View unanswered posts | View active topics It is currently October 23rd, 2014, 9:17 am



Reply to topic  [ 17 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
 Don't drink the water - on Mars! 
Author Message
RIP Killer
User avatar

Joined: August 6th, 2004, 9:21 am
Posts: 9494
Location: Dallas
Post Don't drink the water - on Mars!
http://www.forbes.com/sites/alexknapp/2 ... r-on-mars/

Forbes wrote:
NASA Finds Clues That There's Flowing Water On Mars

At this point, the evidence is pretty convincing that there was once free-flowing water in abundance on the surface of Mars, so much so that the planet was likely inhabitable billions of years ago. And scientists studying Mars have discovered that water is still on Mars in the form of ice. But one question that remains unanswered is this: if water once flowed on Mars, does it still flow now?

There’s no definitive answer yet, but astronomers examining the question have honed in on ”recurring slope lineae” or RSL for short. These are dark lines that are observed moving down the slopes of some Martian mountains as temperatures on the surface rise. Some scientists studying Mars have suggested that these flows might be caused by saltwater containing a iron sulfate solution to keep it from freezing in Martian temperatures.

Now new images taken by the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter have shown new clues that yes, these RSL do in fact contain flowing water. This comes from two new reports that focused on the minerals left behind by the RSL. While the images didn’t find any signs of salt or water, they did find iron-containing minerals that weren’t found on mountains without RSL. And the presence of those minerals varied with the seasons.

“Just like the RSL themselves, the strength of the spectral signatures varies according to the seasons. They’re stronger when it’s warmer and less significant when it’s colder,” said lead researcher Lujendra Ojha in a NASA press release.

The best explanation for these flows likely involves the flow of water, although dry processes are conceivable. The problem is that the spectral signatures of the iron minerals in RSL could be blocking out the spectral signs of water, making it hard for scientists to find a definitive answer.

“We still don’t have a smoking gun for existence of water in RSL, although we’re not sure how this process would take place without water,” said Ojha.

If further research continues to point to flowing water on Mars as the best explanation for RSL, then that’s a big deal – it would deepen our understanding of the Martian climate and increase the possibility that some form of life exists on Mars.

“The flow of water, even briny water, anywhere on Mars today would be a major discovery, impacting our understanding of present climate change on Mars and possibly indicating potential habitats for life near the surface on modern Mars,” Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter Project Scientist Richard Zurek said in the release.


ImageSpectral images of RSL taken by the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter. (Image Credit: NASA/JPL-Caltech/UA/JHU-APL)

_________________
Image
LB Tweet


February 11th, 2014, 9:48 am
Profile WWW
QB Coach
User avatar

Joined: October 26th, 2005, 11:48 pm
Posts: 3039
Location: Elkhart, In.
Post Re: Don't drink the water - on Mars!
I don't want to derail your topic here Pablo but I'd like to refer you to a VERY interesting section of the Bible that spoke of creation. It's within the first few paragraphs of Genesis 1.

It speaks of God separating the waters, and if you read carefully you'll see that there were TWO rings of water. One in which our home planet was made out of, and two, which was above our solar system as we know it. I know this is WILD to consider, but I have a few questions that coincide with it.

If space is a void, a vaccum then where does the moisture come from that forms the ice crystals and comets that are made of ice? A vacuum is a pristine environment, free of humidity or anything, it's just "clean" if you will, or am I wrong in my thinking?

Now, just in case you're thinking that evaporation from our Earth, is what provides moisture in our universe, water is heavier than air, and has not "propulsion" of it's own. So how could it break the gravitational pull of our planet? On top of that, based upon heating and cooling, water returns back to earth in the form of rain and the pattern is a cycle. Evaporation and Rain/snow, and so on. So where would the moisture come from?

However, if what Genesis said is true, then this speaks to the evidence of that section of the Bible because of the waters mentioned. But it goes on from there too! Because in the days of Noah, the Bible also states that there was not known among men, this thing called rain. The land was watered by other means, namely dew and fog in a tropical environment. But when Noah built the arc, the HEAVENS poured out water, and the deep springs unleashed as well. So this outer ring of water was pierced and flooded the Earth.

