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 Obamacare is here to stay. 
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Post Re: Obamacare is here to stay.
If anyone truly wants to know what's happening with Obamacare, google search Cloward-Piven. That will tell you all you need to know. Unfortunately, the Democrats and the corrupt lamestream media will scream "conspiracy theory" at the top of their lungs to silence the truth.

Obamacare was meant to fail to bring about single payer. Nothing more and nothing less. And while you're at google, type in "Fabianism". That ought to enlighten you a bit because that's exactly what Obama and the Democratic Party is doing right now.

Furthermore, there are also elements of Corporatism, Crony Capitalism, and Fascism in the Obama Administration. If you think for a second that they're for the little people or middle class, you have been severely misled. Billions of OUR taxpayer dollars are going to corporations that support Obama. Those that don't support him, not so much.

Why do you think the major drug companies supported Obamacare? Because the smaller, up and coming, drug companies wouldn't be able to compete with all the mandates. Why do you think that corporate hospitals agreed to this? Because Obamacare effectively banned doctor owned hospitals and clinics. If this isn't fascism, I don't know what is.

I'm waiting for Wags to say that Fascism is right wing ideology, while socialism is left wing. The truth, despite what ideological extremists say, is that ideology that includes MORE government control is left wing, while those that advocate for less is right wing. Ownership is not a factor despite how many dictionary definitions Wags can come up with.

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November 12th, 2013, 2:30 pm
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Post Re: Obamacare is here to stay.
Was it designed to intentionally fail and bring about single payer? Maybe. Either way, it's definitely heading in that direction.

What we're going to hear about next is "medicare for all -- it's only fair." And to some extent, that's true. The government covers the old, the poor, the disabled -- the people who get screwed are middle age workers, who have to foot the bill not only for themselves, but also for everyone else.


November 12th, 2013, 2:50 pm
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Post Re: Obamacare is here to stay.
The thing is this, and I doubt that anyone who ever worked for a government agency can refute it -the federal government is incompetent, corrupt, and only looking out for themselves. Put two and two together. More money only results in more fraud, waste, and abuse. I've seen it first hand. You can BELIEVE differently all you want, but I know better.

Watch and see, but we've already begun to see this in action.

I now laugh at those who thought otherwise.

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November 12th, 2013, 5:55 pm
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Post Re: Obamacare is here to stay.
Sly, I'm only posting this here because I know you're checking this topic.

This is why your savior Sarah Palin is an idiot. Rather than rally the people against the Federal Reserve, the NSA, excessive spending, corporatist welfare, or any other million evil things worth shedding light on, she's focusing on the "war on Christmas":

http://www.businessinsider.com/sarah-pa ... ur-2013-11

What a joke.


November 12th, 2013, 11:04 pm
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Post Re: Obamacare is here to stay.
Blueskies, with all due respect, the joke is on you.

Sarah is currently doing the talk show circuit to promote her new book.

And guess what the title and subject matter is?

It's called, "Good Tidings and Great Joy." and it's about Christmas.

BTW, she's already written about Obamacare and the Federal Reserve in previous books.

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November 12th, 2013, 11:35 pm
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Post Re: Obamacare is here to stay.
We live in a surveillance state, we have a bad economy that's probably in another bubble, and our government is insolvent.

And she wants to talk about Christmas?


November 13th, 2013, 10:07 am
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Post Re: Obamacare is here to stay.
Blueskies, I actually agree with what you're saying about Sarah's book about Christmas. The timing sucks, but this thing has probably been in the works for atleast a year before most of these scandals broke out. If she could turn back the clock, I suppose she would have written about the things you suggested instead, but who knew? She had already addressed some of those things in previous books and probably wanted to move in a different direction, discussing something just as important to her.

Now, back to Obamacare. In an hour and a half, Odumbo is gonna make a statement about his health care fiasco. My guess is that he's gonna delay the individual mandate until after the 2014 elections, just like he did with the employer mandate months ago. Never mind that this is unconstitutional and illegal, he's gotta do whatever will help his fellow Democrats/Communists/Socialists/Marxists win next November.

Of course, the corrupt lamestream media will never even suggest that his doing so has anything to do with the elections, but anyone with an IQ above single digits knows that it does. And the "entitlement" class will cheer and applaud him doing so. Never mind that the Republicans have wanted to do this forever because they're evil!

