View unanswered posts | View active topics It is currently August 28th, 2014, 1:08 am



Reply to topic  [ 48 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 Brandon Lloyd as a #2 Lion Wr 
Author Message
Color Commentator - John Madden
User avatar

Joined: February 12th, 2006, 4:20 pm
Posts: 1861
Location: Des Moines, IA
Post Re: Brandon Lloyd as a #2 Lion Wr
WJB wrote:
CJ doesn't put out double the production of Jennings, period.


actually...........

Last year CJ had 1,964yrds and 5tds to Jennings 366yrds and 4tds which is much more than double the yards. Of course Jennings was injured. In 2011 CJ had 1681yrds and 16tds to Jennings 949yrds and 9tds. Not quite double.

_________________
Image


March 18th, 2013, 10:23 pm
Profile
Div 1 - Starter

Joined: December 13th, 2005, 2:09 pm
Posts: 527
Post Re: Brandon Lloyd as a #2 Lion Wr
wjb21ndtown wrote:
JL wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
rao wrote:
Does anyone think the Vikings didn't overpay?

IMO that's the better question to ask. I like Jennings, but a good portion of his production could be the system in GB and he's also 29 yrs old.

At least for the Vikings it takes pressure off them to find a WR in the draft. They should still draft one somewhere in the draft, but it doesn't need to be in the early rounds now.


$3M less than what Harvin was making for a more traditional #1... We're paying CJ $18 million, how can you say they're paying Jennings too much at $9M? As long as he can stay healthy, it's a great signing for Minny.

I'd say he's a $11-15M Wr, with a discount for injury.


This is why you're not an NFL Agent.

Jennings is overpaid. He's 6 years older than Harvin, not as fast, and injury-prone.

Jennings was able to play outside, in the slot, and do a lot of things for the Packers, but he has always had a top-notch QB to throw him the ball, and he has NEVER been the obvious #1 choice for receiver on the Packers. He always had a slew of good receivers on the field with him, from Donald Driver to Randall Cobb. So he's going from One Of Many to, The Man. Not every player adapts well to that, not to mention that in Minnesota he'll be the constant target of double teams and/or a shaded safety.

Jennings lucked into a fat deal after Mike Wallace signed with the Dolphins, as the Vikings needed a WR that actually had some experience in the NFL, and Jennings was the only one left with a pedigree that fans could agree was a true possibility as a #1 WR.

The fact that you compared CJ and Jennings in the same sentence should get you punted from the forum for a month, in my opinion.



Are you stupid, or did you have a laps of judgment?

I didn't "compare" CJ and Jennings, I pointed out that CJ makes DOUBLE what Jennings is getting paid.

CJ doesn't put out double the production of Jennings, period.


You're the stupid one, and no I didn't have a LAPSE in judgement. CJ doesn't put out double what Jennings does, nor does CJ have any of the quality receivers around him that Jennings does. All he did was set a record for yardage in a season, when every team in the NFL knew that CJ was the primary target on most every passing play, with no real threat of a running game to pull a safety into the box. Surround CJ with the same talent level and think of what would happen.

Then you can watch game film and see two and three defenders bracketing CJ and he still makes the catches. Jennings has NEVER had to deal with that on a consistent basis, and now he's the #1 receiver for the Vikings, with a QB that is in no way comparable to Rodgers or Stafford. He didn't deserve half of what CJ makes, because he's not half the receiver CJ is. He got an overpriced deal because he was the best thing left on the market.

That you consider Jennings worth it is idiotic.

_________________
If God isn't a Lions fan, then why is the sky Honolulu Blue?


March 18th, 2013, 10:32 pm
Profile
Post Re: Brandon Lloyd as a #2 Lion Wr
JL wrote:
You're the stupid one, and no I didn't have a LAPSE in judgement. CJ doesn't put out double what Jennings does, nor does CJ have any of the quality receivers around him that Jennings does. All he did was set a record for yardage in a season, when every team in the NFL knew that CJ was the primary target on most every passing play, with no real threat of a running game to pull a safety into the box. Surround CJ with the same talent level and think of what would happen.

Then you can watch game film and see two and three defenders bracketing CJ and he still makes the catches. Jennings has NEVER had to deal with that on a consistent basis, and now he's the #1 receiver for the Vikings, with a QB that is in no way comparable to Rodgers or Stafford. He didn't deserve half of what CJ makes, because he's not half the receiver CJ is. He got an overpriced deal because he was the best thing left on the market.

That you consider Jennings worth it is idiotic.


You're a moron for suggesting I compared the two players. I did not.

