View unanswered posts | View active topics It is currently April 16th, 2014, 3:42 pm



Reply to topic  [ 60 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 GAME DAY THREAD: Lions vs. Cardinals 
Author Message
Online
Team MVP
User avatar

Joined: February 20th, 2007, 10:51 pm
Posts: 3257
Location: Saginaw, MI
Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions vs. Cardinals
Hystrix wrote:
kdsberman wrote:
SWFLionsFan wrote:
WTF...another Stafford pick six.

I'm sorry, but Schwartz & company should be under some serious fire this week. If it were any other owner but WCF, I'd say there would be a better than average chance that the entire coaching staff gets fired after the season.


YUP, but not with the Lions. Most teams, like you said, would have someone fired by this time, but not us. Oh no. Why would we want to FIX the problem. ](*,) ](*,) ](*,)



Becase firing the entire coaching staff isn't a "fix." It's an entire team "reboot."

It'd be like having a broken arm and having the doctor transplant your brain into a new body...

Look this team needs help, but understand if we fire Swartz and hire a new HC we WILL be starting all over again. We've done that 4 times in the last decade. You really wanna start this again?

Worked for the niners.

_________________
April 22nd, 2010 @ 7:44p.m. "The Detroit Lions select...Ndamukong Suh". Those are some beautiful words.


Lionbacker2 Fantasy Champion 2011


December 17th, 2012, 9:22 am
Profile
Modmin Dude
User avatar

Joined: December 31st, 2004, 9:55 am
Posts: 11819
Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions vs. Cardinals
[quote=ESPN"]Wrap-up: Cardinals 38, Lions 10
December, 16, 2012
By Kevin Seifert | ESPN.com

What it means: The Detroit Lions have lost six consecutive games, and Sunday's embarrassing performance to the Arizona Cardinals -- losers of nine consecutive games, including a 58-0 defeat last week -- is the kind of game that gets people fired. On the plus side, the Lions did break their tie with the Cardinals in 2013 draft positioning.

AccountabilityWatch: This game has to be considered the low point of coach Jim Schwartz's tenure. There were some bad losses in 2009 and even the early parts of 2010, but getting blown out by a team that hadn't won in more than two months is a result that makes you question the direction of the program. Surely, the Lions were playing without a number of good players -- from defensive tackle Nick Fairley to tight end Brandon Pettigrew to three key wide receivers -- but that doesn't excuse the kind of sloppy play we'll detail in a moment. Have the Lions already checked out on the 2012 season? It would be hard to argue against it at the moment. I don't think it will cost Schwartz a job, but it should rank as the most worrisome loss on his head-coaching resume.

StaffordWatch: Based on passer rating, at least, quarterback Matthew Stafford had his worst game since his rookie season. Three interceptions, two of which were returned for touchdowns, left him with a 37.4 rating. His only games with lower ratings were his first-ever game in 2009 and the Thanksgiving Day game last year, which he played four days after severely injuring his left shoulder. There is no doubt Stafford didn't have most of his top receivers, but elite quarterbacks are expected to rise above such obstacles.

Mistakes galore: In addition to the two interception returns, the Lions also set up the Cardinals at their five-yard line by muffing a punt in the second quarter. That's 21 points the Lions handed to a Cardinals team whose own offense has been dreadful this season. The Cardinals' offense managed only 191 total yards and converted only two first downs and still won in a runaway.

What's next: A national television audience will get to render its own judgment against the Lions in a Saturday night game against the Atlanta Falcons at Ford Field.

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcnorth/post/_ ... 8-lions-10[/quote]

_________________
Go Lions!!! headbang.gif

Joe Fauria, MVP!


December 17th, 2012, 9:38 am
Profile
National Champion

Joined: August 13th, 2006, 11:04 pm
Posts: 862
Location: Washington, DC
Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions vs. Cardinals
kdsberman wrote:
Hystrix wrote:
kdsberman wrote:
SWFLionsFan wrote:
WTF...another Stafford pick six.

