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 Broyles out for season again 
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Post Re: Broyles out for season again
Meanwhile, Konz is the starting center in Atlanta. ](*,)

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October 28th, 2013, 3:32 pm
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Post Re: Broyles out for season again
kdsberman wrote:
Meanwhile, Konz is the starting center in Atlanta. ](*,)



Ahhh, but how many folks on this board slammed WJB and myself for saying that he should have been the pick? At this point, I actually like having Warford, and Raiola is playing his best football. But Konz would be our future at the position.

Same thing with the Lions passing on Steve Wisniewski the year before in favor of Titus Young and then we traded up for LeShoure later in round two.

Sheepishly, I'll admit I wanted the Lions to get LeShoure in that round. It's painful to look at that history of picks and know that Torrey Smith and Randall Cobb both came off the board AFTER the LeShoure pick, as well as Greg Little. And then there was Justin Houston, whom I also liked in that draft and wanted the Lions to select.

Oh well.....

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October 28th, 2013, 3:57 pm
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Post Re: Broyles out for season again
m2karateman wrote:
kdsberman wrote:
Meanwhile, Konz is the starting center in Atlanta. ](*,)



Ahhh, but how many folks on this board slammed WJB and myself for saying that he should have been the pick? At this point, I actually like having Warford, and Raiola is playing his best football. But Konz would be our future at the position.

Same thing with the Lions passing on Steve Wisniewski the year before in favor of Titus Young and then we traded up for LeShoure later in round two.

Sheepishly, I'll admit I wanted the Lions to get LeShoure in that round. It's painful to look at that history of picks and know that Torrey Smith and Randall Cobb both came off the board AFTER the LeShoure pick, as well as Greg Little. And then there was Justin Houston, whom I also liked in that draft and wanted the Lions to select.

Oh well.....

I was with you screaming at the TV for passing on Konz. I remember say "who?" When they picked broyles. Wr's were completely off my radar. But who am I? If I had my way during a draft we'd still be looking for a qb, and talking about the biggest bust at linebacker, so....
Like you said.....oh well.

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October 28th, 2013, 7:13 pm
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Post Re: Broyles out for season again
regularjoe12 wrote:
m2karateman wrote:
kdsberman wrote:
Meanwhile, Konz is the starting center in Atlanta. ](*,)



Ahhh, but how many folks on this board slammed WJB and myself for saying that he should have been the pick? At this point, I actually like having Warford, and Raiola is playing his best football. But Konz would be our future at the position.

Same thing with the Lions passing on Steve Wisniewski the year before in favor of Titus Young and then we traded up for LeShoure later in round two.

Sheepishly, I'll admit I wanted the Lions to get LeShoure in that round. It's painful to look at that history of picks and know that Torrey Smith and Randall Cobb both came off the board AFTER the LeShoure pick, as well as Greg Little. And then there was Justin Houston, whom I also liked in that draft and wanted the Lions to select.

Oh well.....

I was with you screaming at the TV for passing on Konz. I remember say "who?" When they picked broyles. Wr's were completely off my radar. But who am I? If I had my way during a draft we'd still be looking for a qb, and talking about the biggest bust at linebacker, so....
Like you said.....oh well.


I actually wanted the Lions to select Broyles, but didn't want them to spend anything higher than a fourth rounder for him. With his ACL injury, less than ideal stature and lack of deep speed, I didn't think he was worth more than that. His route running skills were definitely NFL ready, as were his hands. Unfortunately, the Lions got nervous and reached.

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October 28th, 2013, 8:30 pm
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Post Re: Broyles out for season again
m2karateman wrote:
kdsberman wrote:
Meanwhile, Konz is the starting center in Atlanta. ](*,)



Ahhh, but how many folks on this board slammed WJB and myself for saying that he should have been the pick? At this point, I actually like having Warford, and Raiola is playing his best football. But Konz would be our future at the position.

Same thing with the Lions passing on Steve Wisniewski the year before in favor of Titus Young and then we traded up for LeShoure later in round two.

Sheepishly, I'll admit I wanted the Lions to get LeShoure in that round. It's painful to look at that history of picks and know that Torrey Smith and Randall Cobb both came off the board AFTER the LeShoure pick, as well as Greg Little. And then there was Justin Houston, whom I also liked in that draft and wanted the Lions to select.

Oh well.....


Not that it matters, but I think Wisniewski was picked before the lions were on the board wasn't he? I wanted him too.