Show me another WR that is still in the prime of his career, and a true #1 that has accrued 5 straight 900 yard seasons, and has put up double digit TD's that makes under $9M.


March 19th, 2013, 12:02 pm
ST Coordinator – Danny Crossman
User avatar

Joined: March 30th, 2006, 12:48 am
Posts: 3750
Location: Davison Mi
Post Re: Brandon Lloyd as a #2 Lion Wr
gentlemen! play nice.


neither one of you look very smart playing the "Nu-Uh you're stupid" game.


we're all on the same team here guys. just cuz we disagree does not mean someone lacks intelligence.

_________________
2013 Lionbacker Fantasy Football Champion


Last edited by regularjoe12 on March 19th, 2013, 12:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.



March 19th, 2013, 12:29 pm
Profile
NFL Veteran

Joined: November 28th, 2007, 12:50 pm
Posts: 1349
Location: Newport Beach, Ca
Post Re: Brandon Lloyd as a #2 Lion Wr
Marques Colston makes $7M/yr


March 19th, 2013, 12:31 pm
Profile
Post Re: Brandon Lloyd as a #2 Lion Wr
regularjoe12 wrote:
gentlemen! play nice.


neither one of you look very smart playing the "Nu-Uh you're stupid" game.


we're all on the same team here guys. just cuz we disagree does not mean someone lacks intelligence.


No problem... You know I'll play the phuck you, no phuck you game... I take it where whomever else wants to take it to. I have no problem with bringing the conversation back out of the gutter, even if the guy is a classless douche bag.


March 19th, 2013, 12:38 pm
ST Coordinator – Danny Crossman
User avatar

Joined: March 30th, 2006, 12:48 am
Posts: 3750
Location: Davison Mi
Post Re: Brandon Lloyd as a #2 Lion Wr
wjb21ndtown wrote:
regularjoe12 wrote:
gentlemen! play nice.


neither one of you look very smart playing the "Nu-Uh you're stupid" game.


we're all on the same team here guys. just cuz we disagree does not mean someone lacks intelligence.


No problem... You know I'll play the phuck you, no phuck you game... I take it where whomever else wants to take it to. I have no problem with bringing the conversation back out of the gutter, even if the guy is a classless douche bag.


lmao....way to take the.....um....higherish road.

_________________
2013 Lionbacker Fantasy Football Champion


March 19th, 2013, 12:39 pm
Profile
Post Re: Brandon Lloyd as a #2 Lion Wr
rao wrote:
Marques Colston makes $7M/yr


Look at his deal:

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/new-orleans- ... s-colston/

Colston has $14 million in dead money this year.... I'd hardly call that "$7 M"... His deal actually averages closer to $13-15M.


March 19th, 2013, 12:40 pm
Post Re: Brandon Lloyd as a #2 Lion Wr
regularjoe12 wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
regularjoe12 wrote:
gentlemen! play nice.


neither one of you look very smart playing the "Nu-Uh you're stupid" game.


we're all on the same team here guys. just cuz we disagree does not mean someone lacks intelligence.


No problem... You know I'll play the phuck you, no phuck you game... I take it where whomever else wants to take it to. I have no problem with bringing the conversation back out of the gutter, even if the guy is a classless douche bag.


lmao....way to take the.....um....higherish road.


:wink:


March 19th, 2013, 12:40 pm
NFL Veteran

Joined: November 28th, 2007, 12:50 pm
Posts: 1349
Location: Newport Beach, Ca
Post Re: Brandon Lloyd as a #2 Lion Wr
wjb21ndtown wrote:
rao wrote:
Marques Colston makes $7M/yr


Look at his deal:

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/new-orleans- ... s-colston/

Colston has $14 million in dead money this year.... I'd hardly call that "$7 M"... His deal actually averages closer to $13-15M.


How does his deal average $13M-15M? He's making $36M over 5 yrs.

You don't factor in a players dead money, it's only relevant if they cut or trade him.


March 19th, 2013, 12:53 pm
Profile
Post Re: Brandon Lloyd as a #2 Lion Wr
rao wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
rao wrote:
Marques Colston makes $7M/yr


Look at his deal:

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/new-orleans- ... s-colston/

Colston has $14 million in dead money this year.... I'd hardly call that "$7 M"... His deal actually averages closer to $13-15M.


How does his deal average $13M-15M? He's making $36M over 5 yrs.

You don't factor in a players dead money, it's only relevant if they cut or trade him.


My fault, I thought they were considering "dead money" prior restructured SB money, but I see what they did. The $17.7 million guaranteed wasn't adding up, given his $10M SB, but he has a ton of roster and workout bonuses, and his 2012 and 2013 salary is guaranteed as well.