I'm sorry, but Schwartz & company should be under some serious fire this week. If it were any other owner but WCF, I'd say there would be a better than average chance that the entire coaching staff gets fired after the season.


YUP, but not with the Lions. Most teams, like you said, would have someone fired by this time, but not us. Oh no. Why would we want to FIX the problem. ](*,) ](*,) ](*,)



Becase firing the entire coaching staff isn't a "fix." It's an entire team "reboot."

It'd be like having a broken arm and having the doctor transplant your brain into a new body...

Look this team needs help, but understand if we fire Swartz and hire a new HC we WILL be starting all over again. We've done that 4 times in the last decade. You really wanna start this again?

Worked for the niners.



Oh. Did it work for us? Ever? Again, maybe they fire Schwartz, but don't expect another Lions playoff apperence for a long time.

I really don't think this team needs to be blown up just yet.


December 17th, 2012, 10:23 am
Profile
Fired Head Coach (0-16 record)
User avatar

Joined: April 5th, 2007, 5:51 pm
Posts: 2270
Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions vs. Cardinals
Quote:
The Cardinals' offense managed only 191 total yards and converted only two first downs and still won in a runaway.


Quote:
The Cardinals' offense managed only 191 total yards and converted only two first downs and still won in a runaway.


Quote:
The Cardinals' offense managed only 191 total yards and converted only two first downs and still won in a runaway.


Nuff Said. I will circle back to the number of terrible coaching calls (primarily on offense) that impacted this game along with Stafford looking like the Rookie on thei field. For me that was the worst loss since finishing the season 0-16.


December 17th, 2012, 12:10 pm
Profile ICQ WWW
Online
Team MVP
User avatar

Joined: February 20th, 2007, 10:51 pm
Posts: 3257
Location: Saginaw, MI
Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions vs. Cardinals
Hystrix wrote:
kdsberman wrote:
Hystrix wrote:
kdsberman wrote:
SWFLionsFan wrote:
WTF...another Stafford pick six.

I'm sorry, but Schwartz & company should be under some serious fire this week. If it were any other owner but WCF, I'd say there would be a better than average chance that the entire coaching staff gets fired after the season.


YUP, but not with the Lions. Most teams, like you said, would have someone fired by this time, but not us. Oh no. Why would we want to FIX the problem. ](*,) ](*,) ](*,)



Becase firing the entire coaching staff isn't a "fix." It's an entire team "reboot."

It'd be like having a broken arm and having the doctor transplant your brain into a new body...

Look this team needs help, but understand if we fire Swartz and hire a new HC we WILL be starting all over again. We've done that 4 times in the last decade. You really wanna start this again?

Worked for the niners.



Oh. Did it work for us? Ever? Again, maybe they fire Schwartz, but don't expect another Lions playoff apperence for a long time.

I really don't think this team needs to be blown up just yet.


Ok. Im not saying fire Schwartz. BUT, do you really believe this guy is the answer? Why keep playing this game when we can try something different. Regardless of what we both think, you'll at least get what you want because Mr. Ford aint firing no one.

_________________
April 22nd, 2010 @ 7:44p.m. "The Detroit Lions select...Ndamukong Suh". Those are some beautiful words.


Lionbacker2 Fantasy Champion 2011


December 17th, 2012, 1:07 pm
Profile
National Champion

Joined: August 13th, 2006, 11:04 pm
Posts: 862
Location: Washington, DC
Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions vs. Cardinals
kdsberman wrote:
Ok. Im not saying fire Schwartz. BUT, do you really believe this guy is the answer? Why keep playing this game when we can try something different. Regardless of what we both think, you'll at least get what you want because Mr. Ford aint firing no one.



I don't know, man. I'm not sure Schwartz is the answer, but continuisly going though coaches isn't good for the team.

Remember Barry Sanders? He quit the game, because we started rebuilding. The Leos had done that his whole career.

Look, in the off season they trim some fat. They re-evaluate. They take a hard look at the franchise. But just "fire everybody" isn't going to help.