And Earth isn't the largest planet, nor does it have the strongest gravitational pull. So could there be the possibility that the evidence of water you reference above, is from the piercing of the 2nd ring?

_________________
2 Chronicles 10:14, "if my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and I will forgive their sin and will heal their land."


February 11th, 2014, 10:00 am
Profile
Lionbacker Rehab Guru
User avatar

Joined: January 26th, 2006, 9:08 pm
Posts: 1203
Post Re: Don't drink the water - on Mars!
Pablo wrote:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/alexknapp/2014/02/10/nasa-finds-clues-that-theres-flowing-water-on-mars/
Forbes wrote:

Quote:
At this point, the evidence is pretty convincing that there was once free-flowing water in abundance on the surface of Mars, so much so that the planet was likely inhabitable billions of years ago.
Say what? There was water, so we know there was life. I don't mind life being on Mars one way or another, but sloppy science just pisses me off.

_________________
Climate Change - happening every second, of every minute of every day ever since the world was created. Needless to say it's man's fault.


February 11th, 2014, 1:21 pm
Profile
NFL Veteran

Joined: November 28th, 2007, 12:50 pm
Posts: 1386
Location: Newport Beach, Ca
Post Re: Don't drink the water - on Mars!
TruckinMack wrote:
Pablo wrote:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/alexknapp/2014/02/10/nasa-finds-clues-that-theres-flowing-water-on-mars/
Forbes wrote:

Quote:
At this point, the evidence is pretty convincing that there was once free-flowing water in abundance on the surface of Mars, so much so that the planet was likely inhabitable billions of years ago.
Say what? There was water, so we know there was life. I don't mind life being on Mars one way or another, but sloppy science just pisses me off.


Sloppy reading comprehension is more annoying than sloppy science. No where anywhere do they say because water there IS/WAS life on Mars. The only assumption they are sorta making is that because of the likely hood of their being flowing water on Mars that it is also likely the planet could have been inhabitable. Inhabitable does not equal life.


February 11th, 2014, 1:55 pm
Profile
Lionbacker Rehab Guru
User avatar

Joined: January 26th, 2006, 9:08 pm
Posts: 1203
Post Re: Don't drink the water - on Mars!
rao wrote:
TruckinMack wrote:
Pablo wrote:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/alexknapp/2014/02/10/nasa-finds-clues-that-theres-flowing-water-on-mars/
Forbes wrote:

Quote:
At this point, the evidence is pretty convincing that there was once free-flowing water in abundance on the surface of Mars, so much so that the planet was likely inhabitable billions of years ago.


Sloppy reading comprehension is more annoying than sloppy science. No where anywhere do they say because water there IS/WAS life on Mars. The only assumption they are sorta making is that because of the likely hood of their being flowing water on Mars that it is also likely the planet could have been inhabitable. Inhabitable does not equal life.

Much obliged RAO.

Because there was water on Mars that meant it was inhabitable, inhabitable by what? You might as well say, because there is no water on Mars it was likely inhabitable. I hate sloppy science.

_________________
Climate Change - happening every second, of every minute of every day ever since the world was created. Needless to say it's man's fault.


February 11th, 2014, 3:05 pm
Profile
RIP Killer
User avatar

Joined: August 6th, 2004, 9:21 am
Posts: 9494
Location: Dallas
Post Re: Don't drink the water - on Mars!
TruckinMack wrote:
Because there was water on Mars that meant it was inhabitable, inhabitable by what? You might as well say, because there is no water on Mars it was likely inhabitable. I hate sloppy science.


Inhabitable by any living creature, could be a single cell organism. Based on life as we know it, carbon based life forms, water is pretty essential to most forms of life.

Science wouldn't say because there is no water that a planet is inhabitable, so your statement is false and it isn't sloppy science. In fact, science is looking at other types of extraterrestrial environments than our own. For example, ammonia has many of the same properties as water and if mixed with water can stay liquid at much colder temps than pure water - expanding the habitability zone or sweet spot we tend to identify as potential for life. Titan (Saturn's moon, which has a well developed atmosphere) seems to have lakes of liquid ethane or liquid methane, those could also possibly support life.