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October 28th, 2013, 9:21 pm
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Post Re: Broyles out for season again
kdsberman wrote:
m2karateman wrote:
kdsberman wrote:
Meanwhile, Konz is the starting center in Atlanta. ](*,)



Ahhh, but how many folks on this board slammed WJB and myself for saying that he should have been the pick? At this point, I actually like having Warford, and Raiola is playing his best football. But Konz would be our future at the position.

Same thing with the Lions passing on Steve Wisniewski the year before in favor of Titus Young and then we traded up for LeShoure later in round two.

Sheepishly, I'll admit I wanted the Lions to get LeShoure in that round. It's painful to look at that history of picks and know that Torrey Smith and Randall Cobb both came off the board AFTER the LeShoure pick, as well as Greg Little. And then there was Justin Houston, whom I also liked in that draft and wanted the Lions to select.

Oh well.....


Not that it matters, but I think Wisniewski was picked before the lions were on the board wasn't he? I wanted him too.


He was drafted 4 picks after the Lions took Young.


October 28th, 2013, 10:09 pm
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Post Re: Broyles out for season again
I was ok with the Konz pick when we took Broyles, but 2 seasons in hes not a very good Center imo so im fine we didnt have him. I want our next Center to be a Nick Mangold/Alex Mack, not another Dom/"Technician" Center.

That said, our track record of 2nd/3rd picks is atrocious. If we werent Golden on our 1st Picks the past 4-5 years this team would be in Shambles.

Since 2009:

1st Picks: CJ, Stafford, Suh, Fairley, Reiff, Ansah, Pettigrew

2nd Picks:: Delmas, Slay, T Young, Broyles, Leshoure, Best (Traded up a few from 2nd)

3rd Picks: Warford, D Williams, Levy , Bently

Gio Back to 2008 and you get Cheilus, Dizon, K Smith


October 28th, 2013, 10:23 pm
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Post Re: Broyles out for season again
DJ-B wrote:
I was ok with the Konz pick when we took Broyles, but 2 seasons in hes not a very good Center imo so im fine we didnt have him. I want our next Center to be a Nick Mangold/Alex Mack, not another Dom/"Technician" Center.

That said, our track record of 2nd/3rd picks is atrocious. If we werent Golden on our 1st Picks the past 4-5 years this team would be in Shambles.

Since 2009:

1st Picks: CJ, Stafford, Suh, Fairley, Reiff, Ansah, Pettigrew

2nd Picks:: Delmas, Slay, T Young, Broyles, Leshoure, Best (Traded up a few from 2nd)

3rd Picks: Warford, D Williams, Levy , Bently

Gio Back to 2008 and you get Cheilus, Dizon, K Smith


When you lay it out like that it really is the 2nd round where they have missed badly. So far there is only 1 bust in the 3rd and they have not really missed on any 1st rounders with Pett dancing a very thin line of being a bad pick. The issue I see is they really seem to like to take high risk guys in the second. Young, Broyles, Best, and Slay all had bigger than average question marks coming out of college. Also with the exception of Slay and young all their picks got hammered by one or more injuries in their first season.


October 28th, 2013, 11:12 pm
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Post Re: Broyles out for season again
kdsberman wrote:
Meanwhile, Konz is the starting center in Atlanta. ](*,)


but konz is awful, way worse than raiola this year. get over the konz nonsense


October 28th, 2013, 11:28 pm
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Post Re: Broyles out for season again
DJ-B wrote:
I was ok with the Konz pick when we took Broyles, but 2 seasons in hes not a very good Center imo so im fine we didnt have him. I want our next Center to be a Nick Mangold/Alex Mack, not another Dom/"Technician" Center.

That said, our track record of 2nd/3rd picks is atrocious. If we werent Golden on our 1st Picks the past 4-5 years this team would be in Shambles.

Since 2009:

1st Picks: CJ, Stafford, Suh, Fairley, Reiff, Ansah, Pettigrew

2nd Picks:: Delmas, Slay, T Young, Broyles, Leshoure, Best (Traded up a few from 2nd)

3rd Picks: Warford, D Williams, Levy , Bently

Gio Back to 2008 and you get Cheilus, Dizon, K Smith


Calvin picked in 2007, best was a 1st rounder


October 28th, 2013, 11:35 pm
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Post Re: Broyles out for season again
Best was 30th, traded up from 2nd round. I put that in the same book as Delmas at 33. compared to our true st rounders in the top 10 and pett at 19. That said technically correct. and yes Cj shouldnt count for 2009 + since he was here before Cherios who is already gone (and wasnt a good pick).