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November 14th, 2013, 11:15 am
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Post Re: Obamacare is here to stay.
I forgot to mention earlier that there is a Republican bill in the House that uses Obama's words that if you like your health insurance, you can keep your health insurance. There is also a similar bill from a Democrat in the Senate, which promises the same thing. It should come as no surprise that it is written by Senator Mary Landrieu of Louisiana, who is up for re-election in a Red State next year, though. Remember when Nancy Polosi said that you have to pass the bill in order to find out what's in it? Well, it looks like some people finally have and they don't like it. lol.

As a reminder, I predicted all this crap over three years ago, but nobody wanted to listen to little old me. With that said, you didn't have to be a rocket scientist to see what was coming. You only had to live in the real world and possess a little common sense in order to put two and two together. Just another example of how conservatives live in reality, while liberals live in the realm of fantasy.

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November 14th, 2013, 12:07 pm
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Post Re: Obamacare is here to stay.
I just went back to page 20 to find the original Obamacare thread. It was called "Universal Health Care" though. While skimming through it, I found this gem from over three years ago:
Investors.com wrote:
Keep Your Health Plan Under Overhaul? Probably Not, Gov't Analysis Concludes

By David Hogberg and Sean Higgins, INVESTOR'S BUSINESS DAILY

Posted 06/11/2010 07:32 PM ET

Internal administration documents reveal that up to 51% of employers may have to relinquish their current health care coverage because of ObamaCare.

Small firms will be even likelier to lose existing plans.

The "midrange estimate is that 66% of small employer plans and 45% of large employer plans will relinquish their grandfathered status by the end of 2013," according to the document.

In the worst-case scenario, 69% of employers — 80% of smaller firms — would lose that status, exposing them to far more provisions under the new health law.

The 83-page document, a joint project of the departments of Health and Human Services, Labor and the IRS, examines the effects that ObamaCare's regulations would have on existing, or "grandfathered," employer-based health care plans.

Draft copies of the document were reportedly leaked to House Republicans during the week and began circulating Friday morning. Rep. Bill Posey, R-Fla., posted it on his Web site Friday afternoon.

"It's been passed around the staffs here on Capitol Hill. Congressman Posey thought it was important enough to share," said spokesman George Cecala.

In a statement, Posey said the document showed that the arguments in favor of ObamaCare were a "bait and switch."

"The president promised repeatedly that people who like their current plans can keep them, but now the details of their plan actually confirm what many suspected all along, most Americans will lose their current health care plan," Posey said.

A White House official told IBD: "This is a draft document, and we will be releasing the final regulation when it is complete. The president made a promise to the American people that if they liked their health care plan, they can keep it. The regulation, when finalized, will uphold that promise."

However, the source conceded: "It is difficult to predict how plans and employers will behave in the coming years, but if plans make changes that negatively impact consumers, then they will lose their grandfather status."

It's unclear how the document leaked out. An HHS spokeswoman confirmed that the department was working on a draft paper about grandfathered plans but said it hasn't been made public yet.

A House Republican staffer said the rumor was that the document had been erroneously posted on the Office of Management and Budget Web site earlier in the week and somebody spotted it before it was taken down. IBD has not been able to confirm this report.


As soon as I post this, I'm gonna bump that old thread back to the top. Feel free to read through it, especially my dozens of posts, to see how Miss Cleo - like, I turned out to be. As I partially re-read through that thread, I just laughed.

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November 14th, 2013, 12:56 pm
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Post Re: Obamacare is here to stay.
Looks like I was atleast half wrong. Obozo isn't delaying the individual mandate. However, he's allowing people to keep their insurance that they were gonna lose because of Obamacare. I haven't heard him give a timeframe for this yet, but I'd be surprised if it lasts much beyond the 2014 mid-term elections.

I guess this means that people that don't want free birth control don't have to pay for it. Sandra Fluke must be pissed right now. Also, I guess men and post-menopause women don't have to pay for maternity care. Hopefully, the rest of us don't have to pay for transsexual surgery either, but that might be asking a bit much from this Regime.

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November 14th, 2013, 1:29 pm
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Post Re: Obamacare is here to stay.
I just had another thought. The Obama Regime has spent billions of dollars attempting to implement Obamacare without insuring a single individual prior to the October 1st launch date. That just goes to show you how costly, inefficient, and unnecessary the federal bureaucracy is. It would be cheaper to just throw the money at the uninsured without the pencil pushers in Washington getting involved. Don't get me wrong. I'm not in favor of throwing money at the uninsured, but it certainly would be cheaper than this current trainwreck known as Obamacare.

I dare any libtard/Democrat/Communist/Socialist/Marxist to debate me on this issue. I was a Supply Sergeant in the US Army for 8-1/2 years and saw it first hand, especially amongst the unionized DOA or DOD civilian employees. I know how the system works. Libtards tend to have this idealistic, fantasyland mentality where all government workers are in it to serve the public. That couldn't be further from the truth. The "use it or lose it" scam is in full force within the federal government and I fully participated in it under the direction of my commanding officer.