Here on our planet, we've discovered some life forms use arsenic to create heat and their own growth. It was very long ago that the thought of arsenic was counterintuitive to helping spawn life. Sulfur creates long chain molecules much like carbon so some suggest it might be an alternative building block to carbon and some bacteria here survive on it as opposed to oxygen. Chlorine, Nitrogen and phosphorus could also potentially be a base chemical for life on other planets, water might not be necessary for them either. In reality, once you remove the need to be carbon based, life has all sorts of different possibilities and some of them wouldn't require Ozarka to make it meaning the environments can then be drastically different than here on the 3rd rock from the sun.

WarEr4Christ wrote:
I don't want to derail your topic here Pablo


When then I don't need to respond... :alien2:

However, you are wrong in your assumption that space is a complete vacuum because you can find all sorts of things such as hydrogen and helium (plasma), radiation (electromagnetic), neutrinos, cosmic rays, magnetic fields, dust, etc. And then their is "dark" matter which we are now just in the beginning stages of understanding. I am only going to address the science aspect of your question to try to avoid derailment like so many other threads.

_________________
Image
LB Tweet


February 11th, 2014, 4:26 pm
Profile WWW
NFL Veteran

Joined: November 28th, 2007, 12:50 pm
Posts: 1386
Location: Newport Beach, Ca
Post Re: Don't drink the water - on Mars!
TruckinMack wrote:
rao wrote:
TruckinMack wrote:
Pablo wrote:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/alexknapp/2014/02/10/nasa-finds-clues-that-theres-flowing-water-on-mars/
Forbes wrote:

Quote:
At this point, the evidence is pretty convincing that there was once free-flowing water in abundance on the surface of Mars, so much so that the planet was likely inhabitable billions of years ago.


Sloppy reading comprehension is more annoying than sloppy science. No where anywhere do they say because water there IS/WAS life on Mars. The only assumption they are sorta making is that because of the likely hood of their being flowing water on Mars that it is also likely the planet could have been inhabitable. Inhabitable does not equal life.

Much obliged RAO.

Because there was water on Mars that meant it was inhabitable, inhabitable by what? You might as well say, because there is no water on Mars it was likely inhabitable. I hate sloppy science.


The article makes no mention of what type of life could have inhabited the planet, but that is irrelevant anyways because saying something is inhabitable isn't saying that the planet was inhabited. Also this article isn't about whether there was/is life on Mars, it is about the evidence of flowing water having been and maybe still being on Mars. The article even states that if there was flowing water on Mars it only makes it a likely possibility the planet was once inhabitable, but not a guarantee that it was. The researchers conducting the investigation of the evidence are not looking at or making statements about the existence of life on Mars. Their pursuit is in looking for flowing water and so far they seem to be doing a fine job at it.

Again the only thing sloppy here is your insult of the work these researchers are doing.


February 11th, 2014, 4:36 pm
Profile
Lionbacker Rehab Guru
User avatar

Joined: January 26th, 2006, 9:08 pm
Posts: 1203
Post Re: Don't drink the water - on Mars!
rao wrote:
Quote:
At this point, the evidence is pretty convincing that there was once free-flowing water in abundance on the surface of Mars, so much so that the planet was likely inhabitable billions of years ago.

Quote:
Much obliged RAO.

Because there was water on Mars that meant it was inhabitable, inhabitable by what? You might as well say, because there is no water on Mars it was likely inhabitable. I hate sloppy science.


The article makes no mention of what type of life could have inhabited the planet, but that is irrelevant anyways because saying something is inhabitable isn't saying that the planet was inhabited. Also this article isn't about whether there was/is life on Mars, it is about the evidence of flowing water having been and maybe still being on Mars. The article even states that if there was flowing water on Mars it only makes it a likely possibility the planet was once inhabitable, but not a guarantee that it was. The researchers conducting the investigation of the evidence are not at or making statements about the existence of life on Mars. Their pursuit is in looking for flowing water and so far they seem to be doing a fine job at it.
looking
Again the only thing sloppy here is your insult of the work these researchers are doing.