December 17th, 2012, 1:16 pm
Profile
Fired Head Coach (0-16 record)
User avatar

Joined: April 5th, 2007, 5:51 pm
Posts: 2270
Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions vs. Cardinals
I'm not saying the Lions are the 9ers, but did SF "Rebuild" when they brought Harbaugh in? There are plenty of other examples of this i'm sure. Yes, the Lions (Run by WCF Sr + Millen for a solid portion of time) have restarted time and again with coaches.. but they often tried entirely different coaches with wildly diff schemes (tampon 2, martz offense, etc) that required retools of the roster. The lions now have the Core they need, and with a few good draft picks and intelligent veteran signing should def be contending for playoffs. Bring in the RIGHT coach with a proven track record of getting the most from their players. The team will "BUY_IN" again, which its pretty obvious to me most of them dont at this pt, and you move forward from where we are. As long as they dont hire a rookie HC with a narrow systemic view of how to run a team they can move forward without taking steps back.


December 17th, 2012, 1:44 pm
Profile ICQ WWW
RIP Killer
User avatar

Joined: August 6th, 2004, 9:21 am
Posts: 9244
Location: Dallas
Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions vs. Cardinals
freep wrote:
Grading the Detroit Lions in Sunday's loss: Mostly C's and D's

Quarterback

D-minus

Matthew Stafford said he played "about as bad as I can play," throwing three interceptions and completing just 24 of 50 passes for 246 yards. But he didn't have much help. His receivers didn't win on the outside, and he was under constant pressure. Stafford started the game 0-for-6, and his turnovers were costly. His best throw was in the second quarter on what appeared to be a no-look pass to Kevin Smith that went for a 13-yard gain on a well-designed screen on third-and-9.

Running backs

D-plus

The Lions had a disappointing day on the ground against a Cardinals team that ranked near the bottom in the league in rushing yards allowed (140.5). Mikel Leshoure had a nice 14-yard run that he was a step from taking the distance, but he got thrown for a 1-yard loss on third-and-1 to start the third quarter. Joique Bell saw a reduced role with just seven carries, and Kevin Smith has to show better awareness on the swing pass he caught in the second half while out of bounds.

Receivers/tight ends

D


Somehow, Calvin Johnson managed 10 catches and 121 yards despite a defense that did everything in its power to take him away. On some third-down plays in the middle of the field, the Cardinals put two defenders on Johnson at the line of scrimmage. But the Lions got no real production from the rest of their receiving corps. Tony Scheffler had two drops, including a costly one early in the fourth quarter that would have gone for a big gain, and Kris Durham and Stafford had another miscommunication on Stafford's final pick in the end zone.

Offensive line

D


The Lions had no answer up front for Calais Campbell (eight tackles, four for loss, one sack) and did a poor job accounting for Arizona's presnap movement. Gosder Cherilus and Jeff Backus had holding penalties on back-to-back second-quarter plays (though Backus' was declined). Cherilus and Riley Reiff also had back-to-back false-start penalties with the Lions backed up near their goal line before Stafford's first interception.

Defensive line

C


Ndamukong Suh had the Lions' only sack, when he turnstiled Pat McQuistan on the first play of the fourth quarter. The Lions didn't have many other opportunities in the pass rush as Arizona tried to get the ball out quick on bubble screens and flares. Beanie Wells ran for three touchdowns, but the Lions allowed just 3.4 yards per carry and held Arizona to 37 yards rushing on 15 first-down carries.

Linebackers

C


Things didn't start great for the Lions when Stephen Tulloch and Louis Delmas missed tackles on LaRod Stephens-Howling on Arizona's second offensive play. Tulloch finished with 10 stops, and DeAndre Levy made a nice play to intercept a poorly thrown Ryan Lindley pass, stepping in front of Jeff King for a first-quarter pick. Justin Durant said he thought he stripped Wells before he crossed the goal line on his first touchdown.

