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 Off-Season Moves 
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Post Re: Off-Season Moves
kdsberman wrote:
Well, at least the clears up ONE hole. (or does it)


I think we'll be ok with Palmer or one of the second year guys in the other spot. I think LB is set.

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March 6th, 2013, 6:04 pm
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Post Re: Off-Season Moves
Durant has said to the F.O. and the media that he want's to stay with the Lions. I just hope that we can afford him.


March 6th, 2013, 7:07 pm
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Post Re: Off-Season Moves
great write up. Very interesting point about the CB situation

Quote:
Free agency is less than a week away and the Detroit Lions will head into the 2013 league year with a host of needs. Now free agency is difficult to predict and everybody is putting together their wish lists and trying to match players up to teams. I’m not going to do that because it is an exercise in futility, especially this year with the Lions, because a lot could happen over the next week.

If Matthew Stafford restructures his deal, the Lions will have in the neighborhood of $20 million in cap space. If he doesn’t, they currently sit about $8 million below the cap. So that makes the Lions free agent targets dramatically different depending on the scenario. Instead of listing individual players I believe the Lions should target, here's a list of all the positions and what types of players the Lions should target along with their unsigned players at those positions and whether they should re-sign them.

Quarterback, no free agents: The Lions will add a fourth quarterback to the roster at some point, but they will either compete with Kellen Moore or be an extra arm in training camp.

Running Back, Kevin Smith and Stefan Logan (unrestricted): The Lions should not re-sign either player. Logan has been awful the last two years and Smith just doesn’t fit what the Lions need at the position. There are fans that want to see Reggie Bush in Detroit, but the best route for the Lions would be to add a young, fast back in mid rounds of the draft. If they do go the free agent route, a mid-tier speed back/kick returner like LaRod Stephens-Howling. The Lions have invested heavily in running backs, using first, second and third round picks on backs in the last five years, but their most productive back has been undrafted Joique Bell. The Lions need to find a bargain back rather than investing a lot of money or high draft picks.

Receiver, no free agents: The Lions still need assistance in the receiving corps. They have Calvin Johnson, Nate Burleson, Ryan Broyles and Mike Thomas back from last year, but need to add some speed and fall back plans in case Burleson or Broyles don’t recover fast enough. Again, this is a position the Lions have heavily invested in over the years and have had mixed success. I think the best route is to sign a mid-level speed guy like a Donnie Avery or Brandon Gibson and then draft somebody in the middle rounds. The Lions' best bet for amping up the pass game is to build up the offensive line and running game to open things up for Stafford rather than invest more money and picks here. Great quarterbacks make receivers better, when they have time to throw and don’t have to throw 50 times a game.

Tight End, Will Heller (unrestricted): The Lions should bring back Heller, who has been an excellent blocker, occasional receiving threat and special teamer. They should also bring in an undrafted rookie or two to compete and groom as Heller is getting up there in age.

Offensive Line, Gosder Cherilus, Dylan Gandy (unrestricted), Jason Fox (restricted): The Lions should be overhauling the line to an extent. Cherilus’ knee scares me, and they can better use the money they would need to retain him. There are a lot of right tackles available in free agency, which should drive the contract demands down. If the Lions can get a bargain deal with a Sebastian Vollmer or Sam Baker that would be ideal, but not likely.

The best course of action will be resign Fox and have him compete with the recently-re-signed Corey Hilliard at right tackle. Riley Rieff would then over for Peterman at left guard. Bill Nagy will compete with Raiola at center and will backup Reiff and Rob Sims at guard. Jeff Backus will be back and he will be backed up by Reiff and the Lions will be adding at least one other lineman in the draft.

If the Lions re-sign Cliff Avril and one of the top lineman are there at the fifth pick, the Lions should draft the lineman and either move Backus to the bench or cut him. A great offensive line can cover up average skill position players and protect the huge investment in Matthew Stafford. The New Orleans Saints have a bunch of third-round picks or lower at receiver and tight end and have a lethal passing game and they have taken Pierre Thomas, Chris Ivory and Darren Sproles and turned them into big producers because they have one of the best lines in the league. That is the model the Lions should follow rather than trying to land elite skill position players.