You were right the first time. Not so much the second time. Now you are just being intentionally rude (because I am giving you the benefit of the doubt that your reading and comprehension are intact). The planet was likely inhabitable because there was water present. Why? What scientific standard says water on another planet means life. (Other than goofy sci fi shows that have people take off their breathing masks because there are plants making oxygen on a planet.) The presence of water means, newsflash, there are elements on Mars. You are going to have to do better if you want to posit life... Though if you just want to be as wrong in your insults as you can, have at it.

_________________
Climate Change - happening every second, of every minute of every day ever since the world was created. Needless to say it's man's fault.


February 11th, 2014, 6:53 pm
Profile
NFL Veteran

Joined: November 28th, 2007, 12:50 pm
Posts: 1386
Location: Newport Beach, Ca
Post Re: Don't drink the water - on Mars!
TruckinMack wrote:
rao wrote:
Quote:
At this point, the evidence is pretty convincing that there was once free-flowing water in abundance on the surface of Mars, so much so that the planet was likely inhabitable billions of years ago.

Quote:
Much obliged RAO.

Because there was water on Mars that meant it was inhabitable, inhabitable by what? You might as well say, because there is no water on Mars it was likely inhabitable. I hate sloppy science.


The article makes no mention of what type of life could have inhabited the planet, but that is irrelevant anyways because saying something is inhabitable isn't saying that the planet was inhabited. Also this article isn't about whether there was/is life on Mars, it is about the evidence of flowing water having been and maybe still being on Mars. The article even states that if there was flowing water on Mars it only makes it a likely possibility the planet was once inhabitable, but not a guarantee that it was. The researchers conducting the investigation of the evidence are not at or making statements about the existence of life on Mars. Their pursuit is in looking for flowing water and so far they seem to be doing a fine job at it.
looking
Again the only thing sloppy here is your insult of the work these researchers are doing.


You were right the first time. Not so much the second time. Now you are just being intentionally rude (because I am giving you the benefit of the doubt that your reading and comprehension are intact). The planet was likely inhabitable because there was water present. Why? What scientific standard says water on another planet means life. (Other than goofy sci fi shows that have people take off their breathing masks because there are plants making oxygen on a planet.) The presence of water means, newsflash, there are elements on Mars. You are going to have to do better if you want to posit life... Though if you just want to be as wrong in your insults as you can, have at it.


No one has stated water equals life except for you. How bout instead of you asking me why their statement is right, you explain why they are incorrect in the idea that the abundance of flowing water they believe to have evidence of makes it likely Mars was inhabitable.

I'm not being anymore rude than you are. You couldn't post a well thought out message as to why you felt the researchers are wrong. All you could do was insult their integrity and the authors by calling their work sloppy.


February 11th, 2014, 7:33 pm
Profile
Lionbacker Rehab Guru
User avatar

Joined: January 26th, 2006, 9:08 pm
Posts: 1203
Post Re: Don't drink the water - on Mars!
rao wrote:
No one has stated water equals life except for you. How bout instead of you asking me why their statement is right, you explain why they are incorrect in the idea that the abundance of flowing water they believe to have evidence of makes it likely Mars was inhabitable.

I'm not being anymore rude than you are. You couldn't post a well thought out message as to why you felt the researchers are wrong. All you could do was insult their integrity and the authors by calling their work sloppy.


Quote:
At this point, the evidence is pretty convincing that there was once free-flowing water in abundance on the surface of Mars, so much so that the planet was likely inhabitable billions of years ago.

RAO, you are now petulant, being dumb as a box of rocks and you are trying to be rude, but your idiocy is blocking the view. You were right when you corrected me about the 'life' on Mars quote. As a result, I changed my post to challenging the finding (premise) that the presence of water alone indicated that the planet was once 'likely' inhabitable. That statement is ludicrous, foolish, dumb, asinine and/or scientifically lacking support. They gave no other rationale for this theory and presented it as fact. That is sloppy science. Hell, that should be criminal science. It's thinking like that that 'proves' we have global warming and a zillion other Liberal idiocies.