Defensive backs

C-minus


Chris Houston was flagged for a questionable pass-interference penalty on Larry Fitzgerald, but he did an admirable job on Arizona's No. 1 receiver, helping hold him to four catches for 22 yards. Jonte Green bit on a double move by Andre Roberts and grabbed his face mask as he tried to recover to prevent a big play. Drayton Florence took over in nickel situations after Jacob Lacey left early with a knee injury and lost track of where he was on the field when Lindley completed a 14-yard pass to Roberts on third-and-10.

Special teams

D


The Lions had another crucial special-teams blunder when Pat Lee ran into Stefan Logan as Logan tried to fair catch a second-quarter punt. Arizona recovered the muff and scored on the next play. Nick Harris averaged 47 yards a punt and dropped two inside the 20, and while Patrick Peterson didn't have any big returns, he did seem to squeeze out extra yards every time he fielded a punt.

Coaching

D-minus

The Lions have the longest losing streak in the NFL at six games, and coach Jim Schwartz hasn't pushed the right buttons to get things back on track. Everything the Lions did Sunday seemed to backfire. They deferred after winning the toss for the first time this year and failed to set the tone defensively, letting Arizona drive into field-goal range before getting bailed out by penalties. Backed up at their 2 in the second quarter, they tried to be aggressive offensively, and Stafford threw an interception. Sunday was easily the Lions' most disappointing loss of the year.

_________________
Image
LB Tweet


December 17th, 2012, 2:12 pm
Profile WWW
Veteran General Manager
User avatar

Joined: May 7th, 2005, 3:25 pm
Posts: 7119
Location: Earth/Sagittarius Dwarf Galaxy
Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions vs. Cardinals
Shotty wrote:
liontrax wrote:
Oh well, we just improved our draft slot, and today's game against a poor but inspired team proves we we have a long way to go in improving the talent base.


That's the WCF way of looking at things.

If this was one of any of the other 31 franchises, Schwartz would be gone IMMEDIATELY after this game, if not before. This team has given up, and it's that simple.


That is wrong. You think everything went peachy for Bill Cower when he was rebuilding the Steelers. He had a couple of rotten years there. You make a mess in your underwear. Yes, by all means. Make a change. You hire a coach, you give him more than 3 years to get things working. The Steeler way works. Yes, Schwartz should be on the hot seat next year. But, he should remain the coach.


December 18th, 2012, 1:33 am
Profile
Veteran General Manager
User avatar

Joined: May 7th, 2005, 3:25 pm
Posts: 7119
Location: Earth/Sagittarius Dwarf Galaxy
Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions vs. Cardinals
Hystrix wrote:
Shotty wrote:
liontrax wrote:
Oh well, we just improved our draft slot, and today's game against a poor but inspired team proves we we have a long way to go in improving the talent base.


That's the WCF way of looking at things.

If this was one of any of the other 31 franchises, Schwartz would be gone IMMEDIATELY after this game, if not before. This team has given up, and it's that simple.



That sort of knee jerk reaction is why we are this bad to begin with. Getting a new coach means starting all over again...AGAIN!


And AMEN.


December 18th, 2012, 1:35 am
Profile
Veteran General Manager
User avatar

Joined: May 7th, 2005, 3:25 pm
Posts: 7119
Location: Earth/Sagittarius Dwarf Galaxy
Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions vs. Cardinals
kdsberman wrote:
SWFLionsFan wrote:
WTF...another Stafford pick six.

I'm sorry, but Schwartz & company should be under some serious fire this week. If it were any other owner but WCF, I'd say there would be a better than average chance that the entire coaching staff gets fired after the season.


YUP, but not with the Lions. Most teams, like you said, would have someone fired by this time, but not us. Oh no. Why would we want to FIX the problem. ](*,) ](*,) ](*,)


Firing someone for the sake of a scape goat has sure worked wonders for Philly.