Defensive Line, Avril, Corey Williams, Lawrence Jackson, Andre Fluellen and Sammie Lee Hill (unrestricted), Willie Young (unrestricted): The Lions have a lot of work to do here. The defense is built around the defensive line, which is the best way to do it, except when six out of nine players on the line are free agents. The Lions need to bring back Jackson and Young at defensive end and Williams has indicated he’d take a pay cut to stay in Detroit. Hill would be great to have back, but he is highly regarded in league circles and could get offered a starting job. If Hill leaves, Fluellen could be a good option.

Avril and the Lions have different views on his worth and the biggest factor in determining who is right will be interested teams in free agency. The Lions value Avril at $10 million a year, if anybody offers more than that, he is gone. If Stafford doesn’t sign an extension in the next six days, Avril is gone. I like Avril but he is a one dimensional defensive end. He can rush the passer, but he is a liability against the run and has had long stretches of games where he has disappeared.

There are some interesting names in free agency like Michael Bennett, William Hayes, Osi Umenyiora, Wallace Gilberry and some interesting under the radar guys like Matt Shaughnessy and Turk McBride, who had a great season when he was with the Lions two years ago, but fell off dramatically in New Orleans.

The Lions would be best served resigning Avril for the right price. He reminds me of Kabeer Gbaja-Biamila of the Packers several years back. He was an elite pass rusher for them, but then he signed a huge offer sheet with the Eagles. The Packers matched and, because of how much money he was making, had to use him as an every down lineman. He was terrible against the run and wore down, which limited his effectiveness on third downs. You can’t pay premier money for non-premier players, so as hard as it may be to replace Avril, it’s better than overpaying for something he’s not.

Linebacker, DeAndre Levy and Justin Durant (unrestricted): The Lions should re-sign one or the other, but not both. Durant is the more consistent player and better against the run, but he can’t seem to even force a turnover by accident. Levy is more inconsistent, but has the higher upside and has flashed playmaking ability in the past. The Lions have three young linebackers that they are very high on -- Travis Lewis, Tahir Whitehead and Ashlee Palmer -- so I think the Lions should be fine as far as depth is concerned.

The Lions need to add a playmaker in the linebacking corps, but there isn’t much in free agency so I’d take a flyer on a high upside linebacker in the middle-to-late rounds of the draft.

Defensive Back, Louis Delmas, Jacob Lacey, Chris Houston, Drayton Florence, Pat Lee (unrestricted), Amari Spievey (restricted): The Lions have some work to do in the secondary, but my approach probably won’t line up with most fans' wishes. The Lions should re-sign Delmas and Lacey for sure and see what the market bears for Houston. There are a lot of cornerbacks on the market, which should either help keep Houston’s price down or ease the burden of replacing him.

Fans want the Lions to add either an expensive free agent or high draft pick to the cornerback group, but that isn’t the route I’d take. Corners get injured a lot and there are very few that are difference makers. If you look at the eight teams that made the NFC and AFC championship games the last two years (San Francisco, New York and Atlanta in the NFC and New England and Baltimore in the AFC), you’ll find that not a single one of them has an elite cornerback. Atlanta spent the most out of all those teams on cornerbacks and they had the worst pass defense of the five teams. They paid big money to Dunta Robinson, who never made an impact, they franchised Brent Grimes, who got hurt, and they traded for Asante Samuel, who gives up two big plays for each one he makes. The best corner among those teams is Carlos Rogers, considered a disappointment until he joined the 49ers and their excellent front seven.

The Lions should re-sign Houston if the price is right, otherwise add a mid-level free agent to pair with Lacey and the three corners they drafted last year and pick another corner in the draft. The best pass defenses in the NFL don’t have the best secondaries, they have the best pass rush. So the Lions will be better served by committing their resources to the defensive line and hope they strike gold with one of the three corners drafted last year.

As far as safeties are concerned, the Lions should add a starter in a deep free agency crop and draft one in the second or third round of the draft. Delmas is an elite safety when healthy, but the Lions need to plan on him not being healthy so adding a veteran and a rookie will give them options if he can’t stay on the field.