For those that don't understand the concept of "use it or lose it", it works like this: If you get a million dollar budget and don't use all of it, you will get less the next year. Conversely, is you spend all of your budget in a given year, you will get the same amount or more the following year. That's how the system works. Saving money is frowned upon. That costs every taxpaying citizen of the USA.

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November 14th, 2013, 2:01 pm
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Post Re: Obamacare is here to stay.
Despite the fact that Obama said that he's going to eliminate the provisions of Obamacare that directly lead to insurance cancellations, I think I'm gonna highlight instances where this is happening to hammer home the point. A government takeover of any industry is not acceptable and never works.

Washington Times wrote:
Florida cancer patient to lose insurance during treatment because of Obamacare

By Douglas Ernst

The Washington Times

Thursday, November 14, 2013

Cancer patient Gloria Cantor will have her health insurance dropped in the middle of treatment because of regulations of the Affordable Care Act.

Gloria Cantor of Florida has cancer — five brain tumors and tumors in her bones — but she won’t have the health insurance she has relied on for her treatment for much longer.

Mrs. Cantor and her husband, Jay, told WFTV in Orlando that their insurance is being dropped in order to comply with Obamacare regulations.

“The Cantors received [a] letter in the mail [that] explains Gloria’s health insurance will end next summer due to the Affordable Care Act,” reporter Lori Brown says. “But after promises by President Obama … the Cantors now feel betrayed. After the insurance company drops them, it will offer them a different plan that it admits will be more expensive. The Cantors are especially worried because their doctors cannot assure them that [the MD Anderson Cancer Center] will still accept the new plan.”

During the interview, Mrs. Canter breaks into tears and says that the cancellation, on top of everything else, is something “that we don’t need at this moment.”

Mr. Cantor adds, “This came on us like a ton of bricks.”

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/nov/14/fla-cancer-patient-lose-health-insurance-during-tr/

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November 14th, 2013, 4:50 pm
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Post Re: Obamacare is here to stay.
Before you read any of this, realize that it is from the VERY liberal New York Times. I keep hammering the fact that the Obama Regime is the most corrupt in history, but here is another example:

New York Times wrote:
Strategic Move Exempts Health Law From Broader U.S. Statute


Doug Mills/The New York Times

President Obama discussed the Affordable Care Act at a dinner in Washington. The administration has ruled that the law is not subject to a specific anti-fraud statute.

By ROBERT PEAR

Published: November 4, 2013

WASHINGTON — The Affordable Care Act is the biggest new health care program in decades, but the Obama administration has ruled that neither the federal insurance exchange nor the federal subsidies paid to insurance companies on behalf of low-income people are “federal health care programs.”

The surprise decision, disclosed last week, exempts subsidized health insurance from a law that bans rebates, kickbacks, bribes and certain other financial arrangements in federal health programs, stripping law enforcement of a powerful tool used to fight fraud in other health care programs, like Medicare.

The main purpose of the anti-kickback law, as described by federal courts in scores of Medicare cases, is to protect patients and taxpayers against the undue influence of money on medical decisions.

Kathleen Sebelius, the secretary of health and human services, disclosed her interpretation of the law in a letter to Representative Jim McDermott, Democrat of Washington, who had asked her views. She did not explain the legal rationale for her decision, which followed a spirited debate within the administration.

Under the Affordable Care Act, millions of people will be able to buy insurance from “qualified health plans” offered on exchanges, or marketplaces, run by the federal government and by some states.

Most of the buyers are expected to be eligible for subsidies to make insurance more affordable. The subsidies, paid directly to insurers from the United States Treasury, start in January and are expected to total more than $1 trillion over 10 years.

Ms. Sebelius said the Health and Human Services Department “does not consider” the subsidies to be federal health care programs. She reached the same conclusion with respect to federal and state exchanges, built with federal money, and with respect to “federally funded consumer assistance programs,” including the counselors, known as navigators, who help people shop for insurance and enroll in coverage through the exchanges.

The federal exchange has been plagued with problems since it opened on Oct. 1. The Obama administration said that the online enrollment system for the exchange was out of service again for 90 minutes on Monday afternoon in an “unscheduled outage.” That was in addition to the scheduled down time from 1 a.m. to 5 a.m. each day.

President Obama, speaking at a political event on Monday night, said he was determined to fix the problems that have frustrated millions of people trying to use the website for the federal exchange.