When you corrected me the first time, I checked my facts, saw that I was wrong, acknowledged my error and moved on. You have now stunk up the place and instead of saying 'oops my bad' you are doubling down on your stupidity. Have at it. Keep being wrong as wrong can be. I will try to stay out of the way while you are demonstrating your prowess.

_________________
Climate Change - happening every second, of every minute of every day ever since the world was created. Needless to say it's man's fault.


February 11th, 2014, 10:31 pm
Profile
NFL Veteran

Joined: November 28th, 2007, 12:50 pm
Posts: 1386
Location: Newport Beach, Ca
Post Re: Don't drink the water - on Mars!
TruckinMack wrote:
rao wrote:
No one has stated water equals life except for you. How bout instead of you asking me why their statement is right, you explain why they are incorrect in the idea that the abundance of flowing water they believe to have evidence of makes it likely Mars was inhabitable.

I'm not being anymore rude than you are. You couldn't post a well thought out message as to why you felt the researchers are wrong. All you could do was insult their integrity and the authors by calling their work sloppy.


Quote:
At this point, the evidence is pretty convincing that there was once free-flowing water in abundance on the surface of Mars, so much so that the planet was likely inhabitable billions of years ago.

RAO, you are now petulant, being dumb as a box of rocks and you are trying to be rude, but your idiocy is blocking the view. You were right when you corrected me about the 'life' on Mars quote. As a result, I changed my post to challenging the finding (premise) that the presence of water alone indicated that the planet was once 'likely' inhabitable. That statement is ludicrous, foolish, dumb, asinine and/or scientifically lacking support. They gave no other rationale for this theory and presented it as fact. That is sloppy science. Hell, that should be criminal science. It's thinking like that that 'proves' we have global warming and a zillion other Liberal idiocies.

When you corrected me the first time, I checked my facts, saw that I was wrong, acknowledged my error and moved on. You have now stunk up the place and instead of saying 'oops my bad' you are doubling down on your stupidity. Have at it. Keep being wrong as wrong can be. I will try to stay out of the way while you are demonstrating your prowess.


The author of the article actually makes the statement about the likelihood of Mars being inhabitable billions of years ago and he claims there is already convincing evidence of this. The researchers didn't make the claim, so it has nothing to do with their science. Sloppy writing maybe, but that's as far as you could go. It is a common view in the search for extraterrestrial life by Astrobiologists that you follow the water to find life. Water is looked at as an essential substance to sustain life because of its ability to absorb and release heat along with creating a stable environment for things within it. Whether you believe it or not it is already an established thought in science that finding flowing water makes finding an inhabitable environment very likely.


February 12th, 2014, 1:19 am
Profile
Lionbacker Rehab Guru
User avatar

Joined: January 26th, 2006, 9:08 pm
Posts: 1203
Post Re: Don't drink the water - on Mars!
rao wrote:
Sloppy writing maybe, but that's as far as you could go.
I can live with the summation of 'sloppy writing', so why all the insulting attitude. Why be mad at me when I note an article stunk up the place?

BTW, your last post was much more insightful than the article. Perhaps you should be writing for Forbes.

And, not to beat a pile of horse s--t, "...so much so that the planet was likely inhabitable billions of years ago." is not accurate. Improves the chances there was life on Mars would be closer, though that is like saying I bought a lottery ticket so it improved my chances of winning the lottery.

_________________
Climate Change - happening every second, of every minute of every day ever since the world was created. Needless to say it's man's fault.


February 12th, 2014, 8:59 am
Profile
NFL Veteran

Joined: November 28th, 2007, 12:50 pm
Posts: 1386
Location: Newport Beach, Ca
Post Re: Don't drink the water - on Mars!
TruckinMack wrote:
rao wrote:
Sloppy writing maybe, but that's as far as you could go.
I can live with the summation of 'sloppy writing', so why all the insulting attitude. Why be mad at me when I note an article stunk up the place?

BTW, your last post was much more insightful than the article. Perhaps you should be writing for Forbes.

And, not to beat a pile of horse s--t, "...so much so that the planet was likely inhabitable billions of years ago." is not accurate. Improves the chances there was life on Mars would be closer, though that is like saying I bought a lottery ticket so it improved my chances of winning the lottery.