Specialists, Jason Hanson, Nick Harris and Kasim Osgood (unrestricted): Hanson will most likely be back and Nick Harris should never be allowed back. The Lions signed punter Blake Clingan Tuesday, so he will compete with another veteran for the job. If Hanson retires, the Lions should just add a free agent or undrafted rookie rather than committing a draft pick to a kicker (unless they manage to trade down a few times and acquire a few more picks). Osgood is a great special teamer, but can’t provide anything else. I’d sign him to a one-year deal and then if somebody shines in training camp that can offer more than him, they can go with the more versatile player.

My plan won’t get the Lions talked about as “offseason winners,” but it puts the emphasis on building in the trenches and giving younger players a chance to sink or swim. Fans want to fire Mayhew, but we haven’t seen how some of the young players like Fox, Young, Whitehead, Ronnell and Travis Lewis, Chris Greenwood, Bill Bentley and Broyles can do. If a few of those guys pan out, then Mayhew has done a good job. If none of them can contribute, then Mayhew failed in a number of drafts and the Lions can move on. The flat cap era is going to heavily penalize teams that swing and miss on splashy free agents more than ever, so the best method is to add mid-level guys to supplement your draft picks. The Lions have a lot of premier talent on the team with Stafford, Johnson, Ndamukong Suh, Nick Fairley and Stephen Tulloch. They need to minimize their weakest link and add another playmaker or two to get back on track.
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March 6th, 2013, 11:03 pm
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Post Re: Off-Season Moves
thelomasbrowns wrote:
Levy signed to multi-year deal.



Should have used the money to re-up Sammy Lee Hill, think that would be a better investment.


March 7th, 2013, 10:10 am
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Post Re: Off-Season Moves
liontrax wrote:
thelomasbrowns wrote:
Levy signed to multi-year deal.


Should have used the money to re-up Sammy Lee Hill, think that would be a better investment.


Hill's agent said he's eager to test free agency. He can be a starter and earn starter money--which we can't justify paying him. I wish him all the best, but I don't think it's gonna happen with two first round DTs on the roster.

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March 7th, 2013, 10:22 am
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Post Re: Off-Season Moves
thelomasbrowns wrote:
liontrax wrote:
thelomasbrowns wrote:
Levy signed to multi-year deal.


Should have used the money to re-up Sammy Lee Hill, think that would be a better investment.


Hill's agent said he's eager to test free agency. He can be a starter and earn starter money--which we can't justify paying him. I wish him all the best, but I don't think it's gonna happen with two first round DTs on the roster.


I agree, Hill isn't coming back. It's been said in many different articles when talking about the Lions free agents that Hill is highly regarded in coaching circles and it will be surprising if someone doesn't make him into their starter.


March 7th, 2013, 11:26 am
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Post Re: Off-Season Moves
That sucks, he's going to be a huge loss. As an unproven player I was hoping we could re-sign him for $1.5-2.5 million per year. Doesn't sound like that's the case... The only real late round "steal" that we've gotten, and looks like we're going to lose him to FA.

Good thing we drafted Fairly... What a "steal" that was...


March 7th, 2013, 11:41 am
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Post Re: Off-Season Moves
wjb21ndtown wrote:
That sucks, he's going to be a huge loss. As an unproven player I was hoping we could re-sign him for $1.5-2.5 million per year. Doesn't sound like that's the case... The only real late round "steal" that we've gotten, and looks like we're going to lose him to FA.

Good thing we drafted Fairly... What a "steal" that was...


I'm sure your just being snarky about Fairley, but he actually has been great for a DT this season. He was tied with two others for 5th in sacks for DTs and according to yahoo sports was tied with Suh for the most stuffs by DTs at 8. Both Fairley and Suh play like under tackles because of the wide9, so those are really the only two stats to look at for them and for only $2.5M I think the Lions got great production from Fairley.


