I never wrote that a President writes legislation. It was stated that the President's role on legislation was nothing more than "opinion." That is False. A President has veto power. Therefore, any legislation regarding social issues (abortion, religious rights, gay marriage, etc.) goes right across the President's desk. Are you suggesting that there have been no bills involving social issues in Congress over the last four years?

Regarding the Supreme Court, if you've been paying attention, there are now over 30 states with some kind of gay marriage ban in their state code--many of these states (like my home state of NC) have strengthened these measures by adding constitutional amendments banning same-sex marriages and domestic partnerships. Read about David Boies and Ted Olson and the decision rendered by the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals--that decision could go before the US Supreme Court. If not their case, another case will follow shortly. The SCOTUS has the power strike down all of those state bans. So yes, that particular social issue directly involves the Presidential election.


The veto power would only be used to block legislation. I don't get why abortion is even an issue in Presidential elections, at all. Abortion is already deemed legal by the Supreme Court. Any legislation on the subject would be to BAN abortion, it would never get through, and it's a fundamentally protected right, granted by the U.S. Constitution, so says the SCOTUS. Any law banning abortion, even if signed by the President, would likely be unconstitutional. So, why is it an issue at all?

Gay rights are one thing, but to kill the economy over them is ridiculous, IMO, even if you are gay... And still, this current President doesn't have gay rights on his agenda, the Congress doesn't have gay rights on their agenda, so what the hell is the difference?

In Re: Sup. Ct. Appointments
Ginsberg is ready to die, and probably should have retired years ago. Scalia and Kennedy will probably wait until another Republican wins the Whitehouse before retiring, so again, what's the difference? Roberts seems to lean Liberal anyhow, so is it really that big of an issue?


November 12th, 2012, 6:21 pm
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Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Obama vs. Romney
regularjoe12 wrote:
SLY...you will NEVER win the hearts and minds of voter by calling them stupid bro. you NEED to revise your tactics. you are turning people AWAY from your cause!



of course I say this after i insult a guy by calling him a 7th grader....so i'm a hipocryte! lol :oops:

Stupid is as stupid does. I call them like I see them.

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November 12th, 2012, 7:45 pm
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Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Obama vs. Romney
slybri19 wrote:
regularjoe12 wrote:
SLY...you will NEVER win the hearts and minds of voter by calling them stupid bro. you NEED to revise your tactics. you are turning people AWAY from your cause!



of course I say this after i insult a guy by calling him a 7th grader....so i'm a hipocryte! lol :oops:

Stupid is as stupid does. I call them like I see them.


And you don't mind that they will continue to vote the way they do, cause you're not reaching them? I don't buy that for a second. remember my friend, you attract more bees with honey than you do with vinegar. If your goal is to start a revolution, and inspire change, you are your own worst enemy.

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November 12th, 2012, 7:51 pm
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