I don't see a problem with the statement since it's so general. If just one tiny spot on the planet could sustain life it would technically make the planet inhabitable. I do think it's a bad way to say it, but it wouldn't be incorrect. The main thing I was trying to stress was that one statement really had nothing to do with the body of the article. Other than that one instance it gives a good explanation of what the researchers are actually doing.

Like I said in a previous post, I found your attack on the researchers with no explanation as to why they are sloppy to be incredibly rude. I don't feel I ever went beyond that, where as you started to hurl insult after insult. It's irrelevant to me though since we found some understanding and can move past it I'm sure. Also when don't these off topic boards get heated for no real reason.


February 12th, 2014, 12:28 pm
Profile
Lionbacker Rehab Guru
User avatar

Joined: January 26th, 2006, 9:08 pm
Posts: 1203
Post Re: Don't drink the water - on Mars!
rao wrote:
TruckinMack wrote:
rao wrote:
Sloppy writing maybe, but that's as far as you could go.
I can live with the summation of 'sloppy writing', so why all the insulting attitude. Why be mad at me when I note an article stunk up the place?

BTW, your last post was much more insightful than the article. Perhaps you should be writing for Forbes.

And, not to beat a pile of horse s--t, "...so much so that the planet was likely inhabitable billions of years ago." is not accurate. Improves the chances there was life on Mars would be closer, though that is like saying I bought a lottery ticket so it improved my chances of winning the lottery.


I don't see a problem with the statement since it's so general. If just one tiny spot on the planet could sustain life it would technically make the planet inhabitable. I do think it's a bad way to say it, but it wouldn't be incorrect. The main thing I was trying to stress was that one statement really had nothing to do with the body of the article. Other than that one instance it gives a good explanation of what the researchers are actually doing.

Like I said in a previous post, I found your attack on the researchers with no explanation as to why they are sloppy to be incredibly rude. I don't feel I ever went beyond that, where as you started to hurl insult after insult. It's irrelevant to me though since we found some understanding and can move past it I'm sure. Also when don't these off topic boards get heated for no real reason.
Got it. When you are wrong, you don't admit it. I'll remember that in future discussions.

_________________
Climate Change - happening every second, of every minute of every day ever since the world was created. Needless to say it's man's fault.


February 12th, 2014, 1:18 pm
Profile
Online
ST Coordinator – Danny Crossman
User avatar

Joined: March 30th, 2006, 12:48 am
Posts: 3824
Location: Davison Mi
Post Re: Don't drink the water - on Mars!
TruckinMack wrote:
rao wrote:
TruckinMack wrote:
rao wrote:
Sloppy writing maybe, but that's as far as you could go.
I can live with the summation of 'sloppy writing', so why all the insulting attitude. Why be mad at me when I note an article stunk up the place?

BTW, your last post was much more insightful than the article. Perhaps you should be writing for Forbes.

And, not to beat a pile of horse s--t, "...so much so that the planet was likely inhabitable billions of years ago." is not accurate. Improves the chances there was life on Mars would be closer, though that is like saying I bought a lottery ticket so it improved my chances of winning the lottery.


I don't see a problem with the statement since it's so general. If just one tiny spot on the planet could sustain life it would technically make the planet inhabitable. I do think it's a bad way to say it, but it wouldn't be incorrect. The main thing I was trying to stress was that one statement really had nothing to do with the body of the article. Other than that one instance it gives a good explanation of what the researchers are actually doing.

Like I said in a previous post, I found your attack on the researchers with no explanation as to why they are sloppy to be incredibly rude. I don't feel I ever went beyond that, where as you started to hurl insult after insult. It's irrelevant to me though since we found some understanding and can move past it I'm sure. Also when don't these off topic boards get heated for no real reason.
Got it. When you are wrong, you don't admit it. I'll remember that in future discussions.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
HOLY POT CALLING THE KETTLE BLACK!!!

HILARIOUS!!!

_________________
2013 Lionbacker Fantasy Football Champion


February 12th, 2014, 1:52 pm
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic   [ 17 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.
Designed by STSoftware.