March 7th, 2013, 12:35 pm
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Post Re: Off-Season Moves
rao wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
That sucks, he's going to be a huge loss. As an unproven player I was hoping we could re-sign him for $1.5-2.5 million per year. Doesn't sound like that's the case... The only real late round "steal" that we've gotten, and looks like we're going to lose him to FA.

Good thing we drafted Fairly... What a "steal" that was...


I'm sure your just being snarky about Fairley, but he actually has been great for a DT this season. He was tied with two others for 5th in sacks for DTs and according to yahoo sports was tied with Suh for the most stuffs by DTs at 8. Both Fairley and Suh play like under tackles because of the wide9, so those are really the only two stats to look at for them and for only $2.5M I think the Lions got great production from Fairley.


My point is, it's hard to argue that we got good "value" out of the pick, when the pick cost us the only player that we "developed" into a starter on our roster. Mayhew was with DTs no different than Millen was with WRs.

Add to that Fairly's injuries, drug charge, and suspensions, and it's tough to call his pick a "steal."


March 7th, 2013, 12:44 pm
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Post Re: Off-Season Moves
wjb21ndtown wrote:
That sucks, he's going to be a huge loss. As an unproven player I was hoping we could re-sign him for $1.5-2.5 million per year. Doesn't sound like that's the case... The only real late round "steal" that we've gotten, and looks like we're going to lose him to FA.

Good thing we drafted Fairly... What a "steal" that was...



whats the hate on Fairly? His injury concerns aside he's playing very well...

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March 7th, 2013, 1:12 pm
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Post Re: Off-Season Moves
wjb21ndtown wrote:
rao wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
That sucks, he's going to be a huge loss. As an unproven player I was hoping we could re-sign him for $1.5-2.5 million per year. Doesn't sound like that's the case... The only real late round "steal" that we've gotten, and looks like we're going to lose him to FA.

Good thing we drafted Fairly... What a "steal" that was...


I'm sure your just being snarky about Fairley, but he actually has been great for a DT this season. He was tied with two others for 5th in sacks for DTs and according to yahoo sports was tied with Suh for the most stuffs by DTs at 8. Both Fairley and Suh play like under tackles because of the wide9, so those are really the only two stats to look at for them and for only $2.5M I think the Lions got great production from Fairley.


My point is, it's hard to argue that we got good "value" out of the pick, when the pick cost us the only player that we "developed" into a starter on our roster. Mayhew was with DTs no different than Millen was with WRs.

Add to that Fairly's injuries, drug charge, and suspensions, and it's tough to call his pick a "steal."


I wouldn't call it a steal either, but it was the right value for the place they got him. Fairley is more disruptive and a better fit for the defense the Lions run, it makes perfect sense for them to take him even if that means they loose their promising 4th rd pick in the future. If you really want to blame someone for Hill leaving(not that it's a guarantee, the media has been wrong about a players value before) you should blame Suh. It's Suh's $18M cap number that makes it hard for them to sign a young starting quality 3rd DT.


March 7th, 2013, 1:28 pm
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Post Re: Off-Season Moves
regularjoe12 wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
That sucks, he's going to be a huge loss. As an unproven player I was hoping we could re-sign him for $1.5-2.5 million per year. Doesn't sound like that's the case... The only real late round "steal" that we've gotten, and looks like we're going to lose him to FA.

Good thing we drafted Fairly... What a "steal" that was...



whats the hate on Fairly? His injury concerns aside he's playing very well...


This is the most ridiculous bullsh!t that "FANS" need to get out of their head. Just because you call someone "not a value" or say that someone isn't worth their paycheck (Avril and Nate) it doesn't mean that you're "hating" on them.


March 7th, 2013, 2:26 pm
Post Re: Off-Season Moves
rao wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
rao wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
That sucks, he's going to be a huge loss. As an unproven player I was hoping we could re-sign him for $1.5-2.5 million per year. Doesn't sound like that's the case... The only real late round "steal" that we've gotten, and looks like we're going to lose him to FA.

Good thing we drafted Fairly... What a "steal" that was...