December 18th, 2012, 1:37 am
Profile
Veteran General Manager
User avatar

Joined: May 7th, 2005, 3:25 pm
Posts: 7119
Location: Earth/Sagittarius Dwarf Galaxy
Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions vs. Cardinals
kdsberman wrote:
Hystrix wrote:
kdsberman wrote:
SWFLionsFan wrote:
WTF...another Stafford pick six.

I'm sorry, but Schwartz & company should be under some serious fire this week. If it were any other owner but WCF, I'd say there would be a better than average chance that the entire coaching staff gets fired after the season.


YUP, but not with the Lions. Most teams, like you said, would have someone fired by this time, but not us. Oh no. Why would we want to FIX the problem. ](*,) ](*,) ](*,)



Becase firing the entire coaching staff isn't a "fix." It's an entire team "reboot."

It'd be like having a broken arm and having the doctor transplant your brain into a new body...

Look this team needs help, but understand if we fire Swartz and hire a new HC we WILL be starting all over again. We've done that 4 times in the last decade. You really wanna start this again?

Worked for the niners.


And it has worked oh so well for the Browns. NOT.

And Hystrix, yes. There are a bunch of gluttons for punishment that would like nothing more than to start all over because they live for the ability to get online and try to prove they know better than the guys that are paid to coach. But, they won't take you up on a challenge like I gave them about play calling. Either first guess it, or don't second guess it people. Any moron can second guess. Prove you know better than the coaches and first guess the calls.


December 18th, 2012, 1:46 am
Profile
Veteran General Manager
User avatar

Joined: May 7th, 2005, 3:25 pm
Posts: 7119
Location: Earth/Sagittarius Dwarf Galaxy
Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions vs. Cardinals
TheRealWags wrote:
[quote=ESPN"]Wrap-up: Cardinals 38, Lions 10
December, 16, 2012
By Kevin Seifert | ESPN.com

What it means: The Detroit Lions have lost six consecutive games, and Sunday's embarrassing performance to the Arizona Cardinals -- losers of nine consecutive games, including a 58-0 defeat last week -- is the kind of game that gets people fired. On the plus side, the Lions did break their tie with the Cardinals in 2013 draft positioning.

AccountabilityWatch: This game has to be considered the low point of coach Jim Schwartz's tenure. There were some bad losses in 2009 and even the early parts of 2010, but getting blown out by a team that hadn't won in more than two months is a result that makes you question the direction of the program. Surely, the Lions were playing without a number of good players -- from defensive tackle Nick Fairley to tight end Brandon Pettigrew to three key wide receivers -- but that doesn't excuse the kind of sloppy play we'll detail in a moment. Have the Lions already checked out on the 2012 season? It would be hard to argue against it at the moment. I don't think it will cost Schwartz a job, but it should rank as the most worrisome loss on his head-coaching resume.

StaffordWatch: Based on passer rating, at least, quarterback Matthew Stafford had his worst game since his rookie season. Three interceptions, two of which were returned for touchdowns, left him with a 37.4 rating. His only games with lower ratings were his first-ever game in 2009 and the Thanksgiving Day game last year, which he played four days after severely injuring his left shoulder. There is no doubt Stafford didn't have most of his top receivers, but elite quarterbacks are expected to rise above such obstacles.

Mistakes galore: In addition to the two interception returns, the Lions also set up the Cardinals at their five-yard line by muffing a punt in the second quarter. That's 21 points the Lions handed to a Cardinals team whose own offense has been dreadful this season. The Cardinals' offense managed only 191 total yards and converted only two first downs and still won in a runaway.

What's next: A national television audience will get to render its own judgment against the Lions in a Saturday night game against the Atlanta Falcons at Ford Field.

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcnorth/post/_ ... 8-lions-10


UM actually, that MUFFED PUNT was actually a MUFFED REF JOB. That muffed punt was caused by a Cardinals Player pushing a Lions Player into the Punt Returner. The Ref should have thrown the flag and the muffed punt would be disallowed and we would have started 10 yards up field from the point of the infraction.