“When the unexpected happens, when the unanticipated happens, we’re just going to work on it,” Mr. Obama said. “We’re going to fix things that aren’t working the way they should be. We’re going to smooth this thing out, and we’re just going to keep on going.’ ”

Lawyers and law enforcement officials said Ms. Sebelius’s decision was unexpected because the insurance exchanges and subsidy payments appeared to fit the definition of federal health care programs in the anti-kickback statute.

Generally, the law makes it a crime to pay or receive anything of value in return for the referral of patients or as an inducement for people to buy goods and services reimbursed by federal health care programs. Such programs are defined broadly as “any plan or program that provides health benefits, whether directly, through insurance, or otherwise, which is funded directly, in whole or in part, by the United States government.”

“The secretary’s decision will have some very significant consequences,” said D. McCarty Thornton, former chief counsel to the inspector general at the Health and Human Services Department. “The federal anti-kickback statute will, in most cases, not apply to subsidized health plans or the items and services furnished by those plans.”

“Plans and providers are very happy to be relieved of that concern,” Mr. Thornton added.

Kevin G. McAnaney, a lawyer who specializes in health care fraud and abuse cases, said Ms. Sebelius’s decision would allow drug companies to give coupons to people who buy insurance through the exchanges.

Such coupons subsidize co-payments and reduce out-of-pocket costs for consumers, encouraging them to use certain brand-name prescription drugs when lower-cost alternatives are available, Mr. McAnaney said.


The federal government has forbidden the use of drug coupons in Medicare and other federal health programs, saying they amount to a classic kickback scheme, with drug companies paying consumers to use their products.

Mark Merritt, the president of the Pharmaceutical Care Management Association, which represents benefit managers like Express Scripts and CVS Caremark, expressed a similar concern. “The coupons steer consumers away from lower-cost alternatives to more expensive drugs, increasing costs to insurers and to the government,” he said.

Coupons may drive down the co-payment for an expensive brand-name drug, but often, the insurer must pay much more than it would for a generic version of the medication.

Some drug companies and their lawyers had assumed that federal insurance subsidies were part of a federal health care program.

Drug coupons offered by Merck, for example, say that they are not valid for patients covered by Medicare, Medicaid or “any qualified health plan purchased through a health insurance exchange established by a state government or the federal government.”

In a vivid demonstration of how the anti-kickback law can be applied, the Justice Department announced on Monday that Johnson & Johnson would pay more than $2.2 billion to resolve criminal and civil investigations. The government said the company had, among other things, paid kickbacks to doctors and nursing home pharmacies to promote the use of certain drugs. The company said the payments were “lawful rebates.”

The National Health Council, which represents patients and drug companies, praised Ms. Sebelius’s decision. “People with chronic diseases and disabilities will be able to continue using co-payment assistance programs,” said Myrl Weinberg, the chief executive of the council.

Ms. Sebelius may not have the last word, lawyers said. A whistle-blower could file suit under the False Claims Act, charging that health care providers, health plans or drug makers had defrauded the government, and a federal court might then decide whether the federal exchange or subsidy payments were federal health care programs.

Addressing a rally of supporters on Monday, Mr. Obama responded to critics who say he has broken his promise that people could keep their health insurance if they liked it.

Mr. Obama provided some additional explanation: “Now if you have or had one of these plans before the Affordable Care Act came into law and you really liked that plan, what we said was you could keep it if it hasn’t changed since the law was passed.”

In recent weeks, hundreds of thousands of people have received notices discontinuing individual insurance policies because they did not meet minimum coverage standards under the health care law.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/11/05/us/politics/federal-health-law-may-not-be-a-federal-health-care-program.html?_r=1&

Fascism, anyone? But, but, but......I thought fascism was a right wing ideology. Wrong again. suckers! :lol:

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November 14th, 2013, 5:03 pm
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Post Re: Obamacare is here to stay.
This is from the left-leaning Politico, so you can't accuse me of bias:

politico wrote:
Senate Democrats not fully satisfied with Obamacare fix

By BURGESS EVERETT, SEUNG MIN KIM and JENNIFER HABERKORN | 11/14/13 1:49 PM EST Updated: 11/14/13 3:03 PM

Senate Democrats are still considering legislation to repair President Barack Obama’s broken Obamacare promise, despite the White House plans for an administrative fix.

Sens. Mary Landrieu (D-La.) and Mark Udall (D-Colo.) still want to see votes on their separate, alternative proposals aimed at helping Americans who lost insurance plans. Several of the other Democrats who are up for reelection in 2014 want to vote on a legislative fix, too.
Continue Reading “We will probably need legislation to make it stick,” Landrieu said, referring to the administration’s announcement. “However, do not underestimate the power of a presidential directive and don’t underestimate the willingness of insurance commissioners around this country — Republican and Democrat — to make this right for people.”