I'm sure your just being snarky about Fairley, but he actually has been great for a DT this season. He was tied with two others for 5th in sacks for DTs and according to yahoo sports was tied with Suh for the most stuffs by DTs at 8. Both Fairley and Suh play like under tackles because of the wide9, so those are really the only two stats to look at for them and for only $2.5M I think the Lions got great production from Fairley.


My point is, it's hard to argue that we got good "value" out of the pick, when the pick cost us the only player that we "developed" into a starter on our roster. Mayhew was with DTs no different than Millen was with WRs.

Add to that Fairly's injuries, drug charge, and suspensions, and it's tough to call his pick a "steal."


I wouldn't call it a steal either, but it was the right value for the place they got him. Fairley is more disruptive and a better fit for the defense the Lions run, it makes perfect sense for them to take him even if that means they loose their promising 4th rd pick in the future. If you really want to blame someone for Hill leaving(not that it's a guarantee, the media has been wrong about a players value before) you should blame Suh. It's Suh's $18M cap number that makes it hard for them to sign a young starting quality 3rd DT.


My point is... SLH & Suh with Houston and Prince Akumura > Fairley & Suh (for one more season, most likely) and Houston & ???? whatever garbage we put next to him since drafting Fairley in 2011.

That's the point. This team would have been better off with a CB over the DT. We had two starting caliber DTs (Suh and Williams) on the roster (lets not forget that Fairley missed a good part of his rookie season due to injury and suspension), and a potential, young, cheap starter waiting in the wings.

SLH could have been signed or extended for $2.5-3.5 per at a 3-5 year deal, and it would have made Suh's K more palatable. If we were paying our DTs a COMBINED $15-18 million it makes a heck of a lot more sense to keep him around. That's not going to be the case with with Suh and Fairley. Essentially, the Fairley pick sealed Suh's fate and SLH's fate... That draft pick cost us two starting caliber DTs. It was a stupid, HORRIBLE draft pick given SLHs status, the fact that we had C Williams, and what it's going to cost us. We could have had Price Akumura back there for the last two years playing #2 CB next to Houston, and an immediate upgrade at CB. Instead we have this BS "great" DT rotation that's falling apart.

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March 7th, 2013, 2:33 pm
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Post Re: Off-Season Moves
wjb21ndtown wrote:
regularjoe12 wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
That sucks, he's going to be a huge loss. As an unproven player I was hoping we could re-sign him for $1.5-2.5 million per year. Doesn't sound like that's the case... The only real late round "steal" that we've gotten, and looks like we're going to lose him to FA.

Good thing we drafted Fairly... What a "steal" that was...



whats the hate on Fairly? His injury concerns aside he's playing very well...


This is the most ridiculous bullsh!t that "FANS" need to get out of their head. Just because you call someone "not a value" or say that someone isn't worth their paycheck (Avril and Nate) it doesn't mean that you're "hating" on them.



My bad....I can't believe i misunderstood you.

Obviously

"Good thing we drafted Fairly... What a "steal" that was..."

was a compliment....duh!

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March 7th, 2013, 2:34 pm
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Post Re: Off-Season Moves
regularjoe12 wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
regularjoe12 wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
That sucks, he's going to be a huge loss. As an unproven player I was hoping we could re-sign him for $1.5-2.5 million per year. Doesn't sound like that's the case... The only real late round "steal" that we've gotten, and looks like we're going to lose him to FA.

Good thing we drafted Fairly... What a "steal" that was...



whats the hate on Fairly? His injury concerns aside he's playing very well...


This is the most ridiculous bullsh!t that "FANS" need to get out of their head. Just because you call someone "not a value" or say that someone isn't worth their paycheck (Avril and Nate) it doesn't mean that you're "hating" on them.



My bad....I can't believe i misunderstood you.

Obviously

"Good thing we drafted Fairly... What a "steal" that was..."

was a compliment....duh!


Saying he was a bad pick (and he was) isn't "hating" the guy. I didn't say "Fairley sucks" "Fairley is a bad player" "Fairley is a fat sack of shat" none of that. It is no insult to a man to say that he was a poor management decision, when he was. I'm not insulting his play, I'm insulting Mayhew's decision to draft him.


March 7th, 2013, 2:47 pm
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