October 29th, 2013, 5:08 am
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Post Re: Broyles out for season again
I posted something in the Draft Topics about this. Since Mayhew and Schwartz took over, our second picks....not second ROUND picks, but our second picks....have been anywhere from questionable to just awful.

2009 - Brandon Pettigrew; 20th overall
2010 - Jahvid Best; 30th overall
2011 - Titus Young; 44th overall
2012 - Ryan Broyles; 54th overall

I'm not going to judge Slay just yet, since it's entirely too early for that. But the remaining players have enough on their resume to make judgement. Pettigrew is the ONLY one who isn't considered a bust at this point, but his production judged against his draft position and subsequent salary cap figure is borderline poor. First round tight ends are supposed to be receiving threats, with field stretching speed that strike absolute fear into opposing linebackers and safeties. While Pettigrew is a big target, and does very well as an inline blocker, he lacks the speed and has inconsistent hands. At this point, I would say that if he were entered into a fantasy draft, ala Madden, where you could pick him in whatever round you wanted, he'd likely be taken in the fourth round or later. The top tight ends in the league get judged on their receiving skills moreso than on their blocking skills, and that's how their value is determined.

Likewise our third picks in the draft haven't exactly been all that great either, with the exception of Delmas.

2009: Louis Delmas; 33rd overall
2010: Amari Spievey; 66th overall
2011: Mikel LeShoure; 57th overall (cost us a 4th rounder, plus 5th round swap to move up from third round to get him)
2012: Dwight "Bill" Bentley; 85th overall

Spievey and LeShoure are absolute busts, no doubt about it. Bentley showed early promise, but now seems like he is regressing. LeShoure cost us even more due to the trade up to get him. In that trade, we swapped 5th and 7th round picks with Seattle, as well as giving them our 3rd and 4th rounders in exchange for their 2nd round pick. So in essence we gave them a 4th round pick. Oddly enough, the guy they selected with that pick is now on the Lions. Kris Durham was their selection with that pick. But in the fifth round the Seahawks ended up getting Richard Sherman. If we hadn't swapped, would the Lions have made him their pick? No way of knowing. The Lions took Doug Hogue, by the way, three picks after Sherman was selected.

And just for grins and giggles, here's a list of our fourth overall picks since '09:

2009: DeAndre Levy; 76th overall
2010: Jason Fox; 128th overall
2011: Doug Hogue; 157th overeall
2012: Ronnell Lewis; 125th overall

Yeah......not an impressive list. Levy is playing really well, and so that can be seen as a solid pick. After that, not so much. Fox can't stay healthy, and isn't setting the world on fire when he is healthy. I think LaAdrian Waddle should just remain at RT even if Fox is healthy. I have to imagine that next season Jason Fox won't be a Detroit Lion any longer.

Basically, when it comes down to it, for a three year period Mayhew and Schwartz sucked when it came down to picking beyond our first selection. In my opinion, picks made in the top 100 should not only be making your team, but should also be making a DIFFERENCE on your team by upgrading either your starting positions or improving your depth. Players selected in the top 40 should be starters, if not stars, for your team. Out of those 12 picks shown, 9 of them are top 100 selections, and only 3 are starters. Bentley is the only one who I consider to be a 'backup', as LeShoure is inactive most of the time now. The others are all busts, including two second rounders (Young and Broyles).

That is a pretty piss poor job of drafting beyond the first pick. I don't even want to go into what players were selected AFTER some of these picks were made. It turns my stomach.

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October 29th, 2013, 9:30 am
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Post Re: Broyles out for season again
Im interested to see what the new scouting dept has in store for us. do we know any other teams that have used this company before? what is their track record?

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October 29th, 2013, 9:50 am
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Post Re: Broyles out for season again
regularjoe12 wrote:
Im interested to see what the new scouting dept has in store for us. do we know any other teams that have used this company before? what is their track record?


As I understand it, it will still primarily be in house. Xanders was brought in to bring their system into the 21st century. Initial returns are promising.

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October 29th, 2013, 9:58 am
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Post Re: Broyles out for season again
regularjoe12 wrote:
Im interested to see what the new scouting dept has in store for us. do we know any other teams that have used this company before? what is their track record?


They aren't using a new company. It's just an in house system of gathering and organizing their scouting departments data. This system should allow them quicker and more in depth access to their scouting data. Xanders is using the same system he used in Denver and many other teams in the league have already changed to similar systems. Xanders also has experience as a scout which I think is a huge part of his contribution since he can be what fills the gap between the scouting dept and Mayhew.


October 29th, 2013, 10:24 am
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