Still, I don't think you can say Jennings is overpaid when you look at guys like Garcon, Rice, Wayne, Jackson. Especially when you consider that newer WR contracts like Mike Wallace, Vincent Jackson, Dwayne Bowe,and Harvin are all $11-12M.


March 19th, 2013, 1:10 pm
NFL Veteran

Joined: November 28th, 2007, 12:50 pm
Posts: 1349
Location: Newport Beach, Ca
Post Re: Brandon Lloyd as a #2 Lion Wr
wjb21ndtown wrote:
rao wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
rao wrote:
Marques Colston makes $7M/yr


Look at his deal:

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/new-orleans- ... s-colston/

Colston has $14 million in dead money this year.... I'd hardly call that "$7 M"... His deal actually averages closer to $13-15M.


How does his deal average $13M-15M? He's making $36M over 5 yrs.

You don't factor in a players dead money, it's only relevant if they cut or trade him.


My fault, I thought they were considering "dead money" prior restructured SB money, but I see what they did. The $17.7 million guaranteed wasn't adding up, given his $10M SB, but he has a ton of roster and workout bonuses, and his 2012 and 2013 salary is guaranteed as well.

Still, I don't think you can say Jennings is overpaid when you look at guys like Garcon, Rice, Wayne, Jackson. Especially when you consider that newer WR contracts like Mike Wallace, Vincent Jackson, Dwayne Bowe,and Harvin are all $11-12M.


I mentioned earlier I think Jennings is only slightly overpaid and it has a lot to do with his past production, so it's reasonable. I think he is a bad fit with the rest of the current personnel on the Vikings and that's my main complaint with them paying him $9M. He's going to be 30 in Sept and his main attribute is his speed, his game is going to slow a bit and I don't think he has the size to play WR1 if he starts to lose a step. If the Vikings draft or sign a WR2 that can demand some respect from the defense I'll shut up, but right now I don't think it's a great signing and Jennings may have a hard time producing to the level of his contract.

Out of the new contracts this year, that Bowe deal is way out of sync. The guy is good, but each of the other 3 guys add something special while Bowe has been pretty average for a WR1 over his career. It could have been his poor QB play, so I could be wrong, but he just does not stand out to me.


March 19th, 2013, 5:14 pm
Profile
Post Re: Brandon Lloyd as a #2 Lion Wr
rao wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
rao wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
rao wrote:
Marques Colston makes $7M/yr


Look at his deal:

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/new-orleans- ... s-colston/

Colston has $14 million in dead money this year.... I'd hardly call that "$7 M"... His deal actually averages closer to $13-15M.


How does his deal average $13M-15M? He's making $36M over 5 yrs.

You don't factor in a players dead money, it's only relevant if they cut or trade him.


My fault, I thought they were considering "dead money" prior restructured SB money, but I see what they did. The $17.7 million guaranteed wasn't adding up, given his $10M SB, but he has a ton of roster and workout bonuses, and his 2012 and 2013 salary is guaranteed as well.

Still, I don't think you can say Jennings is overpaid when you look at guys like Garcon, Rice, Wayne, Jackson. Especially when you consider that newer WR contracts like Mike Wallace, Vincent Jackson, Dwayne Bowe,and Harvin are all $11-12M.


I mentioned earlier I think Jennings is only slightly overpaid and it has a lot to do with his past production, so it's reasonable. I think he is a bad fit with the rest of the current personnel on the Vikings and that's my main complaint with them paying him $9M. He's going to be 30 in Sept and his main attribute is his speed, his game is going to slow a bit and I don't think he has the size to play WR1 if he starts to lose a step. If the Vikings draft or sign a WR2 that can demand some respect from the defense I'll shut up, but right now I don't think it's a great signing and Jennings may have a hard time producing to the level of his contract.

Out of the new contracts this year, that Bowe deal is way out of sync. The guy is good, but each of the other 3 guys add something special while Bowe has been pretty average for a WR1 over his career. It could have been his poor QB play, so I could be wrong, but he just does not stand out to me.


I understand what you're saying, but IMO you can't discount what AP means to that team. I think Jennings will be fine in Minny. I don't think he's going to be a world beater, but I think 900-1200 yards, and 7-9 TDs isn't out of the question, and I do think it's going to be poor Qb play more than anything that holds Jennings back. Remember, most WRs generally take a year to learn the system and get on the same page as the Qb, and Minny's Qb situation is whack. If they ever get a Qb they're going to be sick though. But Jennings will get his options and that offense will get it's shot. They're a defensive minded team, and their stout D is going to give that O every opportunity to succeed.