(Understanding Obamacare: POLITICO’s guide to the ACA)

Meanwhile, House Democratic leaders huddled with Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius Thursday afternoon to discuss options for legislation that would supplement the new administrative policy.

Sebelius was there to listen, not pitch a White House plan, according to one Democratic source. It was not immediately clear what legislation House Democrats would pursue. But whatever plan they choose, it is unlikely to advance in the Republican-controlled House.

Sen. Jeff Merkley (D-Ore.), who has also signed onto Landrieu’s plan, said he is still backing that bill because it “goes a little further” than the administration’s proposed fix. Sen. Mark Begich (D-Alaska), said he was continuing to push for the Udall bill, which is also co-sponsored by Sen. Jeanne Shaheen (D-N.H.). All those senators are up for reelection next year.

“I’d make it permanent if I could, but I’m thinking at least two years should be on the table,” Begich said.

They’re worried that Obama’s plan allows for the insurance plans that would have been canceled under Obamacare to continue for only one year. Landrieu’s bill would allow the plans to continue indefinitely and Udall’s allows the plans to remain open for two years.

Sen. Kay Hagan (D-N.C.), one of the most vulnerable Democrats up next year, called Obama’s plan a “step in the right direction,” but said, “a one-year fix is not enough, and we need to do more.”

Other Democrats said they’d like to wait and see how the insurance companies respond before deciding whether Obama’s plan is a strong enough response to the problem.

“The president has honored his promise, I think it’s the right decision,” said Sen. Angus King (I-Maine), who caucuses with Democrats. “I think we’ll know in a matter of days whether the insurance companies are going to honor the president’s request and rescind these cancellations. If they don’t, perhaps we’ll look at something more stringent such as what Sen. Landrieu has proposed.”

(PHOTOS: Sebelius testifies on Obamacare rollout)

Sen. Dick Durbin, the Senate’s No. 2 Democrat, also said he doesn’t believe legislation is needed right now.

Senate Democrats were briefed on the president’s plan by White House chief of staff Denis McDonough. He declined to comment on the meeting to POLITICO as he strolled to another Capitol Hill briefing, this one with the House Democrats.

Sen. Joe Manchin (D-W.Va.), who is backing the Landrieu plan, said the votes are a matter of restoring credibility.

“It’s moving in the right direction, you know. We’ve got to get this credibility back. We’ve got to give people the chance that had the policy to keep the policy,” he said.

Asked if a fix for cancelled policies is on the table, Manchin responded: “We’ll see.”

Meanwhile, several congressional Democratic sources expressed anger that Obama’s closest allies on Capitol Hill learned of the specifics of the fix from press reports and a speech, rather than through direct communication with the White House.

“Huge frustrations,” said one aide. “It’s the opposite of the Bush administration that sought Hill buy-in before rolling out major policy changes.”

“Par for the course,” sighed another.

Still, Obama’s proposal got a generally positive reception among the 55-member Senate Democratic Caucus, particularly because leadership does not believe the Republican House would support piecemeal changes to the law aimed at improving it. The House is set to vote on a bill from Rep. Fred Upton (R-Mich.) on Friday that Democrats say is riddled with loopholes.

“No one has explained to me how you get constructive fixes through the House,” said Sen. Chuck Schumer (D-N.Y.), who said his members were focused on positive fixes rather than destructive legislation like the House will consider on Friday. “The best way to fix this is administratively.”

Sen. Tom Harkin (D-Iowa), one of the biggest defenders of the health care law on Capitol Hill, said he was skeptical about the administrative fix.

“If it had been up to me, I am not certain I would have made this decision, but the President felt it was important to do,” he said in a statement. “My hope, however, is that everyone who has received a cancellation notice will fully and carefully consider their options. In the vast majority of cases, they will find that the coverage that they were paying good money for is not worth the paper it was printed on.”

Republicans found little encouraging in Obama’s remarks and plans to allow people to keep their insurance. Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.) called the fix “a duct tape solution to a problem that can’t be fixed with duct tape.”


Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2013/11/s ... z2kelyx5S1

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November 14th, 2013, 5:16 pm
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Post Re: Obamacare is here to stay.
Where is Wags when you need him? Where is the occupy-loving, Obamacare-supporting, useless, POS when all of his Communist/Socialist views are crashing to the ground? Enquiring minds want to know. :lol:

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November 14th, 2013, 5:19 pm
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