December 18th, 2012, 1:52 am
Profile
League MVP

Joined: February 11th, 2005, 3:01 pm
Posts: 3504
Location: WSU
Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions vs. Cardinals
Hystrix wrote:
kdsberman wrote:
Ok. Im not saying fire Schwartz. BUT, do you really believe this guy is the answer? Why keep playing this game when we can try something different. Regardless of what we both think, you'll at least get what you want because Mr. Ford aint firing no one.



I don't know, man. I'm not sure Schwartz is the answer, but continuisly going though coaches isn't good for the team.

Remember Barry Sanders? He quit the game, because we started rebuilding. The Leos had done that his whole career.

Look, in the off season they trim some fat. They re-evaluate. They take a hard look at the franchise. But just "fire everybody" isn't going to help.


In Barry's opinion they started re building but the team s management was actually going in the right direction. They made the playoffs the same season there best player retired the day before training camp. Barry has stated maybe he wouldnt have retired if they had had good teams. Well, had he played that season maybe they would have had a shot.

As for being scared of what might happen if Schwartz were fired, I ask you to consider the alternative - returning Schwartz and crew for 2013. What is your prediction for the 2013 season? IMO a lot of the problems with this team are coming directly from Schwartz. They had enough talent to contend for a playoff spot this season but Schwartz himself threw away two games - Houston with the red flag and Indianapolis with the conservative "prevent offense" strategy that came from him - not Linehan. What happened in the Houston game is telling, Schwartz said in the post game presser that he threw the flag because he was angry with the call and was still mad about an unsuccessful challenge. The unsuccessful challenge, of course happened in the 1st quarter and the "red flag"/82 yd TD run happened in the 3rd quarter. A head coach needs to able to shake that kind of thing off, he cannot let his emotions get in the way of making the right decisions for his team. But we see Schwartz on the sideline time and time again unable to conrol his emotions. Instead of calling a timeout before the playclock goes off or letting his QB know that it was his mistake, Schwartz ridicules the referee - who by the way made a perfectly correct call. Anyway, the disorganization continues and a play later, Stafford and Kris Durham have a mix up and instead of a 7 point game the Lions are down 21 with a pick 6. Good coaching averts these problems but bad coaching propagates them. The lack of discipline, the offsides penalties, the after the whistle penalties of last year that stopped the Lions in big games, the general sloppiness - they all stem from the head coach. This team is not well coached and it hasnt been for two seasons running. Why would we expect it to be better next season when they probably cant even bring back the same level of talent?


December 18th, 2012, 5:56 am
Profile
Fired Head Coach (0-16 record)
User avatar

Joined: April 5th, 2007, 5:51 pm
Posts: 2270
Post Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions vs. Cardinals
The Legend wrote:
Good coaching averts these problems but bad coaching propagates them. The lack of discipline, the offsides penalties, the after the whistle penalties of last year that stopped the Lions in big games, the general sloppiness - they all stem from the head coach. This team is not well coached and it hasnt been for two seasons running. Why would we expect it to be better next season when they probably cant even bring back the same level of talent?


Sometimes I agree with legend and sometime i Vehemently disagree, but this single sentence epitomizes why it is likely time to move on.

COULD Schwartz get better... sure. Will it be enough to get the team where it needs to go (Making the Playoff which we know we have the talent to reach) or will he continue to actually Hurt the team and Lose games. IMO even if he improves and has a Neutral effect on the outcome, that still isnt enough. We arent looking for a "Neutral" quality coach. We arent looking for Drama filled volatile offseasons followed by mediocrity on the field. We've been there for 50 years.

I wont hate on Mgmt if they give Schwartz another year... I just dont have any faith left that its going to improve next year so I will be much less invested than I was coming off our playoff season, and would prefer that we move on. Players can say all they want that the Coach hasnt lost the team, but actions speak way louder than words, especially in the NFL, and that was capitulence we saw Sunday. Id say less than 25% of the team appears to really be trying at this point, and that is 100% on the coach.


December 18th, 2012, 2:18 pm
Profile ICQ WWW
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic   [ 60 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 3 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.
Designed by STSoftware.