Not that it was your point, but I do think it's funny that people will point out that Jennings "benefitted" from all of this other talent around him, yet say that CJ wouldn't benefit from a true #2 instead of Burleson.


March 19th, 2013, 5:21 pm
NFL Veteran

Joined: November 28th, 2007, 12:50 pm
Posts: 1349
Location: Newport Beach, Ca
Post Re: Brandon Lloyd as a #2 Lion Wr
wjb21ndtown wrote:
rao wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
rao wrote:
wjb21ndtown wrote:
rao wrote:
Marques Colston makes $7M/yr


Look at his deal:

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/new-orleans- ... s-colston/

Colston has $14 million in dead money this year.... I'd hardly call that "$7 M"... His deal actually averages closer to $13-15M.


How does his deal average $13M-15M? He's making $36M over 5 yrs.

You don't factor in a players dead money, it's only relevant if they cut or trade him.


My fault, I thought they were considering "dead money" prior restructured SB money, but I see what they did. The $17.7 million guaranteed wasn't adding up, given his $10M SB, but he has a ton of roster and workout bonuses, and his 2012 and 2013 salary is guaranteed as well.

Still, I don't think you can say Jennings is overpaid when you look at guys like Garcon, Rice, Wayne, Jackson. Especially when you consider that newer WR contracts like Mike Wallace, Vincent Jackson, Dwayne Bowe,and Harvin are all $11-12M.


I mentioned earlier I think Jennings is only slightly overpaid and it has a lot to do with his past production, so it's reasonable. I think he is a bad fit with the rest of the current personnel on the Vikings and that's my main complaint with them paying him $9M. He's going to be 30 in Sept and his main attribute is his speed, his game is going to slow a bit and I don't think he has the size to play WR1 if he starts to lose a step. If the Vikings draft or sign a WR2 that can demand some respect from the defense I'll shut up, but right now I don't think it's a great signing and Jennings may have a hard time producing to the level of his contract.

Out of the new contracts this year, that Bowe deal is way out of sync. The guy is good, but each of the other 3 guys add something special while Bowe has been pretty average for a WR1 over his career. It could have been his poor QB play, so I could be wrong, but he just does not stand out to me.


I understand what you're saying, but IMO you can't discount what AP means to that team. I think Jennings will be fine in Minny. I don't think he's going to be a world beater, but I think 900-1200 yards, and 7-9 TDs isn't out of the question, and I do think it's going to be poor Qb play more than anything that holds Jennings back. Remember, most WRs generally take a year to learn the system and get on the same page as the Qb, and Minny's Qb situation is whack. If they ever get a Qb they're going to be sick though. But Jennings will get his options and that offense will get it's shot. They're a defensive minded team, and their stout D is going to give that O every opportunity to succeed.

Not that it was your point, but I do think it's funny that people will point out that Jennings "benefitted" from all of this other talent around him, yet say that CJ wouldn't benefit from a true #2 instead of Burleson.


Your right, I'm probably not giving AP enough credit, but I still think their offense needs the bigger receivers to be really successful. Ponder seems like an athletic game manager to me and I don't see Jennings getting enough opportunities to reach more than around 900 yards even if he's the primary catcher. I also see his TD numbers being low because he won't be the primary guy in the red zone. He's going to have to get his numbers from more big plays, but he won't have a QB that can do that for him.

Preaching to the choir on the benefits of a WR2. I'm already a believer. :D


March 19th, 2013, 6:25 pm
Profile
Post Re: Brandon Lloyd as a #2 Lion Wr
rao wrote:
Your right, I'm probably not giving AP enough credit, but I still think their offense needs the bigger receivers to be really successful. Ponder seems like an athletic game manager to me and I don't see Jennings getting enough opportunities to reach more than around 900 yards even if he's the primary catcher. I also see his TD numbers being low because he won't be the primary guy in the red zone. He's going to have to get his numbers from more big plays, but he won't have a QB that can do that for him.

Preaching to the choir on the benefits of a WR2. I'm already a believer. :D


Harvin missed the last 7 games of the season, and Minny went 5-2 without him... I think Minny will be fine with Jennings, if he can stay healthy... :idea: :arrow:

If they're that good without their #1 WR, they're only going to be better with him. I agree with you about Ponder being an athletic game manager, but with Minny's OL, and AP keeping the D honest, I think Jennings will get his share of missed coverages. I think Kyle Rudolph is going to have a good year with Jennings there too.

I think it's important to note that Simpson and Wright are both 4.4 guys, and have speed/success in their own right. I think Minny has a nice little WR corps that's very underrated.


March 19th, 2013, 8:08 pm
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic   [ 48 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Yahoo [Bot] and 8 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.
Designed by STSoftware.