I don't understand why Stockar isn't an RG. He is a liability as a RT in pass protection, and because his run blocking is so good, he could be a great RG.

If we can retain him, and move him to RG, we could have an offensive line that isn't terrible.

Backus, Baas (RD 2), Woody, McDougle, Butler

Do you think he would accept the move? I have this feeling he's gonig to be asking for a lot of money and at this point I don't think he's worth it, but if he were to accept a move to RG it might not be that bad. And I agree, I think we should move Woody back to C (isn't that his natural position???)

Yes, Woody's natural position is Center, that's what he played in college and in New England.

I just have a feeling that management will rather re-sign Raiola than McDougle because he is cheaper.

If Stockar asks for a lot of money after the injuries and average to below average seasons, he's off his rocker. I just don't think that anyone will exactly be beating the door down to get him, but we'll see.

Although I am intrigued by Brian's suggestion to move Stockard Channing to guard, I would probably let him walk.

Throughout his career, he has been a disappointment. But the thing about him that bothers me the most is that he ends most games with a clean uniform, except for the seat of his pants.

Woody played center in college and with the Pats some. When the Pats went shotgun Mike Compton did the snapping but when Brady was under center Woody snaped.

Yeah, I remember reading that Woody isn't a shotgun center, but Detroit doesn't run the shotgun at all, unless it's hail mary time.

There are more quality guards than centers IMO. If we can fill that center position with either Raiola re-signed or moving Woody to center, it should be easier to find a LG through FA such as Marco Rivera of GB or Joe Andruzzi of NE.

I think we are very average on the line, BUT if Joey "no Game" can get passing game and play action game and have balanced attack with KJ, they will be alright. I like Butler. Offensive lines must gell together, I don't think you can replace more then 1 this year and expect them to gell until mid-season and none of us want to see anything worse then 5-3 at mid season next year.

I think the O line is one of the worst in the NFL. I think that should be #1 concern for Millen and CO.


Brian, I agree I think he would be a better center than guard. I think the center we have know is awful.

Joey is a pretty tall qb at 6-4. He had no problem throwing over guards Loverne and Woody, both in at 6-3. Raiola was also no problem at 6-1.

In the NFL you tend to find tall tackles and shorter guards/centers. That's because the guards and centers tend to be in the passing lanes (if the QB is in the pocket).

McDougle is 6-6, most teams would prefer to stay away from a guard that tall. Butler is even taller, at 6-7. (BTW - Backus is listed at 6-5).

Now, I've heard a lot of folks complain about all of Joey's passes that get knocked down at the line of scrimmage. Imagine that even worse with a tall guard blocking the passing lanes (not to mention the vision blocks).

This isn't a rule of thumb necessarily, you will find some taller guards in the league. It does factor into a coaches thinking though.

As far as moving Woody to center, that all depends on what happens in FA/draft. It's nice to have the flexibilty though.

Remember Stocker is not a Millen guy. No reason to believe Stocker is not going to be swept out the door in favor of Millen guy.

Actually Stocker's run blocking was supar this year. Besides he's been injury prone and very inconsistant. The O-Line overall this never got any push upfront when they really needed it. An overhaul is needed and spending money elsewhere is needed.

with stockyard out do you look to get Barron at a cost maybe switch firsts and give up a later pick to make it happen...hope he makes it to the 10th pick...or not bother with him?

Barron will most likely be avaliable at the 10th pick.

I don't want to insult anyone, but I think that I top draft pick for an oliner is a huge mistake. look at our oline picks. Gibson, Stockar, and Backus, none of them worth the spot we picked them at. And when we started picking them, we didn't get a good influx of young speedy weapons. We have the speedy weapons now, but need more defensive talent at safety and end. We need to pick up a packer or two and draft defense.

2nd round is not too much better...*cough* Juan *cough*